ZMF Verite Closed

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by Vtory, Jul 21, 2019.

  1. zach915m

    zach915m MOT: ZMF Headphones

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    To my ears the ironwood/hardwoods sound less open than the Monkeypod and softer woods due to there being less reverb/decay, and the mids are a little more up front for the same reason.

    I can't remember what wood you have though so...?
     
  2. DEATHxMACHINE

    DEATHxMACHINE Friend

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    @zach915m Yeah, I should have mentioned it was ironwood. The harder wood does have a good degree of impact in combination with the beryllium drivers. I was expecting less openness due to the nature of harder woods not absorbing the sound as much as the softer (monkeypod) wood. Just was not expecting to be as significant as it is. I am surprised by its intensity.
     
  3. pure5152

    pure5152 Friend

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    I also didn't find the VC that open-sounding at first, but after a couple hundred hours of burn-in my impressions changed and I noticed the bass tightened and the midrange opened up, and the VC started sounding more open overall as a result. YMMV.

    Edit: Out of curiosity, how long have you had your ironwood VC for, and how many hours would you say you have on it? Just want to get more data points to see if I'm the only one experiencing this change with burn-in.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  4. crenca

    crenca Friend

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    My opinion is that the VC (I have Monkeypod) has this small/medium hall effect and bounded "openness", perhaps like nice jazz or acoustic venue, at least with the right upstream gear (e.g. the Gun MB > BW2 that I usually use). It has this limit and natural border = not "open" exactly like an open back HD6xx, but combined with the VC's uncanny imaging/separation and other technical abilities it is more realistic (I know, problematic word) then the Sennheisers or even the Focal Clear, at least out of the BW2. It has more front to back stage than either fur sur. The Eikon (I have the osage wood I believe - harder than the standard) give a taste of this, but nothing like the VC.

    Now, when I plug the VC into a lessor chain (e.g. this JDS labs C5D dac/amp I sometimes use travelling or in bed) the stage mostly collapses, and the VC reveals the limitations of the cheap AKM chip and TI op amp upstream, whereas the Eikon and and HD6xx sound more like themselves, so the VC seems to scale more...
     
  5. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    Never thought it would happen but I've had to take off the strap and install a ZMF Pilot Pad.

    On the other hand now its my everyday headphone too so my neck is getting a workout - I wonder if it'll help with my MAWG double chin :oops:
     
  6. Thomas Wolf

    Thomas Wolf New

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    Are all 4 pins wired on the mini xlr, or just 2?

    [​IMG]
     
  7. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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    Seems like this would be a great question to got to ZMF directly about ([email protected]) versus posting some random FAQ here.

    Actually, in a few seconds of looking at the ZMF website I was able to find their FAQ and what do you know Zach and team answer your question!

    "All proprietary ZMFs use the "Tiny" 4 pin female XLR jacks. The jack is also commonly used on many Audeze headphones. The pins we use are 1 for + and 3 for -. So make sure if you are having a custom cable made by another company that it utilizes that pin-out."
    (https://www.zmfheadphones.com/zmf-guide)

    Also, please be a good Rando and follow the instructions at the top of each page and introduce yourself, and then do some basic research before junking up the threads with questions whose answers are easily found in obvious places. Cheers
     
  8. Aeron

    Aeron Facebook Friend

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    I find the VC to combine much of the speed of the Utopia, with the great tone (but improved across the audio spectrum ) of the HD650, the staging is much better with the VC (a magic trick by Zach). Though I prefer the VO with symphonic music (the VC with everything else).
     
  9. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    Been using a suede strap from zach for the past week, I'll give it a few more days and try a pilot pad again - the thicker strap is good but Ironwood Ltd is so chonky the pilot pad might well just win out.

    YMMV, I'm gaming in the VC because why use a worse headphone?

    And as a result its on my head for like, 14hrs a day on the weekend. Imma have a neck like stallone by the time the year is out.

    If you're only wearing these for an hour or two suede strap might be enough, but leather strap on the VC is immediately painful for me - the one time I soldiered through it my klingon head ridge hurt for like 4 days.

    Universe -> Auteur -> Universe Hybrid pads so far. Brain burn-in?*

    On the VO the Be2 pads are the only ones that feel "right" no matter how much I listen to it, but something different is happening here.

    I'll try going to straight U pads and see how the grey goo likes it.

    * could also be actual burn-in, I skipped the 300hr stand procedure and decided to just game in it for a that much before I sit down with my crit playlist, so that's coming up in a week or three.
     
  10. edd

    edd Almost "Made"

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    Monkeypod VCs are the heaviest ZMFs I’ve used but I haven’t had any comfort issues. Have you tried bending the headband to have a slight point at the top?
     
  11. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    This is my 6th ZMF. :p

    Believe me, its pointy as can be.
     
  12. Ksaurav402

    Ksaurav402 Friend

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    Ironwood is way heavier then Monkeypod. I guess Ironwood weighs close to 650g
     
  13. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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    Ironwood's aren't all that heavy, although they are about 100g more than the standard VCs. My LCD-3's are 635g while my Verite C LTD (Ironwood) are "only" 570g.

    However, the VCs are much more comfortable than the LCDs IMHO
     
  14. Ksaurav402

    Ksaurav402 Friend

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    Oh only 570, I checked with wires and got around 635. I will check again.
     
  15. pure5152

    pure5152 Friend

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    Super pedantic, but keep in mind that according to the wood database, "wood density can vary by an average of plus or minus 10% between samples (called the coefficient of variation)". So we should expect some differences in weight, and mscott's vc weight of 570g and ksaurav's weight of 635g are both within that 10% of variation we might expect to see.

    FWIW I went ahead and weighed my verite closed with pilot pad and got 677g. Despite that weight, I find them extremely comfortable, in part because of the pilot pad, and in part because the extra weight helps them clamp and fit my head better than I found my lighter-weight pheasantwood VO doing. This requires the headphones to be perfectly balanced on my head, however; if they're slightly off, I find my neck feeling strained after half an hour or so.
     
  16. tusing

    tusing New

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    ZMF Verite Closed Review

    [​IMG]
    ZMF Verite Closed - Sennheiser HD800S - ZMF Salire Bocote
    Cables by ZMF and Norne


    Overview
    The Verite Closed is Zach's latest creation - a TOTL hand-crafted closed-back designed to be competitive with the best closed-backs on the market today.

    As with all ZMF headphones, craftsmanship is second to none. The headphone consists of carefully sanded and waxed wooden cups, supported by a strong but lightweight magnesium chassis, and lined with luxurious soft leather. At the heart of it all lies a Beryllium-coated driver, a material found in some of the most detailed headphones available today.

    Despite the handmade operation and heirloom aesthetic, there is a priority on keeping unit variance low. ZMF CNCs each cup and measures each unit before sending it to the customer.

    ZMF headphones are known far and wide to take well to pad swapping. Pad swapping can significantly alter sound to let each individual better dial in what they're looking for.

    I spent just over a week writing this review, collecting my impressions on-and-off and re-writing sections a few times. I tried to be as honest as possible and avoid letting new-toy-syndrome color my impressions.

    My Verite Closed is in Monkeypod wood and retails for $2500.

    Comfort and Isolation
    [​IMG]
    Handcrafted leather and wood make for a luxurious feel.

    The VCs are comfortable. The pads are smooth and soft. There is a fantastic adjustment system that allows you to easily adjust clamp force and other factors to get as comfortable of a fit as possible. I didn't find glasses to affect sound as I would on other closed-backs.

    If you aren't used to closed-backs they can feel a bit too warm the first few times you put them on. In terms of weight, I don't think I could personally go for anything heavier than Monkeypod.

    I often find closed-backs claustrophobic - but I didn't get this feeling with the VCs.

    The VCs isolate very well in terms of preventing playing music from escaping the cups. Despite the fact that I listen to music relatively loudly, my friends were unable to hear the music from even just a few feet away. I'd be comfortable using this in a cubicle-based office environment.

    Isolation in the other direction (preventing noise from the outside reaching the cups) is on par with the average non-ANC closed back, and a non-issue when music is playing.

    Sound

    [​IMG]
    The RME ADI-2 provides a neutral view into the VC's sound.

    The Verite Closed can be summarized as an energetic, engaging headphone with an unconventional signature and brilliant technicalities across the board.

    I used an RME ADI-2 DAC fs for the purposes of this review.

    Signature

    [​IMG]

    The Verite Closed has a fundamentally unique signature. Regardless of the pads, upper-mids and sometimes treble are accentuated and which generally adds some energy to the signature. As such, the VCs are not a "sit back and relax" headphone. If you are not prepared for the influx of information, you will feel fatigue. But when you are, the VC engages you in music quite unlike anything else I've ever heard.

    Let's use an analogy. Listening to the HD800S is like gazing at a supremely detailed painting. You can see all of it but your mind will never comprehend all of it at once, though the vast amount of detail itself is presented effortlessly and ripe for inspection. Looking at a painting is not something that engages you - it takes your interest, perhaps even your awe, but from a distance, and in sort of an academic manner.

    The Verite Closed utilizes its characteristic signature to surface detail in quite a different manner. It's like watching an intense action scene. If you don't pay attention you'll lose your place. But if you are alert throughout, it's far more visceral and thrilling of an experience than staring at a painting. Sure, both a painting and action scene may present detail to your mind, but the latter would be more emotional and engaging.

    I found sub-bass lacking, but was able to fix this with a bass shelf in EQ (+7dB, 50Hz, Q=0.8 brings it out quite nicely). There is a slight metallic timbre - I think in terms of natural timbre, the Auteur and Aeolus beat the VC. I feel the FR is purposeful and creates more engagement, but you should try before you buy. Do give them more time than usual when you try them, as it may take time to click.

    Detail and imaging

    [​IMG]
    Verite drivers are 20% Beryllium by weight. This no doubt contributes to the technicalities.

    [​IMG]

    The VC is fast. It is as quick and detailed as the HD800S if not more so. I was clearly hearing details my HD800S did not surface. It tickled my ears. These are the best technicalities I've seen come out of ZMF, and probably my favorite aspect of the VC. Attacks are sharp and immediate. The speed of the VC is amazing no matter how you slice it. Cymbals, snare drums, plucks of a guitar, slight vibrations of a cello - all of these are clear, which is something I cannot say for most headphones I've tried.

    The ZMFs have an airy presentation for being a closed-back. Soundstage is pad-dependent but wide as an average open-back with the Auteur pads. This is very impressive for a closed back! Imaging is fantastic no matter which pads you use. Instrument positions are always clear and easily delineated.

    I was not expecting technicalities at this level in a closed back. This isn't only "impressive for a closed back", it's impressive, period.

    Pad comparison
    Let's compare how pads affect both signature and technicalities. Reference the tables above while reading this.

    Auteur solid pads
    • Widens the stage significantly
    • Recesses mids a bit, adds energy to upper mids
    • Very engaging but more fatiguing
    The Auteur pads are the default pads installed on the VC. They are larger and more comfortable. They provide a fantastic sense of stage I never thought possible from a closed back. On certain tracks the Auteur pads might feel too shouty - occasionally it was hard to strike a volume balance between slightly-recessed mids and accentuated upper mids. I think I've adjusted, though, and I'm enjoying these pads the most. These are the fastest, most detailed, most engaging pads in the west!

    Universe solid pads
    • Closer staging but better 3D imaging
    • Upper mids are tamed, treble slightly accentuated
    • Engaging, less fatiguing
    I never really understood the term "3D imaging" until I put on the Universe solid pads. Vocalists and instruments are closely packed around your ears and yet you can separate them in space easily. I found the Universe less fatiguing - they reign in some of the upper-mids and bring the mids a bit more forward for a more balanced midrange overall. This is at the expense of soundstage and some comfort. Treble-heavy tracks can still get a bit fatiguing over time.

    Auteur hybrid pads
    • Most comfortable pads
    • Pros: Not as sharp
    • Cons: Not as sharp
    The Auteur hybrid pads have a suede face and leather walls. They are basically more comfortable versions of the Auteur solids with peaks slightly tamed for a less fatiguing listening experience. As a consequence, they have a bit less air and a bit less detail retrieval and slightly less defined bass than the solid Auteur pads. I think most people will prefer these pads and they strike a very good balance between all pads.

    Universe suede pads
    • Speed and soundstage take a hit
    • Least fatiguing
    • Too inoffensive
    The Universe suede pads provide the most sedate experience, while having the most natural timbre of the four. However, soundstage, imaging, and detail suffer, so I'm not sure I'd recommend these for general usage. I feel that these pads sacrifice too many positive qualities to achieve the balance they provide.

    Pad Conclusion
    I personally found the default Auteur solid pads the most interesting and engaging, so I'd use those for general listening. I'll use the Universe solid pads for when I want to feel "closer" to the music. I might occasionally use the Auteur hybrid pads as a less fatiguing alternative to the solid pads. I don't see myself using the suede pads.

    Conclusion
    [​IMG]
    The VC is a capable and unique headphone.

    I originally started my listening sessions kind of confused by the VCs and not very confident about whether I would keep it. I gave it some time, and eventually, things clicked - I understood why the signature was what it was, and after this, I struggled to return to my previous headphones. In this sense, the Verite Closed may be somewhat of an acquired taste.

    The Verite Closed have supplanted my HD800S. This is high praise. I have tried plenty of headphones in this range and I always went back to the HD800S. But I just cannot help it - the 800S feels boring in comparison, even post EQ. The ZMF is simply more engaging, resolving, and interesting - and it doesn't sacrifice technicalities to get there.

    Perhaps most perplexing is that ZMF has managed to make a closed headphone that is competitive with open-backs in the same price range. With the VCs, I am not wanting for engagement or technicalities, and I do not feel that something was compromised simply to make the headphone closed. What an achievement!

    Read my other reviews here:
     
  17. crenca

    crenca Friend

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    I have a 'wow' reaction to this - that's alot of bass & sub-bass to be adding to what I consider an already "warm" HP. Is that RME Dac (I assume you are using the HP out) a lightweight in power and/or tonal signature?
     
  18. tusing

    tusing New

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    Perhaps? I have heard some people call the RME anemic, but I feel similarly about the sub-bass with the VC plugged into a BH Crack.

    To clarify, I am talking about a dropoff in the 20-30Hz range, especially 20-25Hz which might be "low sub-bass", but still tends to contain a lot of information. The bass shelf filter I described doesn't really "ramp up" until those frequencies.
     
  19. Ksaurav402

    Ksaurav402 Friend

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    Somehow I don't find the upper Mids and treble as accentuated. In fact I find it tad smoother compared to VO. It may be Onyx DAC and me being low level listener.
     
  20. Marutks

    Marutks New

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    Have you tried Solid Verite pads on VC? What are these pads for? I have never seen anyone using them.
     

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