Anyone try Sonarworks Headphone Calibration?

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by The Alchemist, Dec 2, 2015.

  1. DivineCurrent

    DivineCurrent New

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    That's a question I would love to ask Axel directly. He very well could have not been in charge of the HD800's frequency tuning, even if he was the project manager for it. Or maybe he was and just wanted to go for a bright tuning. Either way, the damage is done, and I just wonder if Sennheiser will ever release a headphone with HD800 soundstage but smooth HD650 frequency response (and no, HD800S does not count). For now, we have Sonarworks! :)
     
  2. donunus

    donunus Friend

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    just tried the vst plugin for my m40x on jriver. Results? CRAP. It just added a low res sound similar to the built in foobar eq ugghhh pweh. Listening to flacs sounding like a 96khz mp3 forget it.
     
  3. donunus

    donunus Friend

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    It's a good thing there is a trial period because if you had to pay full price and realize this afterwards oh man, it's more expensive than the m40x lol
     
  4. DivineCurrent

    DivineCurrent New

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    That's strange. Do you have the no clipping button on the right turned off? Or perhaps jriver can't handle the processing needed for Sonarworks. I know when I use SW directly in foobar, the performance is a little lagging. Have you tried the system-wide method using Pedalboard 2 and VB Cable?
     
  5. donunus

    donunus Friend

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    already installed pedalboard and vb cable but decided not to go systemwide after the jriver vst test since thats the way I was going to go anyway. Sorry for not getting into it as much. The jriver vst performance just turned me off too much that I decided to stop there. There were no lags of any sort though so I just assumed it wasn't a latency problem. I have no other dsps running on jriver and have my audio output set to 32bit integer wasapi going to my old lhlabs geek out 1000
     
  6. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    My SonarWorks trial is running out and I will not be purchasing the license.
    I've tried hard to hear any major improvement of the HD800's and I have to admit I'm not hearing it. Expectation bias might have been clouding my judgment to begin with, but both in longer sessions and shorter song-by-song switching back and forth I'm just not convinced.
    The mono monitoring function is very nice, especially for me who spend most of my time listening to hard-panned jazz but with the recent update of Roon I can do procedural EQ to achieve the exact same result...or at least it sounds the same to me.

    I can't hear anything that makes me do statements like @Rthomas about how Sennheiser could ever release the HD800 with stock tuning.
    Using Lynx AES16 and Yggdrasil + Mjolnir2 I'm happy without anything else than a solid mono mixdown for the jazz and crossfeed for the rest.
     
  7. Rthomas

    Rthomas Friend

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    I would like to update my statements on Sonarworks a bit.

    I can confidently state that for me the difference when switching it on and off was obvious. I'm sure I could pass a blind test but even with Sonarworks after a few days I grew tired of the HD800.

    It just did not involve me in the music and to borrow a phrase from Tyll it sounded ''diffuse and distant'' even though it was much improved with SW.

    I went back to my trusty HD650 and the music was warmer, the bass was not as defined but it had more body.

    I've realized that I can give up some soundstage and detail for better tonality.

    I ended up returning the HD800.
     
  8. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    @Kattefjaes I'll reply here instead of in the Jotunheim thread.
    I just realized I can't try again with both my systems and a wider range of music, my Sonarworks trial has expired. Damnit!
    Anyway a bit of clarification might be needed before I explore further anyway.

    My Sonarworks demo was done on Lynx AES16 PCI -> Yggdrasil -> Mjolnir2 -> HD800. I'm listening to 90% hard panned stereo recorded jazz which might be one (stupid?) reason for me not hearing much of a difference with Sonarworks. I used mono monitoring almost all the time to avoid trumpet-induced-hearing-loss. What a great feature to have. Easy to toggle on/off. But maybe using mono monitoring is the main reason why I wasn't convinced... ? <Insert mockery here if needed> I demoed Sonarworks in the setting that it would be mostly used...

    I didn't try Sonaworks with ModiMB/Vali2 since I never use the HD800 with this setup. I'm using the BeyerDynamic T5P to get a little bit of peace and quiet while kids (and wife) are running around the house post dinner. Yeah yeah, shitty match some say - I like it. It's a nice combo to have after a long day at work.
    Maybe using the HD800 in this system together with Sonarworks would've yielded a big difference. I regret not trying that more.
    I also should've tried more genres of music. I do listen to quite a lot of classical music - one hour of Bach every morning - but with a lonely piano I have to say I didn't hear any difference. That's the only non mono monitoring reference I can mention.

    So. If hard panned stereo is your poison and your system is the same as above you can get the same mono mixdown in Roon (if you're already a user). If not, one year's worth of Roon will cost similar to a lifetime worth of Sonarworks mono monitoring + EQ... take your pick.

    But maybe this is also due to the fact that the Lynx card was such a big improvement in my chain that I just don't need anything else?
     
  9. Kattefjaes

    Kattefjaes Mostly Harmless

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    It could be that the jazz was very middy? I think if anything, the Yggdrasil/Mjo2 should make the differences clearer, as it's more revealing and extended. It's there to compensate for deficiencies of the transducers, rather than the DAC/amp, really.

    I would have suggested throwing a wide range of music at it- some brightly-mastered pop, some bassy dance music and so forth, so see how the edge cases behaved. However, if you never listen to those things, it may well be irrelevant :)

    I have a full Sonarworks license anyway- don't need to try out, I bought it when there was a 40% off voucher floating about. It works very well, and I certainly don't regret it at all. It's nice to have toys,

    That said, I feel like I don't need to use it as much as I did, when I was being lazy and listening to a jittery source. I also don't need the mono feature, as I can always use my HP8 Mk.2 as the headamp- which has a mono switch on the front. It is indeed useful on those horribly hard-panned recordings, which for me are mostly Beatles, The Kinks etc., and otherwise do feel very strange on headphones.

    Anyway, if you're happy with your setup and Roon's mono mixdown, I don't see the problem- relax and enjoy your music in good health!

    (I don't use Roon, I prefer to just remotely control my streamer, either using an MPD front end, JRiver as a UnPnP controller, or even Linn Kazoo as a Tidal front end. That way I can use whichever device I wish, and can turn my noisy gaming PC off if I prefer, too. Decoupling everything so that it becomes Lego is oddly liberating.)
     
  10. atomicbob

    atomicbob dScope Yoda

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    Sonarworks has a very obvious and positive effect to my ears with HD600, HD650 and HD800. I too listen to a lot of jazz, including a fair amount from the 50s and 60s. I also employ Waves NX. Now that I have been using the combination for a considerable amount of time it is difficult for me to listen to systems without these two VST plugins. The systems I post in the System Synergy Special Sound thread appear to work especially well in conjunction with them. When bypassed the music becomes far less dimensional, the timbral colorations of the headphones more obvious and the emotional engagement considerably diminished, for me.
     
  11. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    I
    Very interesting. Do you use mono monitoring or "just" crossfeed for the hard panned stereo stuff in addition to the SW eq?
     
  12. atomicbob

    atomicbob dScope Yoda

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    I am not using mono monitoring. Waves NX is giving me a sense of space in front of me rather than hard panned to both sides of my head, the latter being rather annoying for me. Once experienced, it is hard to go back. Sonarworks running mixed filter, 75% wet, slight tilt and custom compensation for the HD650 calibrated at Sonarworks. Timbre for instruments on tracks from sessions match more closely what I heard in the studio.
     
  13. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    Cool. Not having tried Waves NX the description sounds like what I'm experiencing with mono mixdown. Agreed about the hard panned stereo being annoying, I can't get through anything with Miles that way.
    What happens if you just run Sonarworks without Waves - knowing that you might have to listen to something else than hard panned stereo to evaluate? Would you say it's still a big improvement?
     
  14. atomicbob

    atomicbob dScope Yoda

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    NX and Sonarworks appear to play together very well. Sonarworks provides a less colored, nasal or closed sound by itself, but the effect is much more apparent when used in conjunction with NX.

    Ok, just tried Miles Smiles. Without Waves NX the Sonarworks compensation for HD650 was hardly noticeable. Much more evident with NX engaged.

    A more pronounced benefit of Sonarworks can be heard with Medeski, Martin & Wood End of the World Party or Dave Brubeck Jazz Impressions of Eurasia. Again, combined with Waves NX the compensation is much more apparent, in a good way to my ears.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2017
  15. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    Gotcha, that makes sense. I see Waves has a demo version available, I'll give it a go - although without Sonarworks. It's essential for me to be able to go "beyond" crossfeed in order to live with my jazz collection. The hard part seems to be to not kill the recording and make it dull, while saving ears at the same time.
     
  16. atomicbob

    atomicbob dScope Yoda

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    The post is edited to include examples. Very important to note I am tuning my system to please my preferences given my experiences in live SR, studio sessions, plenty of post editing / processing and now finally enjoying recreational listening again. Also, your ears may be giving you a specific set of challenges. Trumpet was my instrument though I stopped playing out years ago when it became obvious I was not going to master the instrument as well as those I enjoyed hearing so much.
     
  17. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    Great @atomicbob , thanks for trying this out! That explains a lot of what I experienced with Sonarworks + mono monitoring.
    I'll try to get the Metaplugin + NX working with JRiver and report back.

    (Miles Smiles is just a fantastic album.)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2017
  18. Changeling

    Changeling Tube Slut

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    Anyone having issues with installing VST's in JRiver? Sonarworks installed just fine, but I can't seem to load any others :(

    Edit: nevermind. Needed to move around the .dll a couple of times from where it installed.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2017
  19. Changeling

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    @atomicbob I got NX Stereo set up in JRiver and is now listening to a couple of Tina Brooks tracks. Hard panned Rudy van Gelder galore.
    What settings have you found to work "best" with HD800 if any?
    I'll compare with my mono mixdown in Roon and report back later next week.
     
  20. atomicbob

    atomicbob dScope Yoda

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    The factory defaults for room ambience and speaker position are a good place to start. I find they work very well for me. Adjust the head modeling as described in the manual for your specific inter-aural delay. Head tracking is fun for a short while, useful if you are actually mixing, but I leave it turned off for recreational listening. It has a very high gee-whiz-wow factor initially. Keeping one's head stationary is not the best strategy when kicking back and enjoying. Especially every time one wants a sip of favorite beverage.
     

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