Nearfields for audiophile listening?

Thanks for the suggestion, i´ve already made my mind and will be getting the Hedd 20´s once i´m able to sell my Stellia´s and my Focal Shape Twins

 

Anyone have experience with the JBL LSR310S? Would primarily be curious about it being paired with JBL 3 series monitors but mainly want to know what people with good ears have to say about it. Been considering adding one to my desktop setup, want to replace my lsr308's with 305 MKII's and the 310S.

 

I have that and I do use it with the JBL 3 series, but I think I am a terrible person to properly review it though. It really is placement dependent, and I am too close for mine to shine at the moment. Similar other subwoofers in this price/class are also slightly smaller, which sounds like it wouldn't be a big deal but it really is. Those inch or so's really add up when you multiply them by several dimensions!

Anyways, (from my experience) what I would say is best about it is that it improves your midrange by reducing the workload of your main woofer on the speakers. I've heard this said before, like adding a subwoofer "opens things up" but I never really knew what that meant. To me, things sound more clear or "precise", I'm not sure how to explain it.

I'm not really getting the benefit of my sub till I move my ENTIRE room to a different wall, so I don't get that sexy bass benefit. For now, I've just increased my subwoofer curve in Sonarworks as to compensate. However... this thing can be f'ing ridiculous. I've read that because subwoofers they pump out large wave forms and interact with the air more, they essentially "expand" the size of your move. The first day I had this set up incorrectly, just messing with it, I was like "I'm going to get evicted within 24 hours" if I keep this up when others are home. You can "feel" this subwoofer, so I'm not doubting the power (I had mine on -10DBv though, which significantly increasing volume though).

EDIT: These kinda of suck at +4 dBv. There is a LOT of volume lost by doing that. Trying out Mackie XR624 and those are designed for +4 but if I set them both to +4, it's like the sub doens't even exist. What happens if I were to have the sub on -10 but the speakers on +4? I don't think I'm going to be able to balance them with the Mackies, even at full volume, ther isn't enough power.

 

I also got my Mackie XR624 today... First impression is that it sounds like a cheap ass speaker intended for listening to different frequencies to find people talking.. The woofer on one of mine isn't moving at all! Time to contact the dealer tomorrow.

Just trying to test one speaker alone is a terrible comparison, especially when I'm used to running my last ones calibrated, but why not!? So far I would say it sounds WAY less sharp or ugly than I expected. It actually sounds dark to me... What the hell!? I use this song to judge brightness: https://soundcloud.com/ritaora/only-want-you I was expecting it to sound harsh because of the aluminum tweeter and hard dome present. I also feel like I'm hearing the effect of the internal dampening. It just sounds drier than other intro speakers. I don't know what I was expecting TBH, but it's different sound, not overly analytical and harsh like Adam T7V.

Hiss level is more than I wanted perhaps more than T7V too, but I think I could get used to this maybe. The tone of it sounds more "pleasing" than JBL 306p for instance.

 

I don't claim "good ears" (here anyway) but I am pretty satisfied with that chain straight from the Bifrost 2 balanced. I would not suggest single ended at all.

The bass can get a little boomy but I suspect it is more room related than gear. My room is 21 feet wide and 31 foot long. Vinyl floor and 9 foot ceilings. The only thing that is not wood or steel is one leather recliner and one drafting chair. Super live room I am setup 1/3 length from the short wall. I believe a side effect of the long excursion woofer is the bass is not so fast but the crossover seems to free up the woofers in the monitors to really perform in the mid-bass region which really became apparent switching from Uber Bifrost to Bifrost 2.

Its boomy on ridiculous bass like Eryka Badu and Son Little tracks with super deep bass from an unknown instrument. I think the crossover works very well at 80 dB and not too much is lost to it. My laptop lives between the monitors and they are silent. To my ears it is very resolving with a huge phantom channel in the center. On some recordings the stage will wrap around the sides.
I never have to turn it down and I have a very low tolerance of anything sibilant. I did not shop for options since I wanted JBL 3 series since the LSR305s came out. That said I recommend the system if you run a balanced source and are not Hip Hop /Silly Bass only listener.

 

Does anyone have much experience with truly small monitors / speakers for on the go? I've got an Asgard 3 / Bifrost 2 and just want something that sounds better than our kitchen homepod (which sounds pretty good actually) and i can adjust from the amp. I've looked at the small 8010A Genelecs but they sounded quite steely up top with one note bass. I know i'm not going to get much bass extension but surely theres a <4kg (pair) option that sounds better than the apple can.

Note these are for listening enjoyment not any kind of audio work.

 

These seem to be the SBAF go-to for small powered speakers: https://vanatoo.com/shop/speakers/transparent-zero/

 

I've heard them and think they sound awful to be honest. Also can't bypass the inbuilt DAC.

I'd like to try the Neumann KH80 DSP, apparently the room wizardry is quite impressive.

 

How far are you sitting

I've once tried it at a sennheiser shop in a shopping mall. quite surprised they have it there since i don't think there are many mall goers that are looking for a $800+ studio monitors.

not much to say since they definitely didn't use the dsp for me to demo, but the sound is eerily close to the kh120

 

@purr1n Two subs is intriguing. I suppose I should place them even with the monitors in the room and feed one (left or right) channel from the Bifrost 2 into both channels of each sub or would I just feed one channel to one input of each sub? The sub has stereo inputs but not sure if I would be leaving half the wattage on the table only using one channel. The intriguing part is the idea of each sub only having to do one channel of the stereo like monoblocks and the room correction. Verrry Interesting....

 

Placing subwoofers even with monitors may (or not) reduce integration issues but room corners are usually the best locations to achieve lower bass extension. Subwoofer integration is a specialized art. It may be best to continue the discussion in the subwoofer thread: https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/general-subwoofer-advice-thread.8785/

 

@fsilva this is a solid recommendation. Call it a day! grande abraco amigo

 

Trying my XR624's Initial thoughts:

Pro

• They do have amplifier hiss, but it's on the quieter side. Can hear it a couple meters back but the tone of it or the way it carries makes it workable.
  
• Seems to have more detailed than anything I have used before. You can just hear "into" stuff
  
• I feel like I can hear the benefit of the internal bracing and better materials used. It just sounds a little more "still" even after calibrate

Con

• Definitely dark, the +2 treble switch does basically nothing to address this either (I'm in a bright room to begin with
  
• They measure like crap in Sonarworks at the moment (look at the treble)

Other:

• Like Luckbad also mentioned, the auto-off feature goes off at even low listening levels, making it practically useless.
• I wish these had native -10dbv option. My sub can't play well with these till I turn the monitors down even further and jack my sub up. I could mix sensititivies, but I kind of don't want to.

 

Really weird curve.
It looks like you have aligned measuring mic out of acoustical axis (check UM again) or maybe you should try to play with LF/Acoustic space settings ...
I can't imagine monitor designed with such HF. Usually they are little bright instead.

 

Do you think I should keep them though? I'm kind of burnt out with trying different things, and there aren't a ton of different options in this $500 category. They just continually measure like that, and the HF control really only controls the final 10KHz bump. I too am surprised. I don't even know what I want anymore. I want something with a lot of detail and power (I run Sonarworks and then realtime DSP and/or ReplayGain after the fact, so I can end up with a lot of negative gain in my signal chain), but still something "musical", whatever that means.

I remember trying the T7V thinking "this is it" beforehand, but they were strangely super harsh and analytical. The separation of instruments in songs was crazy good There is something crackling in the beginning of this song: https://soundcloud.com/crankdatmusic/reasons-to-run and it super upfront and noticeable with these speakers.

I think something like Presonus Sceptre S6 is more up my alley with having crazy coaxial design and DSP built in, but they are not known for having the best quality control or after the fact support. I just don't really have trust them. I see them as a super value for the price brand but with questionable design choices at times (like they do they run a forum for problems, but NEVER answer anything, years on end!? Why do their cheapo audio interfaces need to be turned up to max to get a signal? Charging $79 for VST support in Studio One Artist? I know why they do it, but it rubs me the wrong way).

I was really hoping that NAMM would unveil some sexy things, but there was slim pickings: I only heard of three things:

• Fluid Audio "Image 02" ($1300 each!?) 2 way speaker with AMT and super strange looking waveguide​
• Kali Audio JBL 7 series competitor (word of mouth only)​
• Output (the VST maker) 6.5" coaxial studio monitor in collaboration with Barefoot, supposed to be the best you can get for $669, available soon however​

I've decided that I probably will upgrade anyways this year to something way nicer. Even though I don't mix or produce music, I want something really nice and I don't spend any money on alcohol/cigarattes/children/etc. I wish JBL had something unlike their 7 series available. $1000 for a $5 inch monitor is not appealing to me. $2000 for an 8 inch!?

 

I've checked your graph again.
I'd say you should try out something else, not just auto-equalisation by Sonarworks.
My impression is that your room is really heavy reverberant, and you set "acoustic space" to corners (-4 db below 100) and still have boomy uncontrolled resonances everywhere.
Maybe you shall try out to measure and analyze results by REW if you already have measurement mic. Maybe you shall try out your real free space measurement in backyard and see if your speakers are really flawed or it's just a room interaction.
Placement and proper tuning is really important in case of speakers in a room.
Just for example - i have really flat on-axis midfields in dedicated room with a ###tload of acoustic treatment, and room itself can be considered absolutely dead, excluding just wooden floor. And different positioning "listener to speakers" change sound from dry, piercing and uncomfortable (additional 6 dB sawtooth in midrange at 1/3 oct smoothed graph) to clear, fast and precise.

I'm not sure that you can get something else musical if these troubles are due to room and placement/furniture bounce.
I'd check it before any hardware changes...
In my opinion, my PSI monitors are musical enough, but some others experience are different.
Maybe lot of detail and power with musicality can be get from Quested S8R, for example. Or big old Dynaudio in AB class. Don't know for sure what is musicality for you...

 

@Toolkit did you listen to HEDD monitors while you were at NAMM? Reviewers think HEDD, founded by the same people who founded ADAM, has tuned the harshness out of their monitors, while retaining the positive qualities of the AMT...

 

Yeah, it's a shitty untreated apartment room. It has a fair amount of space but hard floors and a tiny bit of echo. I'm not exactly sure how to treat the walls without f'ing the paint up at the moment. I have the Speakers at normal acoustic position (a), treble +2, LF to 80hz cutoff. I guess I just expected them to measure better then what you see.

The -4db below 100 is me trying to get the LSR 310S at a better level but it's not really set up optimally.

I forgot all about that program. Never used it before. This room is pretty shit though. I'm just surprised the monitors still measure with treble like that though, I thought it would be the opposite.

I must have hit the JBL LSR305 lottery then, because mine measured really flat and the amplifier wasn't noisy. I know the waveguide tries to take the room out of the equation, but I didn't expect it to really work as well as it did.

I just want to sit in the basic sweet spot lol.

It's definitely room troubles. I guess I'm just afraid of something being brutally honest or harsh for pure listening purposes. I listen to a lot pop music that's a victim of the loudness wars.

I've heard the same thing.


[/QUOTE

You goof. I've just been following what I've seen online. I've read about HEDD. They look pretty good but I read type 07 had a pretty tight sweet spot.

 

They're monitors, not PA speakers. The sweet spot isn't that tight.