EC Aficionado (was: The Studio Jr.)

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by AppleheadMay, Nov 10, 2015.

  1. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    Wak me up when they reissue 396As and 2A3s.
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I've got a stash of WE396A. As promised earlier, will measure to match the gain of the triodes and by distortion in the amp. Will price reasonably for my time and according to quality/rarity. Only to Af or worthy users. Will NOT sell these to people who plan on using them on Vali 2, Mjolnir 2, Garage, Chi-Fi, etc. Doing stuff like that makes me sad.
     
  3. BillOhio

    BillOhio Friend

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    I've got half a dozen I'm not using. Also not using my Af.
     
  4. pavi

    pavi Almost "Made"

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    i must say the pairing of the utopia with the 300b ec aficionado works wonderfully well. the soundstage is comfortable - certainly not like the 800s, but perfectly acceptable - and the bass has genuine presence - again, not like the abyss phi, but quite good.

    the overall synergy is sweet.
     
  5. jexby

    jexby Posole Prince

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    did I miss reading a recommended pair of 300Bs for the EC Af ?
    please advise.
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Remove legs and drop the bottom plate. You will need a DMM (or gear) that can measure the Vrms of a 40-50kHz signal. There is a little trim adjust on the HF frequency module. Attach alligator clips from heater pins of output socket to DMM. Lay amp on its side and turn on with 300B tubes. Turn up trim until DMM says 5V from 2.5V. 300Bs run at 5V, 2A3 runs at 2.5V. Wear long sleeved shirt and keep one hand in pocket while turning trim. If you want to play it safe, turn off power supply and let amp drain itself of power, and then make the adjustments. Shouldn't need to turn too much as the 5V is less demanding of current. Voila 300B Af. Ask Ravi to do this.
     
  7. Jokerman7

    Jokerman7 New

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    Don't own the amp but I think it is better to disconnect the B+ (HV supply) first before trimming. After a satisfying voltage level is reached, connect the B+ again and turn on the amp for a little while, then fine tune. That will be how I would do it.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Yeah, probably a better idea because the trim is close to one of the output tube's pins. I'm used to working on these things being fully powered on, so I forget.

    Best to disconnect B+ at the PS chassis. I can't remember, but there might be connector that can easily be removed. The PS chassis opens from the top, unlike the main chassis that opens from the bottom.

    Since I am now providing more specific advice, I will conclude with the disclaimer that anyone attempting this can get injured or die.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  9. penguins

    penguins Friend, formerly known as fp627

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    Any updates on a direct EC Af and Studio Jr. comparison?
     
  10. Thenewerguy009

    Thenewerguy009 Friend

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    Speaking of which, I noticed it that the Jr. is being offered in 2A3 or 300B versions, so it's no longer a 300B exclusive?

    Also will it have the feedback & no feedback options like with the new Aficionado amps?



     
  11. cskippy

    cskippy Creamy warmpoo

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    Interesting thing to note: according to the specs there are TWO unbalanced inputs but there is no mention of balanced input.
     
  12. EagleWings

    EagleWings Friend

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    Yep, you can choose either the 2A3 or the 300B. I believe this is just like the AF, where in you can buy the 2A3 version, and convert it to run the 300Bs. In this link below Marv explains how it is done on the AF.

    https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...ado-was-the-studio-jr.511/page-50#post-240105

    (oops, didn’t realize this post was just a few posts above on this very same page)

    By default, it comes with feedback, but can be requested with no feedback.

    https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...ado-was-the-studio-jr.511/page-48#post-227188

    Nice catch. I assumed the flip switch on the front, was to choose between SE and Bal inputs. But it looks like it is to choose the output.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019
  13. TwoEars

    TwoEars Friend

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    Balanced inputs generally do nothing for a tube amp. At best it's a transformer coupled to make it single ended internally, at worst half the connector pins aren't even connected... (EC wouldn't do this but some chi-fi amps might)

    You'd have to have something like the Little Dot fully balanced tube amp for balanced inputs to be worth it, but that money is nearly always better spent building a better single ended tube amp in the first place.
     
  14. kevnin

    kevnin #facetweeting - Friend

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    It's not really about the amp, it's about the dac. Balanced input allows you to use the balanced output of your Gungnir Multibit/Yggdrasil without having to go through an external transformer box.
     
  15. TwoEars

    TwoEars Friend

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    @kevnin This is true for some people who know exactly what they're doing and why, but more typically (probably +95% of cases) it's newcomers to high-end audio who's gotten it into their heads that balanced must be better and thus constantly ask designers of perfectly fine single ended tube amps to add balanced inputs. Donald North is one such example and he's constantly having to explain why the Stratus and Stellaris don't come with balanced inputs as standard, he even has a disclaimer about it on his website.

    I'd also make the argument that if you have enough money for a Aficionado/Stratus/Stellaris then you should look for a source with superior single ended outputs to pair it with rather than introduce a transformer into the chain just because you want to use the balanced source outputs.

    There will be a few outlier cases where grey haired audiophiles with +20 years experience will couple balanced outs to single ended inputs over a transformer on purpose to achieve a specific coloration that they want... but this is not the norm and it shouldn't be regarded as good standard practice.

    (I also hope you're aware that the external transformer box you speak of is in exactly the same place in the chain, it's just hidden away inside the big amp on a SE tube amp with balanced inputs. Maybe you know this, maybe you don't. Hard to tell from your post.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019
  16. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    I like the balanced inputs because it let's me work around the somewhat low gain on the Af.

    I'm not sure I would like it as much if that wasn't an option.

    Let alone that both of the DACs I would consider atm - Yggdrasil and Convert-2 - do better with balanced outs, or have no choice at all about the matter; I would absolutely choose to run input transformers with those DACs and the junior.
     
  17. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    That would be funny if Schiit one day optimized for the the SE outputs instead of balanced outputs. BTW, some DACs do sound better from the SE outputs than the balanced outputs.
     
  18. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Why wouldn't this be good practice if one happened to want to use a Convert-2 or Solaris as the source? Or the balanced outputs of the Schiit DACs for better quality sound? A good transformer box can be purchased for $300 or DIY'd for $120. This is significantly less than a typical ChiFi USB to SPDIF converter. It's not really a matter of DAC with better SE outputs. It's more a matter of being able to use a DAC that happens to have unique sonic signature that suites once tastes. Why should a customer be told "you are shit outta luck if they happened to like the Convert-2 or Solaris - you have enough money - buy another DAC?" It is more this reason that I've convinced Craig to include the balanced input (transformers). At this level, higher-end customers are going to want options for input. Although the subject has been broached about keeping the amp simple and providing an external iso box.

    There's this notion that transformers drastically color the sound like an effects box (probably due to Psalm talking out of this ass) but good ones don't. I wouldn't be using them if they did. In the case of the the Schiit DACs (Yggdrasil and Gungnir), this is what happens:

    Code:
    Schiit Yggdrasil output
    
    [DAC chip out BAL] ---> [BAL buffer circuit] ----------------> [BAL inputs]
                                 |                            |
                                 |                            |
                                 |                            |----[Iso xformer]
                                 |                                      |
                                 |                                      |
                                 |                                      V
                                 |------ [SE sum circuit] -------> [SE inputs]
    
    What the transformers do is replace the SE summing circuit (an active circuit), with iso transformers (passive circuit). While the merits of passive vs. active circuits have been debated before the end of time, none of this is strange nor bad practice. In a time before the proliferation of opamps, this was normal practice in studios. Heck, audiophiles replace their active preamps with expensive passive pots, steppers, and AVC/TVCs.

    P.S. It's perfectly fine to use the SE outputs of the Schiit DACs. They do sound very good and most people wouldn't even notice the difference.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019
  19. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I'll get back to you guys on this. I have this in the house as there are some noise and buzzing issues which I am helping to troubleshoot.
     
  20. TwoEars

    TwoEars Friend

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    @purr1n

    Maybe I'm just a minimalist, I'd probably prefer to use a source which was primarily geared towards SE outputs. But I see yours and Taverious points about the Schiit DACs. I guess if you want to use an Yggdrasil DAC with a tube amp a transformer box might be your best option (or at least equally good). But at least it shouldn't matter if the box was inside the amp or you got a good quality external one, there's not much point asking for balanced inputs from the amp manufacturer really. You might as well get the box.

    Maybe I came across a little bit more obnoxious than I intended, I'm clearly speaking with experts here so whatever you're up to is probably well reasoned. I was more trying to drive home the point that in general SE outputs and inputs should be the best default way to go for tube amps since that's how 99.9% of tube amps are setup to work internally.

    If you're building a system from scratch it might also be a matter of cost. Sometimes a high-end balanced DAC will be twice the price of an equally good single ended one. Some people will then go for the balanced DAC as a source for their tube system since they've been taught that balanced is better. My message is simply, unless you know exactly why you're doing that don't do that. Go for the really good single ended one.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019

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