Could you help me choose new hps+amp/dac within buget-friendly limits?

Apparently I have no idea how to make this quote work (noob at forum formatting).
@Luckbad
Thanks a lot for suggesting me the setup! I tried looking for them but haven't seen any EU seller so far. Yeah, they seem like tubes for a far more reasonable price. After reading some more reviews, I am starting to think the HD650 are not quite for me. A lot of people have tagged them as slow (bass especially), with slightly thick sound on cheaper setups. After reading a few reviews about the HD700 they seem like just the right differences compared to HD650. Do you have any experience with them ? I think the problem with those would be that I need a warm amp which also offers clear sound to compensate for the treble spikes. Which seems quite unattainable in this price range, unfortunately. I've been thinking about the Lyr2 for them, but I don't know if the Lyr2 is a warm amp suited for them. To be honest I think I'd be in this situation even with anything from the Beyers' line, the easiest setup still seems to be going for the HD650s. The main thing that led me to these assumptions is that from the reviews I've read on headfonia, the HD650s seem to be quite close to my X1s in bass and mids. Not that refined, pleasant bass, not tight and so on. Now I know out of all of those the HD650 has the most scaling, but I don't think I'll ever get myself to spend a few thousands for a setup to take that potential out. It just seems to me that with a decent setup the HD650s won't make much of a difference compared to the X1s. Any thoughts on this ?

 

I think that the more you dig for HD650 opinions 8man, the more incompatible opinions you are going to find. Seems like reading has taken you as far as it can at this point. The 650s (and 600s) are some of the most ubiquitous headphones there are, so your best bet would be to go to a shop where you can hear them and decide for yourself.

 

If not the HD6x0, maybe the Philips X2 would be your best bet and wouldn't have to worry so much about amp/DAC. They are a definite improvement over the X1.

 

No one suggested the Koss KSC75 yet?

Come on, value for money can be super affordable.

 

The HD650. I bought my first one in 2007- the blackscreen version. Sold them and got a new silver screen pair from Thomann with 3 year warrenty. B-stock was 295 euros. I have played around with some amps and DACS (Benchmark, Audio-GD, Violectric,Hegel, ODAC/O2,ect.) Tryout the Asus Xonar STU for 299 for DAC/amp. Price is about 300 euros. You will be surprised. No, its not TOTL, but it plays well with the HD650. Its bigger brother the Xonar Essence One Muses does too although that costs a bit more. One thing to keep in mind is that they have a 10 ohm output impendance, so lower impendance headphones might get affected.

 

Since I've been in this hobby for a while I've come to the same conclusion as I saw purrin post in another thread. Spend the money on the headphone and amplifier and wait untill you can afford to spend at least $400 on a DAC. Having said that the Audio-gd NFB-15 is a good beginner system if you don't wanna spend big bucks on a system. If you however are planning to upgrade later down the road it's just gonna be a waste of money and you will be better off saving for a better DAC.

 

@8man

Just email Garage1217 if you're interested in their stuff. solderdude is based in the Netherlands and designs the bulk of the functional part of the amps, while Jeremy is the guy who runs the place, does some of the design, and builds them in Phoenix, Arizona. I'm pretty certain you can buy from them and have them built out in Europe.

Regarding the HD650 being slow, they aren't. People love to hate on the HD650 because it was always the king during the Sennheiser vs. Beyerdynamic vs. AKG wars back in the day.

When I got them, I settled on a Creative X-Fi Titanium HD -> Objective2 amplifier after trying a lot of inexpensive combos out. They sounded great. Then I kept upgrading my amp and dac and they've just gotten better.

They're not slow, dark, or veiled. They're a perfect combination of detailed and smooth, revealing and forgiving. Almost anything with more detail is fatiguing and hard to listen to for long periods. Almost anything that is smoother smears the details and leaves something to be desired.

The only headphone that I have more affinity for at the moment is the JVC HP-DX1000, but those aren't as versatile, detailed, or comfortable. They also cost more.

 

@Boops yeah, that would be the smartest move, the only problem is that the only shop which has them on display is like 600km away from me. Tough luck.

@Gravity To be honest, I've really given it some thinking. With these "value" pieces there always seem to be mixed opinions, I just find it so complicated that if you want to go for a good pair of hps, it won't work without adding in 3 times their value in properly driving them. And from my point of view, going for a far better amp than having to deal with a crap DAC does make much more sense.

@Luckbad that's good to know, coming from a proper HD650 owner ! Price-wise they're probably my only option at the moment if I want a decent amp.
Also that definitely picked up my attention, I'll probably email them and ask for some pricing. But before I do that, do those imply some soldering and DIY ? I definitely enjoyed technical lego when I was a kid, but soldering expensive parts is in a whole different league !

After some reflective thoughts I think my only choice has come down to looking for some second-hand gear, in a fair condition. I've also seen a few HD700 offers, even at 300 eur, which makes them a really interesting deal, but I'll refrain myself from jumping at it if I can't find a used amp with a warm signature for them. Back to the waiting game I guess.

Anyhow, really appreciate everyone's help, I will go ahead and claim all respect for the friendly people of this community !

Edit: I forgot to mention, yeah, I've really considered the X2s as well, it's just that they don't feel like a justified improvement compared to the former for now, since I'm looking to try a different sound. Overall it would be tempting, only if I could sell these, but it's not really a popular pair. Can't say they're not good for relaxing with chill music either.

 

Garage1217 offers diy if you want it, but they'll build it and give you a 5 year warranty if they do. I considered building one but the warranty is too good to pass up.

 

Sounds really good, any idea if they're a good alternative to the bottlehead crack ?

 

I'm in a similar situation to this and am wondering if the jotunheim changes the situation at all?

I have the HD700 which I got very cheap so am happy to sell and buy say a HD650 or HE400i or something.

Currently I'm using the USB powered HRT headstreamer which is quite a few years old now.
I'm not really sure what kind of an upgrade to sound a dac/amp will do and don't really have time to listen to other setups as I live in the country and have a new baby.

So to give you some background I bought the Beyer T51's a few years back and was completely blown away I loved the bass and how smooth vocals sounded. Previous to that I had the Shure 425s while I love how smooth they are they felt a bit uncomfortable and I really missed slam and sparkle.

I've also owned the Alexandro ms1 which I enjoyed but they got uncomfortable pretty quick and while they were great at things like rock didn't feel very smooth to me.

So then I get the HD700 and am like wow sound stage!
But treble.... I felt like my ears were ringing when I went to bed even when I didn't have the music turned up very loud.
So I EQ'ed them. And brought down the treble heaps and the bass up a bit.

Now I actually quite like them, they aren't the smoothest headphones around but EQ'd like that they seem to do pretty well at everything from EDM to classical. I know people dislike them quite but I got them so cheap that I figured I could sell them for the same price at least.

Anyways I just got some tax return and am thinking I should upgrade my dac/amp. The thing that sticks out to me is the noise when no music is playing.
I do really enjoy discovering that 'next' level in sound and going back over music and hearing details I've missed or getting an emotional response.

So... I maybe could afford the jotunheim with the dac module or maybe the modi multi and vali 2.
I'm the sort of person who likes to get a good base line product that will scale.

Also I can see myself selling the HD700s and getting something else.

Thanks!

 

@stormdrain , good day! A couple of suggestions- go to the New Members thread and introduce yourself, this place is small and generally friendly if people take the time to dig around and learn the culture - you'll see a thread for general advice that is active as opposed to this dormant one.

As far as your question, I do not own the Jotunheim, but so far, it has impressed a lot of folks here. By nature, it is designed to scale.
The HD700s do not get much love here, but @The Alchemist is a fan. I own a pair of HD650s and like many here, think they are amazing.
Have a good one!

 

@Wilson pretty sure I did introduce myself. Maybe I got the wrong thread?

Thats for that, the 650's are on special here for AU$375 so I'm very tempted.
The Jot is a lot of money for me at the moment but if the upgrade over the Modi Multibit/vali2 is worth it then I'd definitely spend the extra.

Thanks!

 

Nope, my bad - I see you introduced yourself.
Generally speaking, it's advisable to spend money in order of impact on sound, so headphones then amp then DAC then cables, etc.
Read this:

The consensus answer here would be Jot and HD650S, but why don't you repost in the General Advice thread and add more about what you listen to as well as a clearer idea about your budget. And, if there's a way to audition before you buy, that would be best.

 

Thanks mate, I'll ask on the general thread.