The Stax I thread

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by knerian, Mar 28, 2016.

  1. manatworks

    manatworks Friend

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    @Rotijon
    hahaha, it seems that i might getting on Stax rig afterall , i still didn't make any move on new dac yet so i hope yggdrasil+727+L700 will catch my fancy...
     
  2. jacq

    jacq Top 3 poster - friend

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    @shipsupt @MuppetFace

    Thank you much for your replies. I totally forgot to check this thread but I will keep an eye on the SRM 717. Actually, I'm kicking myself because I could've easily bought one in Japan at the same place I got my SR007. My L700 turns 1 in February and I still haven't heard it from a decent STAX amp so I'm constantly hungry for impressions. I did find this for sale though I already bought a +/- 450V KGSSHV kit from Mjolnir-Audio and I think it's 30% into the build. What I worry about with that ad is that since he didn't list the missing parts, it may be parts that are hard to source. I have also asked Birgir about his opinion between the KGSSHV vs Carbon in powering the SR007 and he said the former can definitely do it. Ugh, I'm a bit overwhelmed with all these purchases since I have planned to trade my L700 for an LCD-4 + cash but @MuppetFace's impressions had made me think twice. Add in the whole tube nervosa I'm getting from the Studio purchase. Anyway, I've decided to just be patient with the DIY and keep using the SRD7 though I'm not so sure if I should sell the KGSSHV kit to get the Carbon. I would imagine the Carbon being a step up as @Rotijon had mentioned to me in PM though I have too many toys surrounding me right now.
     
  3. MuppetFace

    MuppetFace Sultana of Seafoam Green - Moderator

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  4. zolkis

    zolkis Acquaintance

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    These are the moments of joy in headphone listening :). I don't know how much it matters with a particular headphone, but there may be better seal with the earpads, a lucky shot of membranes or something else...but if I were you I'd buy that exact piece of L700... :)

    I have ultimately preferred my modded 007 Mk1 over the L700 (sounded fuller and smoother, and less "Lambda sounding"), and IME the 009 was better in all respects along the same sound character (the 007 has different character), but that particular L700 may have been a real hit.

    BTW I also prefer the L700 over the Utopia, but that's subjective: I like Stax more than other headphones.
     
  5. dark_energy

    dark_energy Friend

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    This has been posted third time now. This captures the hc hobbyist too accurately.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
  6. gepardcv

    gepardcv Almost "Made"

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    The Carbon only uses in-production parts. You will find everything you need at Mouser, Arrow, or Digi-Key except the LSK389, which should be in stock at Trendsetter. Its build difficulty relative to an on-board KGSSHV is in drilling and tapping external heatsinks. If you don't already know how to do it, you'll need a drill press and some proficiency with metalwork (a 45-minute introduction from a good machinist should be enough). With either build, make sure you understand how to safely mount uninsulated transistors onto heatsinks.

    There's always a risk in picking up a half-finished build. At the very least, I would review every solder joint with a magnifying glass and fix up any suspect ones.
     
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Consider the SRM-007tii or SRM-727II. The "STAX" mafia has traditionally shunned these amps, but I think they are pretty good and bring other things to the table. The complaint about the 727 was the elimination of a feedback loop that resulted in a looser, less controlled bass; but I also felt the 727 offered more liveliness and magic from the mids on up. In other words, the 717 and 727 do different things well. The "STAX mafia" likes to talk like STAX doesn't know what they are doing, but they do. It's just different from what the "STAX mafia" wants.

    The 007tii is way way overlooked. It doesn't have the super tight grip, control, and precision that the STAX mafia guys like, but it has a "musical" and involving presentation. Personally, I don't like the KGSS or KGSSHV. Technically it's great, tonally it works for both 007 and 009; but it's rather soulless sounding.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
  8. 3X0

    3X0 Friend

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    I agree with this sentiment. The Carbon was a bit better, but still sounded dry compared to the BHSE (which itself might be construed as soulless against the likes of the T2).

    I think @JimL's SRX-Plus design would be a serious contender as well. I listened to @sorrodje's only briefly but I think I'd take it over any KGSS/HV I've heard. I hope to see more of them in the wild.
     
  9. jacq

    jacq Top 3 poster - friend

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    If I were to get any of the stax amps it'd probably have to wait until March when my sister comes here from Asia. I only bought the headphone when I was in Japan but I was so floored as to how cheap STAX could be over there.

    Totally wish I had more time to hunt the junkshops for a unicorn T2 .
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    SR-X-plus and KGST would be other considerations.
     
  11. shipsupt

    shipsupt Admin

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    The STAX T2 is not an easy beast to own. They are known for failures as they age and repairs are a seriously tricky deal.
     
  12. MuppetFace

    MuppetFace Sultana of Seafoam Green - Moderator

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    I think the stock SRM-727 is a fine choice for the SR-009 (and L700), and Stax definitely knew what they were doing there, but for the elder SR-007 it sounds somewhat off to me: primarily in the bass, as has been stated. You need a lot of juice to tighten up the SR-007's rear end as it is, so it can sound a little loose on the SRM-717, let alone the stock SRM-727 which only heightens this with its own coloration.

    I don't think modifying the feedback loop will eliminate any of the SRM-727's good qualities: it is indeed a very good amp, and with a simple modification (for those who know what they're doing or have a distributor who knows what he / she is doing), I feel like it becomes the all-around best amp Stax has made. It'll likely have better resale value than a stock model too, if that's an important detail to you.

    For price of admission, I think a used SRM-717 is pretty hard to beat at around $1,000 to $1,200. Unless of course you can find a used SRM-727 for less. Honestly not sure how the used market is these days for said amps, what with more flippers running about these days.

    Oh, and the Stax tube amps are especially great for the Lambdas. They do a decent job with the SR-009 too. Again, I just wouldn't necessarily recommend them for driving an SR-007 unless you're in a pinch: just not enough oomph IMO.

    That being said, if you can find a Liquid Lightning MKII, that would be a great choice too. KG's personal beef with AC has resulted in some unfortunately mud slinging, and the Liquid Lightning has gained a negative reputation in some circles it does not deserve by any means. The solid state version of the MKII specifically would be a great option for both the SR-007 and L700. And because of all the drama, you'll likely find some amazing deals.

    PS. Stax is supposedly releasing a new flagship amp this summer, so you might wanna be on the lookout for older Stax amps coming up for sale on the used market as people are looking to upgrade.
     
  13. DrForBin

    DrForBin Friend

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    hello,

    has Cavalli Audio closed up shop?
     
  14. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    He's still around. I think Warren, the CEO of Cavalli Audio is afraid of us. Or maybe he is flake. Warren said he was going to show at our awesome meet back in November, but he cancelled at the last minute. Lots of people who were expecting Cavalli Audio to be there were super disappointed. I was looking forward to speaking with Alex too. Alex used to show up at all of the West Coast meets we organized.
     
  15. n3rdling

    n3rdling Friend

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    I'd stay away from the SRM-007tii, it doesn't really make sense to buy. You can get the same circuit in the vintage SRM-T1 amps for a fraction of the price. You can get an improved tube circuit from Stax themselves in the SRM-600, again for less than the SRM-007tii. If you want an even better tube amp and aren't afraid to venture outside of Stax, the KGST is considerably better. If you're willing to spend a bit more, the Woo GES is a good deal and the SR-X Plus is probably the current king in terms of bang for the buck. These should all sound very nice with just about any Lambda and good to very good with the SR-009. The SR-X Plus should easily be the best of the bunch for driving the SR-007.

    The Cavalli stuff is a touchy subject so I'll just say the LLmk2 version is much improved and is probably undervalued on the used market.

    If you're interested in SS amps there are even more choices. The SRM-717 and SRM-727 are awesome not just because they give good performance for the money, but they're also very functional and have a considerably smaller footprint than most of this other stuff.
     
  16. gepardcv

    gepardcv Almost "Made"

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    The original Stax T2 has terrible thermal management. Avoid. I'd be surprised if any that have seen substantial use still work. The DIY version is much better, though I think the case commonly used still doesn't have enough ventilation (and I'm pretty sure the heatsinks are a little inefficient because of their shape; plainer thinner vertical ones should have better dissipation). We'll see. I have most of the parts I need to build one, and I plan to make it quite resilient.

    Disagree. I spent some time with a LL and a LL2, and found both of them way, way too lush for a 007. With a Carbon, the 007 sings. With a LL of either stripe, it sounds like an Audeze headphone: dark and muddy. The LL sounds pretty nice with a 009, though.
     
  17. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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    If someone is interested by a srx+ , i know the builder who made mine has still parts for two other amplifiers. We compared the srx+ to a modded 727 a few days ago and the srx sounds better in every way.
     
  18. MuppetFace

    MuppetFace Sultana of Seafoam Green - Moderator

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    I agree that the original LL made the SR-007 sound dark. Muddy, no, but dark? Yes.

    The solid state LL2s I've heard are different sounding beasts than the LL1 and paired quite well with the SR-007 IMO. The tube version of the LL2 was better suited to the SR-009, more like the original LL but still superior in several technical respects.

    It's really a matter of perspective. For me, most KG designs sound too thin for the Lambdas and SR-009. Overtime it becomes fatiguing. I do own a BHSE however for the sake of driving the SR-007 and the Sigmas.
     
  19. Rotijon

    Rotijon Friend

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    Guess you need a megatron =)

    I'm a firm believer is good engineering, its not a matter of sound, but a matter of it being well engineered.

    The LL1 was rubbish in terms of engineering, no idea about the LL2.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2017
  20. zolkis

    zolkis Acquaintance

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    @Marvey
    I also think the 007t-ii is rather good, but it's also true it can be improved, both in technical and subjective terms - which is true for most Stax amps. A used 007t-ii is a good deal - however, I also agree that a good DIY build is even better, and I'd also use a KGST instead of the 007t-ii. For some reason I clearly prefer tube amps for Stax: BHSE, Aristaeus, Konka, modded 007t-ii/T1.

    I wouldn't call the KHSS[hv] soulless, but I find it absolutely refreshing when people challenge technically perfected designs by subjective evaluations. For some reason technical perfectness doesn't always bring optimal sound, but sometimes can sound rather "technical" indeed. Spectral with Magico comes to mind... also, I find the 009 more "technical sounding" than the 007, but the latter could be more technical. Midway would be so nice.

    I have recently discussed with a guy who departed from the Stax mafia mainstream and his Stax amp is just "good enough" in technical terms (slew rate etc), and his argument was that it is extremely unlikely someone would really listen to full power 20 kHz signals, so then he'd rather focus on making the rest of use cases more musical sounding while satisfying the stability and efficiency criteria. (Edit: I find it amusing that part of his income is from making measurement equipment...).
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2017

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