Best Amps For the Sennheiser HD800 - 2017 Edition

Current setup: Gungnir Multibit > BW2 > HD800

Am I wasting a lot of potential using a USB source? What if I used optical out of my MacBook instead?

 

Try it and see. If it doesn't light the "buy better gear" light, it will probably be an improvement (due to lack of electrical noise from the USB connection). Do be aware that the optical out from Macbooks often leaves an awful lot to be desired though, so don't be shocked if the BBG light comes on.

 

Finally got around to quickly comparing Black Widow to a Liquid Carbon tonight... initial thoughts were that the Black Widow is a bit too warm/thick for my tastes. The Liquid Carbon felt much clearer. BW sounded a little syrupy. Stock HD800. Mainly tested using this track: Viices - Made In Heights, Spotify.

However, tried a few more tracks, and I felt certain other songs I preferred BW on.

More comparing needed when I get back to Austin, but it seems like I might need to reconsider amps. Stratus maybe?

 

Having listened to almost the exact same chain as you at @insidious meme 's place. My conclusion differs to yours. The liquid carbon sounded slower, hazy, and less defined.

 

If you liked the Liquid Carbon with the HD800 (I was kinda meh with the combo), then you need to do yourself a favor I try and find a Liquid Crimson to audition. I wish that amp wasn't discontinued.

But then again, the good Doctor is prototyping a bunch of new amps. And I believe Alex has a Liquid Crimson replacement in the cooker, and the rumors are flying around that it will be in the neighborhood of $1500...

 

From what I've heard is more of a "mini" than a "2" but time will tell.

 

I have have the HD800S along with the Bifrost Multibit and the Asgard 2. I think the Asgard 2 sounds very good with the HD800S. The Asgard 2 is a pretty smooth amp and I feel non fatiguing with the HD800S. I plan on upgrading to something better eventually but I can say that when I listen to the Asgard 2 with the HD800S I often am just amazed and wonder if upgrading even makes any sense. There are some recordings like Telarc Classical that have weaker strength signal with lower gain. On these type recordings I wish I had a little more power as worst case I need to turn the volume to about 2:00. However on most recording I have all the gain I could want and usually have volume well below 12:00. I can tell you that the Asgard 2 has a flatter soundstage compared to other amps I have heard. By flatter I mean that you sit closer to the stage. This was especially the case with the Bifrost Uber. However the Bifrost Multibit improved the soundstage quite a bit pushing things out further without loss of intimacy. Now even though the Asgard 2 makes you sit closer to the stage it does sound open giving you the ability to hear ambient cues of the room or hall. Since the HD800S has such a big soundstage the closer to the stage view of the Asgard 2 kind of balances itself out at least for me. If the Asgard 2 has a weakness with the HD800S is that is could have a some more power headroom with the HD800S. But this is not a show stopper however. I am concerned that I will spend many times more on an amp and not like it much better if at all vs. the Asgard 2.

 

Dragon Inspire IHA-1 is exceptional with HD800 and dynamics in general. It's a great little SET amp running one 6sn7 per channel.
I wouldn't recommend using planar headphones with it for lack of power. I also wouldn't recommend it unless you're willing to spend about $200 to buy non crap tubes.

 

As a jotuhnheim owner, Is the Vali 2 something I could use to test myself in regard to whether I can hear a big difference between amps? Without getting too sound-sciencey, I should be able to hear a pretty noticeable difference between a level matched Jotunheim and a Vali 2 with an HD800, right? I'm doing the Super dupont mod and want to see if I can really get the most out of the hd800. Also should I be hearing a difference between the Jotunheim and a LH Labs Go 2 Pro Infinity? I noticed the basic Geek out V2 on the list, but not this Infinity model, although I haven't experimented with its balanced output. On a casual level matched comparison I couldn't tell the difference, but I could try to do more of an ABX test on myself with an A/B switch and another person to administer it (although that person hates it when I ask them to do it, hahaha). Thanks in advance, enjoyed reading the thread.

 

If you are asking if the Vali2 is better for the hd800 than the Jot, then the short answer is yes. And it's fairly appreciable in the improvement. The 800 is an instrument that will reveal very subtle and not so subtle differences in your upstream gear.

If you are asking if you personally can hear those differences, that's only a question that you can answer. Being able to hear the subtle differences is typically a learned skill. Just because the differences are there doesn't mean that you've educated and trained yourself and ears to process them. There is a big difference between a $50 bottle of Pinot and a $100 bottle. But very few people would be able to tell the difference. They either don't have the palette for it and or don't have the education of experiencing expensive wine. Educated wine connoisseurs can tell you not only the exact iteration of grape but where the grape was grown.

My advice...get the hell out of the hobby while you can't hear much difference between the Jot and Vali2.

 

I asking more if there was another amp in the Vali's price range that would be as drastic an improvement with the HD800. the price of the Vali 2 makes it reasonable for me to find out, so I ordered one. It's obvious from reading the thread that the Valis is considered better than the Jotunheim with the HD800. If I can't hear a difference between a Jot and a Vali2 I will definitely, and happily stay out of the amplifier/DAC part of the hobby.

 

with the hd800, i couldnt live without bass boost.

Xbass on my Ifi pro ican and micro ican are always activated with the hd800. when I turn off the Xbass, i find the hd800 too clinical and boring, with bass boost they turn into quite a fun signature with incredible bass.

 

I would also encourage you to invest in an inexpensive balanced cable, like the ZY from Amazon, or order a cable from someplace like Ursine.audio. I've found a noticeable difference with the Jotunheim and HD600 with the balanced cable, where the amp is able to use push/pull to control the driver better. Bass is improved, as it the high-end, and head stage.

You'll notice at events like CanJam that Sennheiser demos all of their high-end headphones with their HDVD800 with balanced cables.

 

Just got my Vali 2. I level matched with my Jotunheim using a 1khz sine wave at 1 volt (+/- .001 volt) with the stock hd800 connected. I did some comparison on reference tracks and couldn't hear much difference, using an A/B switcher to go back and forth immediately. I had to double check a few times to make sure which amp I was using because it sounded about the same to me. I really tried to pick up on any kind of reduction in harshness or glare in the highs, and tried to see if cymbals felt smoother/less harsh with the Vali, but couldn't. Felt like one of those times at the optometrist where you're getting checked for glasses. They ask you if 4 or 5 is better and they have to go back and forth about half a dozen times before you end up saying "about the same". Not sure if I will go to the trouble of trying to a 30 trial blind test of myself.

So I guess I just have tin ears and can bow out of the amps/dacs aspect of the hobby. At least I know a $150 amp sounds as good as a $400 one to me. Really wanted to be able to hear a difference. Maybe I got one of the newer jotunheims that people are saying don't have as much glare?

Does anyone have specific tracks or files that might be "problem spots" for the hd800 that might highlight the differences more?

 

In my experience of comparing amps, with my ears (I'm not an expert in any means), I found that long term listening is more beneficial than doing quick A/B tests. Doing quick A/B tests is stressful to me as I'm too concentrated on turning on the right knobs and what's not...On the other hand, I listen to my Vali 2 with my HD800 a lot, and so when I switch to another amp like the Lyr 2, the difference is really obvious as I'm so used to the Vali's presentation. I also find it useful when I listen to songs that I'm really familiar with, so if there's even a tiny bit of difference in treble, it's easier to tell.

So... maybe give it more time?

 

@mcninja9 nails it pretty well. You get the the point where stuff is familiar enough that you notice somethign's off, or that the staging is wider, etc. Intense and protracted A/B sessions are mentally exhausting, and made me start to hate some pieces of music that I used for testing various things. Always remember that this is a hobby, we listen to relax and have fun.

 

I agree that longer listening sessions are way better for comparing things, unless the difference is striking (e.g. major tonality difference) and you want to quickly get your finger on exactly what's going on.

People like to point out how auditory memory is notoriously bad for humans, and therefore they conclude that we should try to fix this by quick switching to keep the memory as fresh as possible. But, why not take the alternate perspective? If you listen longer, then you build up a much stronger impression of how something sounds, and it will likely better stick inside your head for comparison as you listen to something else.

 

The ampsandsound Kenzie is just doing a tremendously good job with the hd800. Straight off the 600 ohm tap, the hd800 gets lit up nicely with stronger bass and smoother treble. The match is actually very good. Tube rolling is dirt cheap compared to all the other tube amps that I've owned. This combo puts a big Cheshire grin on my face every time that I plug it in. I have rarely been this happy with a gear purchase.