Drop x iFi ZEN DAC Signature Review and Measurements

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by purr1n, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. fraggler

    fraggler A Happy & Busy Life

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    Unfortunately, the only reasonably priced connector of decent repute is from Plussounds and they are out of stock. So it is either $30 a connector of order a bunch from China (or buy premade ones that have the Chinese materials).
     
  2. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    Surf Cables can custom make a dual XLR->4.4mm cable. I had them make me one like that but with 3.5mm TRRS for use with the GOV2. IIRC it was about $90 for that a few years ago.
     
  3. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    We might at some point :)
     
  4. gixxerwimp

    gixxerwimp Professional tricycle rider

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  5. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    If someone is a fan of the Airist RDAC like I am, would I find Drop Zen to be similar with regards looking for a casual listening experience on my computer desk with the SW51+? I like RDAC with the Eitr box, but with Eitr to RDAC I do get audio dropouts. Also, it would be nice to have Source/DAC in one box and just have it feeding the SW51+ (I'm trying to reduce power cables in my computer area).

    I know the Zen isn't a darker DAC.
     
  6. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    @YMO : Assuming you meant Sig not Non-Sig, it's possible Zen-S may not be far from what you look for. However, please note that I didn't like Rdac much (+ I am quite generous to any modern digitalness and compression unless too overly done) and don't have it to compare side by side for now. So let me put this way..

    If you like Bifrost 2-like sounding, and fine with a little digitus added, then Zen-S is a worthy consideration. But if I were you, it could be a little nervosa to use it as an unbal source as I now know how much balances "unlock" some of the last bits in performance area.

    For dac-amp synergy, I really can't say much. I found both erish and magnius super-enjoyably harmonized with Zen-S -- to such an extent that I can debate about replacing my main dac. But both quite a lot depart from sw51.
     
  7. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    @Vtory yes I mean the Sig version that ATM is only available on Drop. Thanks for your input on this one, I'm very sensitive to digitus, however, doesn't seen @purr1n didn't really notice it when he had it for a bit. I don't care for balance since I'm on the SW51+ for my computer desk. I'll see if I wanna do a blind buy on this one. I like the tonality of my RDAC a lot for something on my computer desk which I don't want an analytical presentation.
     
  8. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    Yeah, that's why I thought it should call for your caution. I found rdac and modi mb too much anti-analytical (I'm not saying brightness at all btw) to my taste. And that said, I like bifrost 2, and give almost equivalent loves to zen-s.

    Surely zen-s can do much less aggressive presentation but it does incisiveness, low level articulation/differentiation, transient very well to my liking -- and based on what I think of our perceptional distance, all such might translate to "too much" for you. Unbal can alleviate (which translate to "less preferred" in my coordinates) somewhat though.
     
  9. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    WIth balanced connections, this dac gets all the jobs on my side perfectly done. I really liked its sugary and buttery (yet tad artificial) representation supported by solid technicality -- perhaps enough for critical purposes. Seems very promising downgrade.

    After hearing back and forth for a while, I finally joined the zen sig drop. My bifrost 2 will be up for sale in mid Nov.
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Have @Vtory send the Zen DAC Sig to you. The RDAC's USB sucks. The Zen DAC Sig USB isn't bad at all. RDAC sound is more out all vintage, even a bit NOS'ish. Zen DAC Sig much less so.
     
  11. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    That wouldn't be a bad idea. FYI: I'm using Eitr to feed my RDAC. RDAC USB blows.
     
  12. likearake

    likearake Acquaintance

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    @Vtory can you comment on differences compared to regular Zen? Not sure if I missed it.

    You mention it's clearly better, but is it similar sounding just a bit / a lot better in every aspect? Or different sound signature?
     
  13. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    Kinda both. Both has some kind of house sounding. And signature gets most things better (delta varies across criteria). But even considering that, I found signature has smoother and a hint of organic nature which wasn't quite the case with non-signature. Switching from sig to non-sig I found healthy difference in roughness.

    Another note is to me balance connection was sort of dramatic in signature, but much less so in non-sig.
     
  14. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    Since Drop allowed more Pre-Orders for the ZEN Signature for about five more days, I'll be the village dork and pre-order it without borrowing @Vtory's pre-production unit. As long as the sound doesn't bug me it should be a good match with the SW51+, hopefully.....

    Going from Eitr > RDAC to Zen Signature I'm expecting less darkness on the highs and maybe a little better imaging, but still musically that it isn't analytical up the ass (remember, computer setup I don't take music too seriously). It kind of helped that Drop keep giving out $20 coupons when you buy their stuff.

    I dunno if I should be shaking my head, but after all this time they only sold 103 of these thingies:

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    I think that number illustrates how difficult to market this specific segment. We're living in the post-ASR virus era. Average consumers may not imagine well what semi-affordable DS dacs without impressive sinad number are capable of and/or can bring to the table. On the contrary, r2r/multibits segments sell themselves as musically superior products. Consumers at least perceive so.

    104 (= 103 + YMO) is generated from such a context I believe.
     
  16. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    @Vtory I work for a big bank but I'm bad at numbers. :eek:
     
  17. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    I think its not selling well because the Zen Dac (not sig) is so much cheaper and offers a built in headphone amp as well. There arent enough solid reviews out there of it (thanks to Purrin and Vtory for the great reviews BTW). Absent of a lot of reviews saying that this Zen Dac is actually 130 dollars better than the base model which is a really great budget unit, you cant blame people for being skeptical.

    They also arent really pushing the DAC and instead mostly focusing on the AMP (ironic considering the DAC is actually more interesting IMO). All of the marketing basically only offers the dac as something you will want to bundle with the super awesome amazing amp.

    Going to be controversial I guess but I find IFIs marketing to be somewhat offputting in general, it sounds very used car salesmany. All of the stuff like the following:

    Before, your HD6XX sounded a bit like using a Mini to pull an Airstream.
    [​IMG]

    You are moving, but always wishing if you could ‘floor it?’
    With the iFi combo, as the saying goes, ‘there is no replacement for displacement’ so the ZEN DAC Signature and the ZEN CAN Signature give you turbocharged sound quality AND oomph to properly drive your Sennheiser HD6XX.
    [​IMG]

    When you ‘drive’ your Sennheiser HD6XX with the premium DAC & CAN Signatures, the full potential will be realised. We are talking 15v at 300 Ohms which gives the poise and power not found anywhere else. "



    Raises a lot of red flags for me and I am sure many others. There is a current environment of skepticism around this kind of stuff thanks the massive MEASUREMENTS OR BUST trend happening on reddit (as well as the large amounts of real snake oil in this hobby) and elsewhere and that kind of marketing is probably backfiring a bit.

    Drop and elsewhere is full of comments along the lines of "WHY PAY 500 dollars for this instead of 129 for the original which is almost both units in one!?" I think they should have added a optical input or something like that to give a clear, easy to justify reason to buy the signature over the original. The average drop consumer seems to not really be swayed by the concept that better components offers better performance which translates into better sound but I am guessing offering another input option or something like that would have increased sales as that would let people justify the purchase.

    I actually overcame my initial offput of IFI (which I have had for some time owing to said marketing) and tried the basic Zen DAc and thought it was a really great starter dac/amp, for people using something like a Grado or HD598 and the like it was easily a better deal than the Magni/Modi especially for people outside the USA who cant get those without spending a ton on shipping and import fees.

    I think IFI offers the best affordable modern implmentations of the Burr Brown chips and they do provide a nice alternative to the AKM/SABRE that basically 98% of affordable dacs use these days. I am very likely going to buy one of these myself to stack with the Archel 2.5 Pro as I think that will be a great combo based on the reviews here. Figured I would throw my two cents in on the mystery of low sales though :).
     
  18. Friday

    Friday Friend

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    I was quite tempted to get this, but now that I'm based in the UK, it doesn't make sense for me to pay extra VAT on importing it, especially when iFi itself is a UK company.
     
  19. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    I won't lie, it's brilliant :D

    Speaking marketing, super cool stuff for us:

    We’re excited to announce that our very own ZEN DAC has won ‘BEST DAC £100-£200’ in What Hi-Fi? Awards 2020:headbang::headbang::headbang::headbang:

    Here's the bugger: https://ifi-audio.com/products/zen-dac/

    And here's how posh it looks like with the award itself just next to it:

    [​IMG]
     
  20. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    @iFi audio waiting next month for the ZEN DAC Signature that I ordered from Drop. Wish me luck.....
     

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