Sennheiser HD650 Love (Appreciation Thread)

Discussion in 'Headphone Measurements' started by purr1n, Sep 27, 2015.

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  1. k4rstar

    k4rstar Britney fan club president

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    A 600
    B 650
    C 580

    easy for a Senn master such as myself
     
  2. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    You've both been 100% incorrect so far! So you can deduce from there if you like. I was surprised a bit too. Then again, I have no idea what years the 600 or 6xx are from (these both just arrived from @Mystic ). The 580 is from 2002.

    Mighta been easier if I matched the graphs at 2k instead. Just goes to show matching measurements in different places in the FR can absolutely shift perception of relative differences. I thought matching at 200hz was a good idea because I do hear the bass performance as being virtually identical between them, just with different treble balance.

    My non-audiophile partner compared these with maybe 10-15 seconds pause while swapping headphones and decided she couldn't detect much difference between the 600 and 6xx, but that she preferred both of them to the 580, and my modded 6xx far beyond any of the others - saying it sounded 'louder' but also 'smoother, less painful', which I would probably interpret as just being a bit more dynamic.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2020
  3. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    If your above statement is 100% correct, then that must mean:
    • A: 580
    • B: 600
    • C: 6XX
    That's, uh, totally what I was going to say...
     
  4. dncnexus

    dncnexus Friend

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    a 580
    b 600
    c 650

    yay process of elimination i win woooohoooo

    Edit: damn too late :(
     
  5. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    Interesting that HD600 dip right before 10k and also doesn't have as pronounced 2-3k bump as HD650.

    EDIT: Ah its one of the original black screen versions.

    Do you have the Romanian manufactured HD600 and HD650 to run measurements?
     
  6. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    I'll be honest, I went from left to right and just picked the thiccest looking graph for HD650 and the one with the upper midrange spike had to be HD600; HD580 was reputed to have the best balance of the lot and that seemed to check out with whatever was left over, but apparently that was incorrect :p

    If I'd noticed the treble trough in C. (hard to believe but legit didn't notice) might have gone with 650 there too, but results are genuinely surprising. Could be attributable to running changes then, or indeed silicone pinnae messing things up.
     
  7. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    Pretty sure that 9k suckout on the 600 measurement is just an artifact.

    The 1.2k-2.5k octave is slightly hotter on the 600 than the 6xx even if the 3k bump is less isolated when matched at 200hz. This, along with the narrow 4.5k bump (also shared with black screen 580), and 3dB greater above 5k does make it sound more forward on the top half. 580 somehow has even more presence over 5k (might just be the front foam having thinned over the last 18 years), but with a midbass emphasis more like the 6xx.
     
  8. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    So that small bump at 4.5k is where I hear bit of a bright edge on the HD600?
     
  9. Walderstorn

    Walderstorn Friend

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    I knew the 600 had to be B, at list the "good" variant, the others one i wasn't sure. That one never goes wrong =)

    It was interesting figuring them out but i wonder why my results (from what i remember) didn't look as "smooth" as yours. I remember having dips around 4, 5.5 (the biggest one) and a very small one around 9 as well.

    Have to re-measure.
     
  10. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    Modded my HD600 today. Mostly the same stuff I did to my 6xx a few pages back, but here are some pics anyway -

    Back - dynamat-like goop everywhere possible, spider and foam removal
    [​IMG]

    Front - microfiber glasses cleaning cloth covering about 50% of front screen, tungsten tape for mass loading
    [​IMG]

    Pad Risers - pardon the hair and dust
    [​IMG]

    FR (stock is above in a previous post)
    [​IMG]

    Save for the sub rolloff, I love this response. Pretty much the most 'reference' tuning I've gotten out of anything ever. Removing the front and rear foams actually adds about 3dB sensitivity vs stock too. The built in headphone out on my SP404SX is plenty for either of them. Above graph matched @ 1khz to compare to my modded 6XX below:

    [​IMG]

    Oddly enough because of the lesser high treble on the 6XX, when I turn it up to listening level after coming from the 600 the mids sound slightly hollow and further back in the mix in comparison, though the bass sticks out a bit more too. Because of this the 6xx feels a touch more macrodynamic and extended down low as a result. The 3k bump on the 6xx doesn't really bother me given it's not too far deviated from what I got with the stock FR (could just be a difference in pads between these two too). Just a different focus between them - finding my preference shifts depending on the recording. Love the up-front stage and snares on the 600. Love kicks and bass on the 6xx.

    Now I have to decide whether I want to do the 580 in the same way or just leave them be - the stock measurements on the 580 make me feel like I could get the bottom half of the modded 6xx and the top half of the modded 600, which would be ideal.
     
  11. tommytakis

    tommytakis MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    I got curious after seeing @E_Schaaf ’s modding post so I tried applying similar thing to my JAR650. I bought some glasses cleaning cloth from amazon and cut it into similar shapes as Evan’s. So far, it sounds pretty good! The extreme ends sounds slightly more pronounced and extended but doesn’t throw off the tonal balance. Slightly more lively sounding, reminds me of a hybrid between HD650’s mids with 600’s treble.

    31E7943F-4EF5-40D0-A5D6-C1AB3FD5D1F1.jpeg
     
  12. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    You can bring the cuts closer to center if you want to tone down the upper mids and above. I did find the super-coarse scratchy foam from the 6XX mod a few pages back a bit more dynamically open than the dual fabric I did on the HD600. Try the pad risers too!
     
  13. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    Just thought I'd add sources for everything you'd need if you wanted to do the HD600 mod above (the 6xx mod uses a coarse foam I got from a luthier... can't seem to find a good source online) -

    https://www.amazon.com/Noico-deaden...child=1&keywords=noico&qid=1594757979&sr=8-10

    https://www.amazon.com/Pinewood-Der...&keywords=tungsten+tape&qid=1594757967&sr=8-3

    https://www.amazon.com/Xthel-Microfiber-Cleaning-Cloths-Electronics/dp/B07SSY63MB/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=glasses+cleaning+cloth&qid=1594758108&sr=8-4&th=1

    https://www.amazon.com/100-Dental-C...ords=dental+cotton+gum&qid=1594758029&sr=8-11

    This comes out to about $43 and is enough for multiple pairs. You'll also need scissors.

    Anyone who doesn't want to do it themselves can send em to me - cover shipping both ways and tip me a pair of pads or a 6SN7 or whatever for my time and I'll do it for ya.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2020
  14. gixxerwimp

    gixxerwimp Professional tricycle rider

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    Have you tried as bit of foam over the rear driver hole (a la "M"/KISS)? I found that it helps lower the mid-bass bump, and thus perceptually improves the sub extension.
     
  15. Philimon

    Philimon Friend

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    New stock (L) vs new aftermarket replacement (R):

    [​IMG]
     
  16. k4rstar

    k4rstar Britney fan club president

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    I made the terrible mistake of purchasing new HD650s from amazon. I got the new revision, made in Bulgaria or Romania or wherever they moved production from Ireland. it no longer says on the headband. I guess they are embarrassed to say

    for the exact same price as before, you don't get the classic hinged box, the construction feels like flimsy shit, they are obviously using a grade of plastic much cheaper and lighter than before. even the cable is cheaper and lighter. the cherry on top is that they sound worse than any stock pair I remember, maybe this is a matter of break-in but I'm not going to wait to find out

    I will be sending this back and buying another pair from a pro dealer who still has stock of Ireland pairs. damn shame
     
  17. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    ^^What did you pay from Amazon?
     
  18. k4rstar

    k4rstar Britney fan club president

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    $499 CDN from Amazon CA

    they sound just like Marv described the HD660S, a crude/simplified facsimile of the real HD650. a joke to a long-time Cardinal of the Church of Sennheiser like myself. shame on them, I would've rather they actually discontinued the thing instead of letting them live on in this bastardized state.
     
  19. robot zombie

    robot zombie Friend

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    That really is a shame. HD650's are a classic. Now you've got me thinking about snagging a second pair used, while the good ones are still floating around.
     
  20. monacelli

    monacelli Friend

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    I was concerned about this very thing happening when they moved production to Romania [link to press release]. I think they could full well replicate the Irish standard of production at their new Romanian facility, but they chose not to. Probably corporate bean counters trying to "optimize" their production chain, i.e., steadily degrade the quality of their products through "value engineering". There was some conversation a while back about the Sonarworks guys finding early Romanian HD650 batches to be out of spec. My recollection is that got resolved, but clearly they are still having issues. Or maybe they've just lowered the bar for what they deem an acceptable end result. It's disappointing to say the least. Being an HD600 guy, I picked up a back-up pair of the kitchen countertop variety last year when Amazon still had stock. They are tucked away on a shelf for a rainy day, but I like knowing I have a pair in reserve in case anything happens to my daily driver.
     

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