Dummies Guide to Pi2AES! Throw away your PC or laptop.

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by purr1n, Jan 29, 2020.

  1. dubharmonic

    dubharmonic Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Likes Received:
    3,032
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Evanston, IL
    Can you expand on what you mean by sound quality here?

    @rhythmdevils have you tried completely disabling WiFi and Bluetooth on the Pi2AES, and moving everything far away from any routers, phones or computers? I've definitely heard WiFi and LTE signals add noise in the past.
     
  2. Michael Kelly

    Michael Kelly MOT: Pi 2 Design

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Likes Received:
    4,112
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Rhode Island, USA
    Home Page:
    It is possible that the PI2AES you have is more sensitive to power noise. As the PI CPU does it's thing, the current coming from the PI2AES 5V supply goes up and down. This can (and actually does) induce small changes in the voltage rails. But for that to then get into the signal, which is digital, is not something I can understand. I'd be happy to swap out the PI2AES if for no other reason than to eliminate it as a cause, and maybe keep your sanity!
     
  3. Walderstorn

    Walderstorn Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2016
    Likes Received:
    1,904
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Europe
    And it makes a world of difference right?! When i started this i also thought that "usb is practical" and "maybe they exaggerate about the difference to coaxial" but live and learn my friend.
     
  4. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Likes Received:
    585
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    Hi all! Trying to see if I can take i2S for a spin, out to my new Denafrips DAC. The DAC can be customized to just about any pinout, but I've picked a layout that most closely resembles the Gustard layout that I can find:
    Pin 1 +
    Pin 3 -
    Pin 4 +
    Pin 6 -
    Pin 7 +
    Pin 9 -

    When doing that, and verifying that I indeed have signal out of Pi2AES with a BNC cable, I do not get any sound or static or anything via the i2S input on the DAC. I read through the Pi manual and saw that the W1 jumper can be configured to send +5V out on pin 18. I currently do NOT have a jumper in that setting. I'm verifying with the Denafrips guy that I won't muck anything up by supplying 5V there, but can you confirm that in setting this jumper as I have now, that I will indeed put out +5V at Pin 18 going forward? I didn't have it set this way when I tried it initially, in case that's clear as mud.

    Thanks!
    [​IMG]

    And yea I know the jumper looks crooked but it is set across both of those first pins.
     
  5. Metro

    Metro Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2016
    Likes Received:
    1,590
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    San Francisco
    I'm obsessive/compulsive and it pains me to see the bits of adhesive paper backing still attached to the etched lettering. :p
     
  6. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Likes Received:
    585
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    Well if it helps, I have a whole new case on the way, and I'll try to do better next time :D
     
  7. Metro

    Metro Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2016
    Likes Received:
    1,590
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Re: Airplay vs Tidal/Qobuz streaming using MyVolumio:
    I just did a comparison and I do find the sound quality to be better when streaming Tidal/Qobuz direct using MyVolumio. When playing through the Tidal/Qobuz apps and casting to Airplay, some haze is added — background, detail, and transients are not as clean.

    This should not be surprising. Airplay transmits in 48kHz/16-bit ALAC and usually will not be sending the source stream bit perfect. The source is transcoded to ALAC and resampled if necessary to 48/16. Also the source is processed through the system audio mixer for alert sounds such as notifications. With MyVolumio, the Pi downloads a bit perfect stream directly from the server (at up to 192/24 resolution for Qobuz).
     
  8. scblock

    scblock Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2019
    Likes Received:
    1,419
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Denver
    I'm pretty sure it's 44.1 kHz/16 bit ALAC, but I'm on board with everything else you said.
     
  9. Metro

    Metro Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2016
    Likes Received:
    1,590
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    San Francisco
    You're right. A couple of Google search results said 48 kHz, but 44.1 seems to be the correct number.
     
  10. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2020
    Likes Received:
    12,237
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Bay Area, CA
    Home Page:
    I have everything plugged into one of these Furman Power Conditioners. And I also got my DAC and 789 using this Pangea Power cable.

    I never thought in a million years I’d get a nice power cable. But noise does crazy things to audiophiles I guess. Interestingly I actually think it sounds a bit better. Not worth the money but a bit more depth. These and the power conditioner is the only time the words “blacker background” have come to mind for me.

    so hopefully the power isn’t the issue. I do have my laptop sitting right next to the Pi2AES but only when it’s asleep.

    min wondering if the Pi2AES couuid actually be causing interference with my RCA switcher which is not grounded properly and has a partly plastic case. It’ll be interesting when I get my uber switcher done if that fixes it.


    thank you! I’m hesitant to take advantage of your generosity. It could also be the raspberry not the Pi2AES. I did just buy all the parts for a new separate Pi2AES from you for my speakers. Maybe just pushing up my ship date for that would be a safer option first. If the new one doesn’t make noise then I could take you up on a replacement.
     
  11. RedLipstick

    RedLipstick Acquaintance

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Likes Received:
    30
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Europe
    I'm not gonna lie, this pi thing sounds so confusing to me.

    If I were to buy this, would I be able to control/play the music from Spotify/Tidal/local disk accessing it from my PC browser ? I plan to have all ethernet cable, no wireless.

    And secondly, If I added the pi touch screen also to control the music, what would be displayed on the screen, the OS ui ? And does it allow to a easy control of the music?
     
  12. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,218
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Palo Alto
    Home Page:
    Any chance you can take the switcher out of the system for a while, or at least move it away from the Pi2AES, to test that hypothesis? Reason I'm saying that is that the only time I had some noise on my headphone systems was from RCA cables traveling too close to power cables. Once I rearranged the cables, problem was gone. (These days it's all XLR because of the DACs and amps I'm using.)
     
  13. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,218
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Palo Alto
    Home Page:
    With moOde: the screen shows a compressed version of the Web interface, which allows you to navigate around your music collection, play, pause, etc. This is for local music files only, though. I don't know anything about integration with streaming services, but others here do.
     
  14. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Likes Received:
    585
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    For anyone keeping score at home, I was able to get i2s running out to a Denafrips Venus II by adding that W1 jumper across pins 1 & 2. Haven't really listened yet, but I have sound.
     
  15. loadexfa

    loadexfa MOT: rhythmdevils audio

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2017
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    SF Bay Area Peninsula
    I was in the same place regarding confusion. It gets much easier but definitely seemed overly complicated to me at the beginning. Now that I think about it, I had the same reaction when I learned I needed an amp and dac for good headphones years ago. :D I found by simply building it and poking around everything became clear quickly. purr1n's instructions at the beginning of this thread make that process super easy.

    Yes, you can play Spotify and Tidal from your browser. For Tidal you would need the paid version of Volumio, Spotify doesn't have this requirement. If you don't want to pay for Volumio you can go the UPnP route which adds a little complexity but is easy once you have it working. I'm happy to provide guidance if you get stuck and others on SBAF know how to do this as well.

    Adding to what earnmyturns said, you can control Tidal and Spotify using a touch screen on Volumio. You can also control Qobuz if you decide to go that route but also requires a paid Volumio account.
     
  16. Erroneous

    Erroneous Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    May 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    2,895
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Texas
    @loadexfa I'm getting too many dropouts and times when it just stops working and I have to try to reboot everything and check settings with Audirvana using Moode and controlling with my Android.

    I've read in this thread that Volumio SQ isn't as good as Moode, so (if that's true) trying to stay away from Volumio so far.

    Any idea exactly what I need to do to set up Bubbleupnp to give that a shot?

    Just looking for best possible SQ with least possible hassle once I get past the initial setup process. Any input is appreciated!
     
  17. Michael Kelly

    Michael Kelly MOT: Pi 2 Design

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Likes Received:
    4,112
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Rhode Island, USA
    Home Page:
    Wishing everyone happy holidays and hopefully 2021 will be better for folks. also wanted to let you know that the free black case code expires tomorrow.

    I'm sure we will come up with something special for sbaf members since you guys are absolutely the best.
     
  18. Streamline

    Streamline New

    Contributor
    Joined:
    May 9, 2018
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Location:
    Boston, MA
    I just did this last night; used the Debian package directions from official docs; https://bubblesoftapps.com/bubbleupnpserver2/docs/linux_install.html

    Specifically; in a terninal on your rPi:

    wget https://launchpad.net/~bubbleguuum/+archive/bubbleupnpserver/+files/bubbleupnpserver_0.9-5_all.deb

    sudo dpkg -i bubbleupnpserver_0.9-5_all.deb

    but first make sure you have java installed and if not install openjdk-8 (also from docs above). It should come right up, detect your renders, and then allow you to create the OpenHome versions.

    Audirvana is not aware of OpenHome renderers though, so won't see the new OpenHome renderers. You'll have to switch to the BubbleUPnP android app, if you want to see the benefits of OpenHome.

    The bit path for Audrivana Qobuz is: Qobuz servers => your router => Audirvana => your router => Moode PnP Render => Hardware (I2S/DAC). The bits make three hops once inside your network. Note also that Audirvana is doing the FLAC decompression and sending WAV files to Moode.

    With BubbleUPnP server and the BubbleUPnP Android app it would be: Qobuz servers => your router => BubbleUPnP OpenHome Proxy => Moode PnP Render => Hardware. Because BubbleUPnP OpenHome Proxy and Moode PnP are running on the same rPi, there is only one local network hop, and less network congestion; could be significant if you're on a bad/overloaded wifi network. FLAC files are sent directly from Qobuz to the proxy. The Android app here is used only to load up the play list of the proxy, and then you can shut off the app.

    That said, the various buffers are generally large enough that you shouldn't be seeing drop outs. But maybe your local network is that bad.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2020
  19. loadexfa

    loadexfa MOT: rhythmdevils audio

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2017
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    SF Bay Area Peninsula
    I wonder if your issue is the Android app for Audirvana vs Audirvana hitting the Qobuz API. If the problem is some weird internet issue, that suggests you will have issues no matter which software you use. Fortunately you can try BubbleUPnP for free. I have found the Audirvana app for iOS to also be quirky so it could be simply the Android app.

    I'm not sure I'd call this sound quality, I think it's more a slight difference in presentation. I could go either way even though MoOde is my preference. I have a Volumio Pi for use at work due to the convenience of integrating Qobuz. I know rhythmdevils prefers Volumio's presentation over MoOde and he has a lot more audio expertise than I do. I recommend trying both and sticking with what you prefer, Audirvana and BubbleUPnP can stream to either one if UPnP is turned on.

    I don't have Android but my understanding is you simply need to download the app and ensure UPnP is turned on in MoOde, Volumio, etc. From the BubbleUPnP app, you should see MoOde as a device you can stream to. BubbleUPnP allows you to sign in to your Qobuz or Tidal account similar to Audirvana.

    At one point I had configured something similar to what Streamline is suggesting and is a bit more of a hardcore option. :) If you have local network congestion issues, going that route could solve your problem. Personally I'd try the easy option first (simply install the BubbleUPnP Android app and use it to stream to MoOde) and then go from there.
     
  20. Erroneous

    Erroneous Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    May 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    2,895
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Texas
    Network should be good. I have fiber internet and never had dropouts running laptop to dac and controlling via the app.

    I'll poke around with setting up Bubbleupnp. I'm definitely not married to Audirvana. I'm married to SQ 1st and ease of use 2nd.

    Thanks y'all!
     

Share This Page