n3rdling HE90 Orpheus Clone loaner impressions

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by n3rdling, Dec 23, 2016.

  1. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Stop outsmarting yourself and just make them. Charge $2000 or more. In terms of resolution and separation, they are not in the same league as the HE90 or 009 - they are about 007 level. However, they are what I would consider the most neutral e-stat headphones ever made, and that counts for a lot. They are more tactile sounding than the STAX stuff, more along the lines of the Senn stats. This is something that would spark me to buy a modest STAX amp. I am positive that many others, who don't have e-stats headphones as their primary setups, would feel the same way.
     
  2. JonCharles

    JonCharles Friend

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    Let me just say that I would definitely go out of my way to purchase these, now that I have a humble e-stat setup at home. I've been hesitant on "upgrading" to a 007 or 009, but I would spring for these no questions asked. Congrats on creating an amazing headphone!
     
  3. knerian

    knerian Friend

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    I agree with Marv, in terms of having n3rdling just stop procrastinating and go in to production already. Although I disagree about the resolution/separation evaluation. I think Marv needs to get these in house (as opposed to just hearing them at meets) along with a good stat amp and 007 and 009 to compare, perhaps n3rdling could loan Marv the proper evaluation gear from his estat museum.
     
  4. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    All I can say is that I liked @n3rdling's cans a lot.

    And would love to see them in the wild.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2017
  5. sfoclt

    sfoclt Friend

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    You should price it at $6,001.
     
  6. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    $3 Millos. (Obviously kidding. Go for it. Kick some ass Milos)
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2017
  7. frenchbat

    frenchbat Almost "Made"

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    I wasn't aware the Milos Dollar was that valuable.
     
  8. Grahad2

    Grahad2 Red eyes from too much anime

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    [​IMG]New currency?
     
  9. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    I wanted to chime in as I had about an hour with the clones today. I compared them against the he90, he60 and to a lesser extent sr007 mki. First of all, I'm not ashamed to admit that I'm pretty sure that I crapped my pants when I hit the play button with the clone. It was one of those "wow" moments that you get frequently early on in this hobby and then very rarely after you've been in the game for several years.

    The clone produces a delicate, layered and completely engaging sound. They compete very well against the he90...VERY well. Admittedly they look like a piece of junk. But in fairness I think you can say that of most prototypes. The signature is fairly well balanced. The mids are gorgeous and pure in terms of tone. Vocals are lifelike for lack of a better term. I could hear deep chest resonance from baritone singers. Female vocals were equally impressive with great extension in the upper register, never sounding harsh or strident.

    But the bass was the jaw dropping event for me. So deep, and textured. Just wow, I don't really have the words to really describe how good the bass was portrayed.

    Overall, I preferred the he90. But there is real promise and potential in the clone. And it would be a crying shame not to make this headphone and share it's beauty.

    The amps used were t2, KGSShv Carbon. Well done sir, well. :bow:
     
  10. bigfatpaulie

    bigfatpaulie Tried to screw other friends while playing victim

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    Would you say they are in a similar wheelhouse as the HE60's then?
     
  11. frenchbat

    frenchbat Almost "Made"

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    No they're not. The he60 has that thing in the treble that can be really annoying, while the clone have none of that. Much more linear and well behaved.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
  12. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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    They share some similarities but he60's tonality is not as even than the clone's one. The he60 sounds brightish/coloured compared to the clone.
     
  13. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    HE60 is bright. It's kind of like a stock HD800 and HD600, but more HD600. Clone has none of this nonsense.
     
  14. Ali-Pacha

    Ali-Pacha Friend

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    Stop shitting on HE60 plz :(
    (Even if clones are better :oops: )

    Ali
     
  15. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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    He60's brightness is kinda weird. Sometimes very annoying and sometimes not at all. It's very recording dependent. It can be brighter than my hd800 for example but mids are fuller so the overall result is very different. I'm living with both headphones since 2015.

    The clone isn't bright at all. Nor dark. It's neutral.
     
  16. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    I think that the he60 sounds better on a good amp. Some of what's holding it back is the stock amp. Just needs to be modded to use a better amp.
     
  17. frenchbat

    frenchbat Almost "Made"

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    We used it on a bhse at the Paris meet. Still bright.
     
  18. bigfatpaulie

    bigfatpaulie Tried to screw other friends while playing victim

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    Haha! Okay! Okay! The Clone is better! The poor HE60... I like it. :(
     
  19. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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    I like it too. Very special sounding for some music and a very unique staging in my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
  20. JimL

    JimL Tongues KG's hairy starfish for fun

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    Let me inject a note of caution over what has been, until now, pretty much unanimous rave reviews. There are a number of issues to consider when bringing a product to market.


    1) consistency – it’s one thing for someone to make a one-off that sounds great. It’s another thing to make the same thing over and over again that is consistent from one to the next. In other words, quality control. If you are having others helping you make it, that means you have to train them to the same standard that you have. This is not a small issue. Quality control means measurements, and measurements means deciding how much variation is acceptable – the tighter your standards, the more rejections you are going to have. Way back in the day, it is said that Acoustic Research (AR, of the acoustic suspension speaker fame), used to trash up to a third of their drivers as not up to snuff.


    2) durability – this is partly a materials thing, but it is also a manufacturing thing. If you have seen pictures of Stax’s manufacturing facility, you will note that they build their headphones in a clean room, under hoods, to prevent dust from getting on the diaphragms or between the diaphragms and dust covers, and messing up your drivers over time. There’s a reason that Stax headphones made twenty, thirty or forty years ago still sound good. Then there are the two types of headphone listeners, those that have dropped their headphones, and those that have lied about dropping their headphones. Or accidentally ripped them off their heads. Or accidentally stepped on them. Or accidentally tripped over the cable. Sure, you can make something that nobody can break – but then it will be too heavy to be comfortable on your head. And remember, even a small number of returns for broken or defective product can eat up your profit margins very quickly.


    3) suppliers – let’s face it. There is nobody out there whose business depends solely on supplying materials and parts for a builder of headphones. That means that your materials and parts are dependent on the market for other uses of the same materials. For example, Stax has had several revisions of their headphone amps over the years simply because certain transistors became obsolete and had to be replaced with others. The issue is maintaining consistency despite changes in the underlying materials.


    4) market – it’s a given that at least half of the people who tell you that they will definitely buy your product will definitely NOT buy your product. Other than Stax, HiFiMan, Mr. Speakers, Kingsound, and maybe others are either coming in, or in the market. Perhaps Sennheiser will come out with a cheaper version of the HE-1, just as the HE60 was a downmarket version of the HE90. Electrostatic headphones are a niche market – the question is, how big a market is it? Stax is almost synonymous with electrostatic headphones. Sennheiser is one of the top headphone manufacturers in the world. HiFiMan and Mr. Speakers have an established reputation in the market from their other headphones. Sure, there’s the old argument that there’s always room at the top, but…


    All this is not to say that Milos shouldn’t bring his clones to market. Quite the contrary, I would love to see/hear them if and when they do come out. I might even considering buying them. But, as I said, just a note of caution.
     

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