Massdrop JBL LSR30X 5" Active Studio Monitors

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by purr1n, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

    Pyrate BWC MZR
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    Yes, but the phase response corresponds to the FR. You can estimate the phase from the FR and get exactly the same results as the measured phase response.
    I meant the excess phase is 0, not the phase response. There will be some delay where bass rolls off and other stuff where the FR isn't perfect, but it all corresponds perfectly to the measured FR.
    Well, I meant disregarding the delay a headphone should be minimum phase. Most speakers with their crossovers aren't.

    Anyway, this isn't really part of the thread.
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
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    On room treatments:

    I don't disagree on room treatments. My angle is that thousands of Massdrop members are probably reading this right now. The last thing I want to tell people getting into high-fidelity is that they ***NEED*** to spend more. This hobby is already neurotic enough.

    As far as setup, this is what I would prioritize:

    1. Keep speakers away from back wall. Although it doesn't look like it in the photos, I've placed the speakers almost two feet away from the back wall. Considering I've already trimmed the bass down 2db, they really shouldn't be shoved closer to the back wall, unless you like "TOTL" Sony headphone sound.
    2. Elevate the speakers up from the desk. Yes, rubber feet are included, but do raise the speakers at least a few inches up to mitigate the early reflection from the top of the desk. I need to raise the speakers up a few more inches myself.
    3. Get rid of the computer monitor. Or put a panel over it. Flat surfaces non treated surfaces right between speakers is bad. Oh wait, we can't.
    4. For panels, highest priority should be the wall behind the speakers to absorb the most early reflections.
    5. Since we are nearfield, no side wall panels should be necessary. Unless you are in a bathroom, or really want to go all out and appear super weird to girls and never get laid.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2017
  3. SSL

    SSL Friend

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    Isn't this mostly going to be boundary interference and too low in frequency for things like panels or pillows to affect?
     
  4. philipmorgan

    philipmorgan Member of the month

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    That seems to be the unstated design goal of a lot of hifi equipment :)
     
  5. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    You'll still mitigate the lower to middle mids bouncing back. Thick panels. A few inches from the wall. Ah, f**k it. Too much work. Just listen to shit.
     
  6. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    I tried this before @Serious. A headphone in general is definitively not minimum phase. And several headphones do exhibit discontinuities in the passband.

    I just bring this up because I've seen many folks talk about what they are hearing, and assign it to minimum phase this, minimum phase that. Might as well get the idea straight. Minimum phase is defined by the location of the headphone's zeros. It maybe a useful concept in equalization, because poles cancel zeros, and if all the zeros are inside the unit circle, then one could align the poles of the equalizer with the zeros, cancel them and still have a stable system. Unfortunately, not all the zeros of a headphone are inside the unit circle. And pole/zero cancellation equalization IMO is a dangerous proposition anyway. Furthermore, minimum phase also means minimum delay. Some applications might find that concept useful. But when talking about what one is hearing, I think the term can be over-used, or applied incorrectly.

    Other things I could say about minimum phase is that between linear phase and minimum phase, I suggest to pick linear phase. Minimum phase does impose some linear distortion to the waveforms. Not necessarily severe. But it does.

    I could do some analysis on the impulse response of my MR speakers. But it's somewhat pointless. Looking at the phase response of the JBL monitors, I can't really fault it much. Like I said, it looks like the integration of the drivers is very good IMO.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2017
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Heh. Why do think I'm always trying to tell you guys to NOT upgrade or buy the cheap stuff? This is hobby is not healthy. A few members have already imploded from it. It's sad when this happens.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    @ultrabike: send me address, phone, e-mail again. I need to send the Affordable Accuracy Monitors to you.
     
  9. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    We have a ton of LSR305s (the non-Massdrop version), which you can sometimes find for $99 each. That's an amazing value, as they are fantastic-sounding little speakers. We also have a grab-bag of similar products from Emotiva and Equator.

    However, all of the above speakers have an issue that may irritate some people working with them in close quarters and in quiet environment: hiss. I use a pair of these monitors on my desk, and I have to keep them turned off unless I'm listening to them, otherwise the hiss would drive me insane. Note this is about 4' away, in a quiet room. The Equators weren't too bad when new, but got noisy over time. The JBLs are noisy from the get-go. Changing the sensitivity does not change the noise. Changing source does not change the noise. Changing cables does not change the noise (in other words, I've done basic troubleshooting.)

    What I'd love to have is a measurement of self-noise for various small monitors. If the Mackies suggested by Ultrabike are better, I'd love to hear them. But it's impossible to find the ones with lowest self-noise, because there's no measurement for this. And, it's likely one measurement that would be difficult to do in the absence of an anechoic bunker.

    TL;DR: LSR305s are an amazing value, but if you're using them up close, beware the hiss.
     
  10. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Done :)
     
  11. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    I don't think I had that problem with the MR speakers. Will double check.

    EDIT: I did read about this problem with the LSR30x line somewhere before too. Forgot all about it. When I heard them @Guitar Center the response was great. But Guitar Center is not the quietest of places.
     
  12. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    I think most studio monitors hiss since the amp is running full blast all the time. I have tried several, some are worse then others. My Questeds are quiet after about 30cm, genelec 8040 was about the same but my old Focal Solo6's were hearable at 2-3m.

    Listen before you buy.
     
  13. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

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    I don't have problems with the Airmotiv 4.
    The Solo6 aren't that loud either...

    Things might be worse in an (electrically noisy) industrial environment?
     
  14. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    For me the Solo's were worst when the tweeters were at ear level and pointed directly at the sweet spot. Like they recommend for near field. Bought mine almost 10 years ago though, perhaps later ones are quieter.
     
  15. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Could be awesome. Not anechoic, of course, that would probably induce insanity, and would probably sound subjectively horrible too. But some of the absorption/diffusion materials available are quite groovy. I could live with a room decorated... ahem, treated, like that. Mind you, I probably could not dust it: Jocavi

    Too much work and also far too expensive. I'm fine with just listen to shit. Never had a treated room, probably never will. But I confess that the idea appeals.

    I could probably live with that, as I tend to keep gear turned off when not in use. Have heard this of a number of smaller, as in the kind we ordinary non-pro folk are likely to have our ears near to, monitors. Thanks, though. Forewarned is fore-not-disapointed. These stay on my maybe list :)
     
  16. New Reformation

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    Any thoughts on how they compare to the PreSonus Eris E5's?

    I have a pair of E5's and, despite them being less popular online, I have been super satisfied. My wife had one look at the original 305's and took an immediate disliking to their bulky PA aesthetics. I agreed with her and think that this revision represents a classy upgrade to the style of the speaker. With all things being equal, I wonder just how much those waveguides really factor into the value of the speaker...
     
  17. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I wouldn't worry about it. Probably more a matter of different. The E5s have a small waveguide for the tweeter and more adjustability. Class AB instead of class D amp too, which is usually a plus in my book. The E5 actually looks super interesting. Maybe get them in for evaluation or loaner.
     
  18. StandUp713

    StandUp713 Friend

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    I have been using the LSR305 with the LSR310S for 1.5 years now. Very happy with the value and porformance of this set up.....upgrade-itus has not set in(yet).
     
  19. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I will examine the extent of the hiss.

    For the record, I tend not to be bothered by hiss. I will say that I didn't notice any two nights ago, even during the quiet scenes of that movie where Khan Noonian Cumberbitch and Apeshit-Spock beat the living heck out of each other. I actually sought to see if I could hear any at the listening position when I first set them up.

    I quickly checked this morning and did notice a hiss with my ear up to the tweeter, but once I moved one feet away, I really couldn't hear it. This hiss seems pretty normal to me like most speakers with moderate gain amps. The difference of course is that we are three to four feet away instead of eight to ten. I would not say that my setup is super isolated though. It's my in garage, so I hear environmental noise such as crickets at night and the water heater at times in the morning.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2017
  20. Fearless1

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    You are like me, the slightest hiss or hum in any capacity drives me mad.
     

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