D-Sonic M3a 1200S class D stereo power amp loaner

Discussion in 'Closed Loaners' started by sphinxvc, Jun 2, 2017.

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  1. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    did this loaner begin?
     
  2. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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    Yes it did. @sphinxvc has had it for about a week. I'm sure we'll get some impressions from him soon and he can send it on to the next person.
     
  3. sphinxvc

    sphinxvc Gear Master (retired)

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    Yep, I've had it cooking for a few days. Will post some thoughts soon.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    Funny how much bigger the class d amp is compared to the AB amp!
     
  5. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    It's also 6 times more powerful.
     
  6. sphinxvc

    sphinxvc Gear Master (retired)

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    Here are my brief impressions of the D-Sonic M3a 1200S:

    Pros
    • Great bass control
    • Cohesive sound that never seems to sound strained
    • Good resolution in the upper frequencies
    Cons
    • Recessed midrange (picture a gentle U-shape tonal response)
    • Small sound staging
      • comparatively, the F3, Almarro A318B and Vidar sound bigger and have more presence in the room
    It was tested after a few days of warming up with my Devore Nines. Earlier this afternoon, it was tested after an hour and a half of warm up with @Dr. Higgs' Philharmonic 3s. Other ancillary gear of note: Freya, Yggdrasil, Eitr, a Nottingham Analogue Space Deck, and a VPI Classic Signature. Compared primarily with Vidar, a First Watt F3 and an Almarro A318B.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2017
  7. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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    Thanks for posting impressions! I've never heard the recessed midrange you describe myself on either of my units, but I think I know what you're referring to. For me it's more a lack of the midrange "lushness" some class A/B amps have that can draw your attention to the midrange, while the D-Sonic is almost pathologically neutral. I was A/B'ing my Vidar and M3-800S yesterday and noticed something similar, but after some extended listening I consider it to have more to do with the character of the sound vs a non-flat tonality.

    Regarding the small sound staging you noted, that one is really shocking as I've never heard anything close to that and I run a larger D-Sonic as my main amp these days (though it's constantly being swapped out). I am curious where you would rank it next to Vidar, as on my unit at home in the main listening room the stage is deeper/wider than anything I've listened to, including Vidar, Anthem A5, Parasound A3, Wyred4Sound etc, and matches one of the best tube/Class A designs I've got access to, the Raven Audio Silhouette Mk 2.
     
  8. sphinxvc

    sphinxvc Gear Master (retired)

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    This is on its way to @Daveheart as of this past weekend.
     
  9. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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    @Daveheart did you receive the amp? Any impressions?
     
  10. Daveheart

    Daveheart Friend

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    I received it and passed it on to @uncola . I had something written up that I thought I'd posted, but apparently it didn't post, and the draft is lost. Give me a few, and I'll try to recreate it.
     
  11. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    it's being delivered tomorrow, I'm excited
     
  12. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Add me to the list while I have Vidar on hand.
     
  13. Daveheart

    Daveheart Friend

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    I was able to compare this to an Adcom 5802 on a pair of Martin Logan Aerius i and against my AHB2 on my LS50s at home.

    Against the 5802 it clearly had better control over the bass, and it made it seem like the mid-bass might have a slight boost on the 5802. It was drier than the 5802, and I felt it was easier to pick out details on the 5802. That being said, all the same details were present; however, it just felt like maybe there was a touch of dynamic compression. I don't feel that the volume matching was that far off, but the 5802 did appear to present bigger swings.

    Comparing it to the AHB2 gave me the same sense of compression. There was also just a touch of smearing during more complex string passages on the D-Sonic. Texture and layering of different timbres seemed to be better on the AHB2 (strings sounding more like individual instruments rather than just part of the whole and the different tones during some live wall of sound Pink Floyd passages off of The Delicate Sound of Thunder).

    In short, I could probably beokay living with either a 5802 or the D-Sonic; however, the current street price of a 5802 is ~ half that of the D-Sonic. I'd gladly take the AHB2 over the D-Sonic, but the AHB2 is >$1000 more than this particular D-Sonic. I don't know that it truly changed my opinions about class D amps, but it was far better than any of the IcePower or earlier Hypex implementations I've heard in the past.


    It doesn't actually run that much cooler than the 5802 (though it's certainly more efficient); however, it's really seemed to only get hot on the bottom. If I were to purchase one, I'd probably set it up on taller footers to allow for better circulation underneath the amp.
     
  14. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    So I've been listening to the d-sonic m3 1200 since this morning.. comparing it to my digital amplifier company inline maraschino which are 140w class d monoblocks with big laptop style power supplies.. My expectations were that the custom switching mode power supplies might yield a blacker background and the 600 watt per channel-ness of the amp would provide bigger bass and dynamic punch in general.. but I found the bass was slower/less taut and the background didn't seem as black as my maraschinos.. in general the maraschinos provided more detail too. The d-sonic was definitely able to get super loud with no sign of strain and was good in general, I could definitely live with it. But I actually prefer my old amps. The bottom of the d-sonic gets pretty hot, surprisingly for class d. The chassis is nice and solid, steel with aluminum faceplate?
     
  15. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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    Just curious - are you running off the SE or balanced inputs? For me, it made a difference (not sure why).
     
  16. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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  17. sphinxvc

    sphinxvc Gear Master (retired)

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    No, but yes he's the last one.
     
  18. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    balanced inputs. I'll be mailing this to marv on tuesday!
     
  19. uncola

    uncola Friend

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    dsonic zooming off from hawaii to marv today, just got back from shipping it
     
  20. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    D-Sonic M3a 1200S impressions (and vs. Schiit Vidar).

    The D-Sonic M3a 1200S does nothing to change my opinion that Class D amps are insipid. In fact, I'm not really sure if the D-sonic is better than than the NuForce STA-9 (reviewed here:http://www.superbestaudiofriends.or...prime-sta-9-power-amplifier-mini-review.3932/). Hard to say because I did put the STA-9 against generally inferior competition (Crest CA-2, etc.) and didn't have the Vidar at that time. But generally, I find my memory to be pretty good about these things.

    Compared to the Schiit Vidar, the D-Sonic M3a 1200S has a little bit less bass and warmth, seemingly giving it greater clarity. However, after extended listening, and some back and forth, using different recordings, it becomes very obvious that the D-Sonic is veiled. It's as if someone put a light blanket over the speakers. And that's just the start. The D-Sonic doesn't get anywhere close to the Vidar in terms of bass tautness, texture, control, and sustain. It just sort of does this dull thud thing. But to be fair, bass reproduction is one of the Vidar's strong suits.

    Before I continue, I'd like to be clear that I'm not trying to say that the Vidar is great. The Vidar is pretty good and a bargain, but my reference is still my custom tube amp. In this case, it's more a matter of how lacking the D-Sonic is. And since quite a few people have the Vidar already, I think it's a good reference to compare to.

    On Suzanna Vega's self-titled album, the last track of the record, Neighborhood Girls, starts off pretty busy with a cachiphony of vocals, bass, guitars, and drums. The D-Sonic M3a 1200S utterly fails here. The reproduction of sounds from this track is a congested dull grey slurry of poop. On more sparse tracks like The Queen and the Solder, the attack of the strings and waverings of Vega's voice, which can be clearly heard on the Vidar, are blunted and compressed both upwards and downwards into almost a singular volume level. Textures, colors, timbres and pitches are reduced to 2-bit monotone. In SBAF speak, microdynamics, microdetail, and macrodynamics are severely lacking; the blackground is slightly grey.

    Finally, the soundstage is upfront (not necessarily a bad thing), but it's also closed and lacking in depth - almost impossibly claustrophobic for speakers. When did speakers start to stage like Audeze headphones in terms of staging? Width seems decent enough, but ambient cues which give hints to the boundaries of the venue and that sense of openness are missing - lost into a black hole.

    The usual caveats apply. YMMV. Yadda yadda yadda. I didn't use my super efficient front horns, but the 92-3db efficient Fostex BLHs instead. The dynamic compression and lack of microstuffs may likely not be as noticeable on less efficient or less resolving speakers. Saga was used as the preamp, and the TT was used as the source.

    IMG_20170913_203134.jpg

    In closing, Class D is just one of those oddities where people are going to hear things differently. The D-Sonic M3a 1200S seems to have plenty of power. It doesn't sound strained. There are definitely no solid-state treble nasties. But it's flat, boring, grey, unresolving, veiled, and congested. Not completely souless, but it's deficiencies are kind of hard to overlook.

    I nominate the D-Sonic M3a 1200S for the 2017 SBAF Leaky Warmbutt Award.

    Now taking questions.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
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