Modi Multibit: Multibit for the masses.

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by MrTie, Jul 25, 2016.

  1. Poleepkwa

    Poleepkwa Friend

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    How is the slam and dynamics compared to the Modi 3 of this A2 version?
     
  2. fraggler

    fraggler A Happy & Busy Life

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    I don't have the Modi Multibit anymore, and my audio memory is likely poor. If I were forced to answer, I'd say the Modi Multibit was a bit more relaxed (ie not as much slam/macrodynamics). I ended up jumping to a Gungnir Multibit A1 because I wanted the natural presentation of the Modi Multibit with better bass and dynamics (and resolution).
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Modi Multibit before the firmware upgrade was more congested in the lows and had a certain peakiness in the upper mids, easily heard with female vocals. Try Melanie C Jesus Christ Superstar on YouTube. Very easy to hear this before and not there after the upgrade.

    Warmup may take anywhere from 2 minutes to 48 hours depending upon age and firmware.

    --

    It isn't that Modi 3 isn't dynamic, in a way it's more dynamic than Modi Multibit, but with a squishy quality. Also the mids and upper mids are laid back. A side effect is a pushed back soundstage. These seem to be part of the AKM Velvet sound.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
  4. mykeldg

    mykeldg New

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    I recorded a sound demo of Modi Multibit v2 vs Modi 3 vs my Amp's internal AKM DAC. While its just for fun and is no way a properly configured sound demo, it should give you a good Idea of the relative differences. As you can hear, the Modi Multibit is no slouch and kinda makes the modi3 sound rather flat / less dimensional.

    here it is :
     
  5. Poleepkwa

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    That was the thing that bothered me with the Modi Multibit A1 and the reason I sold it. Since then I had the Bifrost Multibit, but there was something going on with the bass that felt more curvy than the other DACs on hand. That was quite a bit better than the Modi 3 in soundstage, layering and not as mechanical sounding, yet the Modi 3 for me was more even handed. Now if the Modi Multibit A2 sounds less congested and smoother than the Modi 3 I think it will tide me over till the new Modi Multibit arrives. Which could be a while still...
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    The stridency is 90% fixed, the congestion 60%. Not totally gone. A little more bit air, overall tone is a bit flatter; but it's still an Modi Multibit.
     
  7. Poleepkwa

    Poleepkwa Friend

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    I liked the tonality of the Modi Multibit more than the Bifrost. I will start looking then...
     
  8. mykeldg

    mykeldg New

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    Serious question, I know people are somehow Irked by Topping products here, but does anyone know how the Modi Multibit v2 fare against the Topping D50s? I'm planning to setup a secondary bedroom setup so my Modi Multibit will stay in my main rig.

    Thanks in advance.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
  9. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    A portion of the money that goes to Topping funds Red China's hegemony over the Pacific Rim and against the self-determination of the peoples in that region. The question is do you want your children to be speaking Mandarin when the Philippines becomes a puppet state of China? The USA isn't exactly a saint, but at least it's done its part in letting the Taiwanese be Taiwanese for 70 years, and ensuring that there actually is a South Korea were its citizens don't have to eat bark to survive.

    Otherwise, SBAF magic 8-ball says D50 is likely to be decent sounding given the specific ESS chip and opamps used. Expect zippier and coarser high-end, more sharpened detail, and further back headstage. Layering in depth, and fluidity and smoothness of highs will take a step back. Microdynamics will be more square rather than round. Tonality will be leaner and less warm.
     
  10. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    I don't think people are irked by Topping products. Those of use who have heard and bought them know they are run of the mill hifi sounding products that many of us would prefer not to listen to.

    My D30 for example in a modest hp setup sounded somewhat impressive in the first few hours, but the sheen was not natural nor was the audible clipping on bass notes of several recordings. It went back to the chinese seller on amazon after a fight over wanting me to ship it back to China at my expense when it came to me from a California warehouse. I prevailed.

    There is a reason many of us shy away from pumped up chifi stuff like Topping, sMSL, and others. There are other choices that sound better, are made better, and have some semblance of support.

    Reminds me of a another little chifi dac FX Audio that I bought with it's all proud shiny QC passed sticker that was wired in reverse for its analog outputs. I have learned a few lessons over the years going way back to an Opera Droplet $2500 cd player that could not function for more than a year without faults. And absolutely no support from opera.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
  11. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I'm irked at all cheap Chi-Fi products that use cookie cutter designs from datasheets. Topping is hated more than others because some people believe that ASR gets a cut. I used to not believe so, to think of this as a ridiculous impossibility; but now I'm not so sure.

    Anyway, another consequence: Do we really want the audio world to be Borged by similar unimaginative 0.000x designs? How many more branded variations of the THX amp designs do we really need?
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
  12. Gruss Gott

    Gruss Gott Almost "Made"

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    I ain't no expert, and people around here are mostly irked by me too, but i've had both (still have the Modi Multibit v2) and for the D50, beyond the support of authoritarianism, possible ASR kickbacks, and not made in Cali, I can say the Modi Multibit is much to my preference at least in my setup (behind an Eitr and in front of the Jot).

    That schiit stack can be bright and especially with my Fostex x00s, but with my ZMF Eikons I can definitely hear the difference between the Modi Multibit and D50 and it's much of what @bixby said: the D50 doesn't sound natural - and had this treble edge/sheen; especially with Jazz and big female vocal tracks, both of which I listen to a lot. With EDM / Deep House the D50 bass on test tracks like Trentemøller's Chameleon was downright dim and with my ZMF Atticus actually created a buzz that panicked me. (granted that's not the best setup for the Atticus)

    Like I said, I'm no expert, but the D50 was sent away fast and my Modi Multibit is still going strong - i may replace it with a new Bifrost, but in that setup - for me with my ears - it'd be more just to have a black Bifrost to match my black jot than because of my ears. The D50 you'd have to pay me 5x its price to use.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2019
  13. Yerim

    Yerim New

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    If you are near Egghead try out the IFI Zen Dac. Cheaper and better quality than the topping, not edgy and glossed over sound. Or ask @Lyander about his Bifrost MB.
     
  14. mykeldg

    mykeldg New

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    thanks for the inputs. l found someone who'll lend me the newer d50s, i'll see how i like it. most likely i wouldn't since your impressions of the d50 is similar to my other DS DACS. i.e. I also find the Modi Multibit v2 to be more lifelike and natural unlike my other DS dacs who are sharper but errs on having a flat & lifeless soundstage.
     
  15. mykeldg

    mykeldg New

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    Thanks! interesting to find fellow Filipinos in this group. Yeah, I've heard good things about the newer Zen especially with GTO filter update. I do have the modi multibit v2 already, its just that all the topping hype got me curious.
     
  16. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    Your description of the Modi 3 is dead on. I just got one with the Asgard 3 and was actually surprised by how pushed back the upper mids are. Its the same kind of thing Hifiman does on some of their planars to make them sound like they have a huge sound-stage. I had to adjust my EQ I am using to compensate as I find it hurts the dynamics especially on guitar driven music.

    Have to say female vocals sound outstanding with the Asgard/Modi and the detail is really impressive but its a bit lacking in the dynamics/fun factor.

    Its really interesting to see that they update the Modi Multibit. I must admit I was not a fan of the V1, I found the bass to be a bit bloated sounding and the highs a little rolled off. It was closer to a vinyl record sound which is why people like it I guess.

    Might have to try the V2 at some point.

    For those mentioning the IFI Zen Dac I also recommend it, its a great little dac/amp. The amp portion is pretty weak but dac is very impressive for the price. I am going to spend time comparing it to the Modi and sell the one I like less.
     
  17. mykeldg

    mykeldg New

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    Regarding Modi 3 -- I observed this too. It takes the edges out especially on rock songs and it would make it sound a bit spacious but fails to expose rawness. I think this is the AKM velvet sound at play.

    Regarding Modi Multibit v2 - it has cleaned up a fair bit on the v2 but I think its still in the ball park of how you described it -- still a bit warm and mellow. For this reason I am going out on my limb here and will try out the d50s. (please don't ban me again for mentioning lol). Just to eliminate all the guesswork and see for myself how it stacks up.

    The Ifi Zen is a semi multibit dac -- i've heard that it gets the multibit goodness but the cleanliness of DS. how true is this?
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2019
  18. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    That was IFIs reasoning for picking the Burr Brown chip and it is a interesting theory.

    i still need to do more comparisons but from swapping back and forth with the Modi so far I would say the Zen has some of the "multibit sound" like I described with the Modi MB. Its bass is very punchy compared to the Modi 3 and noticeably more present. Its not as well separated as the Modi but the vocals are noticeably more intimate.

    I think the Zen is a bit warmer sounding than the Modi 3, its quite noticeable with female vocals they have some of that "smoky room" quality to them.

    I dont think its as clean and airy as the Modi 3 is though but its not too far off. I find the attack on lead guitars to be somewhat muted on the Zen compared to the Modi oddly enough. The fundamentals (i guess is the right term) of the guitar are more present with the Zen but the attack is stronger with the Modi. Its quite noticeable during solos.

    The only multibit dac I have heard is the Modi MB v1 but based on that experience I would say the Zen sounds like it sits somewhere between a D/S dac and a Multibit. Its a quite fascinating little dac.
     
  19. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    As I understand it, and may be wrong (please correct if so), most DS DAC ICs these days use multibit for a small number of bits. Not many true 1-bit DS DACs these days.

    The Burr Brown/iFi stuff in this regards is largely a marketing trick.
     
  20. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    From Schiit’s Bifrost FAQs:

    I see you named your True Multibit architecture. What, was there a sale on trademarks or something?
    No, we named it True Multibit™ because there’s a lot of confusion over what is really multibit and what isn't. Some companies refer to multilevel delta-sigma D/A converters (like the AK4490 used in the $99 Modi 3 and Fulla) as “Multibit” DACs. While kinda-sorta-maybe technically correct, this is pretty misleading. 2 to 5 bits of actual resolution plus massive amounts of noise shaping is not true multibit. Hence, True Multibit. We use True Multibit to denote DACs that have 16-20 actual bits, rather than multilevel noise-shaping delta-sigma DACs...
     

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