Schiit Modius DAC announced

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by JohnCarter17, Jun 2, 2020.

  1. bunkbail

    bunkbail New

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    They're used at the heart of a certain Linn streamer which Torq waxed lyrical about a few years ago. Maybe it's not the chip's fault?
     
  2. GrahamB3

    GrahamB3 New

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    I ordered one also. I'm curious why you choose a DAC selling for 1/3 the cost of the D90 as comparison. Maybe the Schiit Factor?
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    OK. F me. Seriously F me. I didn't mind the Velvet Sound that much when the AKM Velvet Sound DACs came out. Heck it was mostly cheap DACs, so who cared. The immediately noticed benefits of greater resolution and more expansive soundstage seemed to outweigh the disadvantages. However @Psalmanazar pointed the Velvet Sound stuff out early on; and over time, I actually grew to dislike the AKM Velvet Sound - to the extent that I swapped out my son's Modi 3 with a Modi Multibit, because I couldn't bear the thought of my son listening to it.

    I didn't think this possible, but from the Modius' balanced outs, this Velvet Sound stuff is no longer. Or at least none of the disadvantages of the Velvet Sound (murky lows, recessed mids, soft attacks, raised last octave) but with all its advantages (resolution and expansive soundstage). Holy cow, this actually sounds like the older Modi 2 or other AKM4399, 4495 based DACs with the crisp attacks, evident mids, more palatable highs, bass textures, punchy bass even! After what seems like years, it's so nice hearing the E and A notes on a guitar not sound as they've been processed through a blender.

    The individual specific differences from the SE out aren't huge, but all the things little things add up to something pretty spectacular. I didn't know this, but evidently Jason's been reading SBAF and the few of us bitching about the Velvet Sound thing.

    upload_2020-6-3_21-30-45.png

    The downside: we will need an amp that will take balanced inputs.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
  4. Taverius

    Taverius Smells like sausages

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    That's great news.

    I gave a good friend a schiit mini-stack - eitr-modi2u-magni2 - as a Xmas present a few years ago but I've been reticent on making presents with the 3 because for all the resolution and other improvs it honestly felt a bit uck. (he asked about upgrades recently, I told him to buy a sys to make things convenient and ask again when he knew what sound he wanted)
     
  5. Melvillian

    Melvillian Friend

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    I’m curious about the USB input. My PC is super noisy and just sounds like shit via usb. Any impressions would be appreciated.
     
  6. SineDave

    SineDave Friend

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    For shits and giggles. I just enjoy comparing gear. I also own a Soekris DAC1541, RME ADI2 Pro, and an Oppo UDP-205 in addition to a large number of older DS DAcs.

    I still need to order @Psalmanazar 's recommended MOTU and Dangerous DACs to give them a shot, and am also looking for a deal on a Lavry.

    I have owned a Gungnir MB in the past, and plan to pick up a higher end Schiit option soon.
     
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Tone and harmonics remind me of the AD1855 based Convert-2. Not as much slam as Convert-2, but tonally, this sounds just right like Convert-2, with the added benefit of a more rounded and less vivid-mode presentation. Compared to the SE outputs, the balanced outs are less outright warm, more even, more clear, less veiled. Not as hot plasma gaseousness in the top octave too, therefore as a result more evident mids (as opposed to the typical Velvet Sound scooped mids). Attacks are more crisp, and yet at the same time not as annoying with the grain and prickly stuff (I'm intentionally using the balanced armature Aras to pick this up). Not quite the all encompassing warmth throughout the audio band like the Motu UltraLite mk4, but somewhat close, but completely without the prickly Sabre transients up high. Resolution is out of this world. I've been intentionally using lesser DACs to kind of come back to earth, and this is impressing to the extent that I can say "whoa, I never heard that on that recording before". (And really how often does that happen with modern DACs these days?) Ton of ambient cues, breaths, etc. I'm hearing on Joni Mitchell's Blue. Or maybe because it's Qobuz's Hires stream. :)

    I am using the USB input or Unison (in this case). I forgot to mention this. I figure these lower-end DACs and interfaces (D70, Modi 3, Motu) are more likely to be used with USB from computer. The only exception to this among the recent DACs was the Sonnet Morpheus where I tried USB (kinda poopy), but opted for the pi2AES as the source for most of the subjective listening evaluations.

    Well, I haven't had or heard the D90. The D70 which I recently reveiwed was $500, so Modius is 2/5 the cost. As for why I choose, it's all roughly $250-$750 range. Also, I wanted to show people why Topping was overpriced and how their engineers only concentrated on cookie-cutter designs or measurements. There's still an art to the science. And yes, there's the Schiit factor: Schiit saves you money from overpriced Chinese designed and made gear. I guess that's not fair.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    You know Schiit going to make something that matches the new form factor. I mean it's pretty obvious what's going to come next.
     
  9. gixxerwimp

    gixxerwimp Professional tricycle rider

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    What amps did you use to compare SE and balanced outs? Is it possible to make a fully apples2apples comparison? Or did you use a transformer to feed the balanced outs to an SE amp ...
     
  10. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    Hey Jason @schiit , very nerd question but which filter is the Modius using? Is it the same as the Modi or a different one?
     
  11. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Three setups: Jot, Magni ? (variant - some proto which may never be made) with the Cinemag 1:1 transformers, and Jot-R (with SR1a obviously). Differences between SE and XLR mentioned above were consistent among the three (still impressed how the Cinemag's translate so transparently). I also volume matched to account for SE and XLR output differences.

    Excuse the mess. Did all this in a hurry as I know inquiring minds want to know.
    IMG_20200602_211501.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  12. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    Time to replace your son's modi mb with modius!
     
  13. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I think that's fair. The Modius, especially from the BAL outputs is a purer DAC, better tech with Unison (less USB haze), and it something I feel is suitable for pro / studio use. It's normal-ish - not so colored. A good reference.
     
  14. raif

    raif Man made lobster/plankton

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    ASR just posted a great review of the DAC, giving it his highest recommendation. (if I am reading the pink panther correctly)

    If you want one, better buy one quick before the legions clean out the stock.
     
  15. pure5152

    pure5152 Friend

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    Congrats Jason, you've made something that gets highest praise from both ASR and SBAF. I think that's a big accomplishment (especially the ASR part haha) :p

    Damn this amp sounds tempting, just to hear what a good D/S dac can do. But I'm very satisfied with the synergy of my gungnir a2 + 3f, and have no interest in changing things soon. Looking forward to more impressions when people get it.
     
  16. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    I hate to ask but does running it balanced fix the one note bass? That comment alone almost saved me from aiming for this instead of a Bifrost 2, cuz... $400 difference hah.

    In terms of sheer resolution and spatial cues, how does it compare to the older Bifrost (pre-A2), if you can remember, and does it have decent "layers" instead of a plain ol' wall of sound like the OG Hugo did? Also wondering how upper end compares to micro iDSD on BitPerfect filter since that's what comes across as "level" to me.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  17. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Yes. Part of the one-note bass from SE is the OPA1662, which is a bit on the warm and maybe slightly veiled or fuzzy. The Hel and Heresy uses this part I believe, so there are some similarities in sound - more so warm and fuzzy with Hel (it's super weird how one starts to hear these chips). To get the point, there is no longer the one-note or murky fuzzy bass with the BAL outs*. Does the Modius have the most fantastic textured bass either? Nope, you are going to have to move up a bit to get that.

    The LME49724 used in the BAL outputs is one of those next-gen balanced opamps that sound really really really good - if implemented properly, why even bother with discrete - especially is its going to be a low cost product. If you liked the highs of the micro iDSD on the BP filter, then you will like the highs on the Modius. The balance of the iDSD Micro is tilted slightly brighter, not significantly so. The resolution of the Modius blows it away, but really different purposes since I've never heard a portable or transportable AIO truly beat a dedicated desktop unit.

    Headstage of Bifrost A1 still wins, but this really depends. I think most will prefer the overall expansiveness and deeper placed stage of the Modius. However, you want precise localization and layering with a more upfront stage and maybe less tendency for less hole-in-the-middle, the Bifrost A1 is better. The Bifrost A1 had a few other things weren't quite fully right.

    *Just looked down at the input selector to make sure it wasn't SE. <breaths sigh of relief>
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
  18. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    Think you saved me a fair chunk of change :))

    And yeah I understand asking for comparisons to transportables the like of the iFi and Chord stuff is odd, but that's more or less the limit of my long-term experience with DACs save for the older Bifrost MB. Appreciate it!

    Edit: LOL at wondering whether you were at SE or not! I used to be all for bigger headstage but lately began preferring more precise localisation at expense of smaller "platform", so I'm actually beginning to now wonder whether I should bother upgrading at all. Great to know Schiit isn't sitting on their heels, but also vaguely relieved it's not a categorical put down of my current reference :p
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  19. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    My 2 cent. Do not overlook the hidden price of "being balanced" if you don't come from balanced world. There are virtually no "super affordable 'and' super great sounding" balanced amps unless thx is your cup of tea. Good BAL->SE solutions are not cheap for what they are. When everything incorporated into equation, you will see a little different number.

    Price isn't quite right reason to go that way.
     
  20. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Modius is too good for THX amps.
     

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