Lynx PCIe AES interfaces: AES16 and E22

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by purr1n, Sep 8, 2016.

  1. Drifterxny

    Drifterxny Friend

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    Ah you are right, thanks. Was under the impression that thunderbolt was only meant for macs. With that said, can anyone recommend an enclosure, its sole purpose would be to house the lynx 16e? Cheapest quality option? thanks
     
  2. m17xr2b

    m17xr2b Friend

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    Any PCI-e external enclosure connected via thunderbolt will do. Macs adopted thunderbolt early but it's on a lot of PC. My Asus laptop even has it.
     
  3. Josh358

    Josh358 Facebook Friend

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    Thanks, first I've heard about it.
     
  4. gridmaster

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    I decided to buy an SU-6 to check it out. Been running it for about a week.
    Have to say this is the best USB ddc I've used. It's definitely on par with my Lynx AES16e, but I wouldn't say better, different. And you'd have to know what you prefer to go either way.

    SU-6 (I hate using words like this) sounds "holographic". Really insane low level resolution and texture to the sound.
    Although, it's a much more forward presentation than the Lynx. The biggest differences are Lynx has better soundstage, is more laid back and is more neutral. SU-6 has better texture and low level detail to the sound, leans slightly bright compared to Lynx.

    I've also used SU-6 as a word clock output to my Lynx AES16e.
    https://i.imgur.com/LbZzVC3.png

    I'd say PC -> USB -> SU-6 -> DAC and PC -> SU-6 word clock -> Lynx -> DAC sound more similar to each other than PC -> Lynx (internal clock) -> DAC. When using SU-6 as word clock output to Lynx, it's slightly better that USB SU-6, nothing significant tho, slightly evens out the forward presentation and soundstage. Might because I'm not using a meme 1.5m digital AES cable for SU-6 direct. I wouldn't recommend both together unless you already own a PCI(e) card that accepts word clock, not worth the cost imo.

    Between the two it seems like a close battle in terms of price/performance. Su-6 is around $650, PCI(e) clockers are around $300 (for older PCI models) and $550ish for newer PCIe models (RME/Lynx). If you need the portability that SU-6 has, add another $200 for a thunderbolt enclosure.

    Don't know if this is true, but I've read crystal oscillators can take up to a month to equalize (burn in). I'll report back if SU-6 sound changes over the fallowing weeks.

    (as always, this review is imo/ymmv)

    Gear Used:
    Belkin Gold USB
    Regular audio 2ft XLR/AES cable
    Yggdrasil-v2
    EC AF / Pentode head-amps
    HD800SDR
    Redbook flac
    Singxer SU-6
    Lynx AES16e with standard breakout cable + thunderbolt enclosure
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
  5. Josh358

    Josh358 Facebook Friend

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    I just finished comparing my E22 to an AES16e. The E22 is the clear choice if you only need two channels.

    I tried both in AES/EBU mode first, replugging into a Yggdrasil's AES input. Then I switched the E22 to SPDIF mode, and plugged both the E22 and AES16e into the Yggdrasil (using the RCA connector for the SPDIF), and fed them with the same program using JRiver's flaky zones so that I could A/B them using Yggdrasil's front panel switch.

    The differences were most apparent in the highs. With the E22, violins were sweeter and cleaner, and more convincingly "present" in the room. Soprano voice was smoother. By comparison, the AES16e was a bit veiled and grey, with less of a palpable feeling that the instruments were present; the sound was more plastic, less liquid, even subtly distorted.

    I should point out that these differences, while clearly audible in an A/B comparison, were fairly subtle. While I didn't directly compare USB to the AES16e, SPDIF from the E22 was so much better than USB on a Gungnir that I've no doubt the AES16e is superior to USB (which having just read through the thread I see is already the consensus).

    However, I'm a bit disappointed since I need more than two channels. Nervosa to be sure, but I was already accustomed to the sweet sound of the E22, so the AES16e was a letdown. I'm wondering about the alternatives, e.g., Rednet/Dante. Looks like that comparison never happened?
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2019
  6. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    The Rednet is as good as the Lynx, possibly slightly better, for more money and way more space. I miss my Lynx card but not the Rednet (though they fixed one of my main gripes by letting the sample rate change automatically).
     
  7. Josh358

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    Thanks, Luckbad. I was wondering if they'd fixed the sample rate change!

    I suppose the alternative would be a Mutec on the AES16e, but that also seems pricey and unwieldly . . .
     
  8. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    Just an update. I upgraded my system and decided to try a fresh install of Fedora 31 beta and this card now works out of the box, all you have to do is install the alsa-firmware package, reboot, select the multichannel output device and you're done.

    Of course you can still tweak the sound quality but no more messing with pulseaudio config files just to get non distorted stereo output.

    For direct alsa it is of course bitperfect as long as the gain is at 0db so no tweaking required.
     
  9. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    Oh boy, am I allowed to resurrect old threads? I hope so.

    Anyways, I picked up one of these plus a PCIe Thunderbolt enclosure (more on that later, damn you Sonnet) and a whole mess of converters from AES/EBU to BNC to coaxial. Why'd I go for this dated thing over the new hotness that is the Pi2AES stuff or the Rednet boxes? Well, call me a boomer, but I dislike off-computer streaming solutions or anything like that. I want my whole setup plugged right into the computer so I can update my music library on the fly, which I do very frequently. As for why not Rednet, I found the reliability fishy, convenience questionable (my fancy new 16" Macbook Pro only has one ethernet port dongle, and that's for actual internet use) and the aesthetics eyegoring. So I went with this thing instead. Compact, plug and play (mostly) and convenient.

    I'll be honest. Initially I wasn't expecting much. I made a little fun of the idea that SPDIF could possibly sound different from USB. I mean, it had to be audio rocks tier shit right? Dead wrong.

    Right away without any comparisons I instantly knew what I was hearing was the real deal. The Bifrost 2 was no longer dark and warm, it was just warm. And images took on this added thickness and tactility which I didn't know I was missing. Sort of like how you don't know your gear is veiled unless you've heard the veil removed.

    That image thickness, I think, is the real selling point here. Switching back to Unison USB, things felt thinner, sharper, more fatiguing. Not a massive difference, but a difference nonetheless, and I can definitely see how one could consider it as treble fuckery or diffuseness. I think I'll have to agree with @Hands that Unison is not fantastic, at least not with the Apple USB-C to USB-A dongle I have. Perhaps it's killer with a proper streamer source, but that's not a rabbithole I'm keen on throwing myself into. Not now, not ever.

    There is just this delightful fullness not quite related to tonal balance on this thing, and I really appreciate it. That and the shifting of the BF2's tonal balance to something a little more neutral, as well as the increased layering ability I hear from it. The Gates of Delirium by Yes (the Wilson remix, not the garbagefire that was the original) has lots of small details that get obscured a lot by lesser chains. Little bleeps and bloops from the keyboard in the intro, buried instrumental sections throughout the climax of the song, etc etc etc. All of this stuff is actually possible to pick out now rather than just getting muddled up. There are also a lot more microdetails coming through, fine inflections I didn't really pick up on in the past. In a sense, you could say that the Lynx card has more resolving ability than Unison here. I just listened to this album on the way to work this morning, and I'm noticing lots of stuff I never noticed before. I'd argue the difference in this department is larger than, say, going from my WM1A to the BF2 via Unison.

    In short, SPDIF inputs are the real deal. Hopefully this Lynx card cures the upgradeitis and I don't feel myself itching for oversized cherry red boxes or vintage CD players anytime soon.

    Oh yeah, the Sonnet enclosure. The one I have in right now is the second one I've received from Amazon. The first one got sent back because of this awful high pitched coil whine and a noisy SMPS. Well, the new one's SMPS is dead silent, but the coil whine is present on this unit too. God damnit. Hopefully I can get it swapped out for a new one so I can play the lottery again.
     
  10. MellowVelo

    MellowVelo Friend

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    I have a Lynx E22 in a Sonnet enclosure. Are you sure that the whine is not the fan inside the unit? If it's the fan, you can disconnect it. The fan is completely unnecessary in this situation.
     
  11. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    I killed the fan by tearing out the plastic blade and leaving the magnetic coil in. The fan is way too noisy, though at this rate without it is not much better either. Can I just cut the whole thing out without anything bad happening?
     
  12. MellowVelo

    MellowVelo Friend

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    You don’t have to cut anything. There’s simply a cable that you need to unplug which supplies power to the fan. It’s totally reversible as well.

    For what it’s worth, I did this on the Sonnet Echo Express SE I, and the unit is dead silent.
     
  13. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    Oh? I must be stupid if I managed to miss that plug. I’ll take a look when I get home, if that shuts the thing up it’d be awesome.
     
  14. MellowVelo

    MellowVelo Friend

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    The cable is quite small, but it should just pop out. Let us know how it goes.
     
  15. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    Well, it does indeed just pop out like you said. I don't know why I didn't try something as simple as this earlier before going for the brute force method. Unfortunately the coil whine is still very there and present. Was really hoping this would have been an easy fix, but no such luck. Hopefully Sonnet can send me a replacement that's quiet.
     
  16. MellowVelo

    MellowVelo Friend

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    I’m glad that you were able to disconnect the fan. That’s too bad about the whine. Let us know what Sonnet says. What model are you using?
     
  17. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    Same as yours, Thunderbolt 3 version.
     
  18. mi_ms

    mi_ms New

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    Hi, all

    First post :)

    Thought I'd revive this thread - now almost a full year on "standby." I've been reading through it with relief actually, because of the informative, friendly people-channeling-their-experiences/thoughts vibe on PCIe cards no less. "No less," because for quite a few years now the USB connectivity approach has, by and large, ruled in 'computer audiophile' circles, so much so that any mention of PCIe cards with AES3 or S/PDIF outputs will receive the "obsolete by close to a decade now"-glance.

    The USB O/I route - not least tweaked and perfected sometimes ad nauseam and at great expense + complexity - can sound great, no contention here at all, and it supports the likes of DSD playback and high sample rate playback more readily - no doubt a vital part of its popularity among the 'audiophile style'-inclined cohorts of PC-based playback brethren. However, it's also grown into an all-encompassing thick duvet of a narrative, with all that entails, and dare I say somewhat one-sided and polemic at that. It much rests in the blurring of 'different' or 'better,' I believe, with one approach (i.e.: PCI(e) cards and the AES3/S/PDIF I/O route) not receiving an even-handed evaluation vs. USB.

    Myself I've come full circle in my endeavor here going from and back to: RME HDSP 9632 (AES) - Audiophilleo2 - SOtM streamer - AP2 again - RME HDSP 9632 again, until the PSU of my aging HTPC died and a new motherboard rendered the PCI socket RME card obsolete indeed.

    Now reading through this thread a lot of fine info has been shared on the Lynx cards AES16e and E22, and it would seem the E22 has the upper hand among the two - insofar one is in no need of more than two channels (which I'm not). I have however also considered the Marian Seraph D4 PCIe card, and would like to know if anybody around has any experience with it - can it hold its own compared to the Lynx cards?

    In the US the German originating Marian cards are more expensive than Lynx, and vice versa here in Europe, so, economically the incentive for me would be to go with the Marian card, whereas if the Lynx ditto is better it would of course dictate for its acquisition.

    Please chime in on your thoughts.
     

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