43" TV as a computer monitor? Sony X800H

Just before launch day (move from CA to TX), my trusty 30" Dell which I purchased in 2005 and survived several moves from the Bay Area to SoCal and back to the Bay Area and SoCal, finally died. I felt good that I was able to use something for so long before its toxic components got dumped in China or Africa. Yes, the monitor was getting a bit long in the tooth with its craptastic shadow detail (there was none), washed out colors, and inability to get bright - but it worked and I saw no little to upgrade.

As my eyesight has gone to shit (it's really not that bad, but it's bad when I used to have better than normal vision, and now I have to strain in low light or when I am tired), I figured I'd try for a really big monitor where I can tell Windows to scale up things by 150%. I know some people freak out from large workspaces, but this is something I am use to from running two monitors side by side when there use to be a thing before COVID called an office building.

I did some quick research and found out that my choices were not too plenty. I didn't want to get a 50", because that would be too large of a workspace. I only needed 60Hz refresh (I think that old Dell was maybe 30Hz) and for sure wanted 4K resolution and 4:4:4 chroma subsampling so I wouldn't get oddities in the pixels. The Internets said time and time again that I would be well served by the 43" version of the Sony X800H. So did RTings, so I figured I would give this a try. FWIW, sometimes RTings is right, but most of the time DO NOT FOLLOW their advice because it's based on numbers and metrics which may not reflect upon your priorities. More on this later.

Anyway, I was more than pleased with the outcome. Colors are very good, shadow detail beats expectations, screen is bright, and text is sharp! One tidbit: only HDMI input 2 and 3 can do HDR and 60Hz. I used HDMI input #4 at first and couldn't figure out WTH was going on. Here it is set up at my temporary digs (disregard the fuzzy text, smartphone photo in low light):

 

The Sony X800H is an IPS panel. I discovered that I may prefer IPS panels over VA. In this case for computer use, I don't think I really had much of a choice. I am probably two feet give or take from the screen, and at this distance, the viewing angles to the center and to the sides of the screen will differ quite a bit.

A while back, I asked for advice on bigger TVs, and ended up with a 65" TCL 6 series which we eventually unloaded before our move for $150 without hesitation: https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/bigger-tv-65-recommendations.8390/page-2

In the end, both my wife and I disliked the TCL to the point where we went back to our smaller 47" Panasonic Plasma. The TCL looked good enough at Best Buy, perhaps at a glance beating the 65" X800H and rivaling the X950G, but in retrospect, this probably wasn't the case based on my hands on experience with the 43" Sony X800H. Do I wish we had gotten the 65" Sony instead of the TCL? Probably not since we would have unloaded it anyway (we were determined to move with only one Pod and get rid of anything that couldn't fit).

Seeing the Sony now, I would have to say that I much prefer the IPS screen, or at least Sony's implementation of it, over any VA screen from TCL (or Samsung) for that matter. The IPS does shadow detail (my primary criteria) better than the VAs. My experience with the TCL also revealed to me another criteria which I was not aware of until now. VA panels wash out everything into a nasty grew (again that shadow detail thing) off-angle, even a little bit off-angle. IPS seems to retain color saturation and pop off-angle, it simply gets darker. This was just one of those things that I guess I needed to experience myself. I guess I'm an IPS guy after all. Sure VA has higher contrast ratios with super bright screens, but this is low on my priorities.

Goes to say that I really hate RTings with their stupid ass numbers and scores and wished that there was an SBAF equivalent for TVs. RTings is simply a more advanced version of ASR. I wish folks at RTings had better eyeballs than measurement gizmos. What's wrong with people today?

But hey, people like numbers.

OK, now what video card do I get?

 

IPS has a richness to it that objective testing doesn’t seem to totally explain, regardless of monitor brightness and/or contrast ratio. Maybe it’s because of the viewing angles, or maybe another byproduct of the same underlying tech.

I actually think RTings does great work with displays overall. The scores are silly, but whatever. The test data is generally good. I feel confident I can buy a good TV or monitor based on their reviews. While I do still rely on personal experience, I don’t have to read between the lines with their display reviews. Can’t say the same for audio, there or from most other sites.

VA is like...weird TN. Contrast looks much lower than measured. Motion is more blurry like IPS. Lacks richness, washed out looking like TN. So you get none of the motion clarity benefits of TN, none of the richness benefits of IPS, and a subjective sense of meh contrast.

 

Yes, that richness is exactly it. It's viewing angle related. With the VA screens, just a few degrees off has subtle affects on the saturation and black levels. Colors turn more grey, blacks turn less black. It's subtle, but horrible for one who attuned. As with audio, some people will be more sensitive to this. Other less so. The longer I owned that TCL, the more I hated it. (Samsung I knew I didn't like because the dark greys and blacks were crushed).

RTings can easily measure for these subtle differences. It's a matter of the right measurement and the right visualization. However, this is not within their capacity nor would it be good for their business, especially if they barfed over all the Samsung, which is all VA. Most measurements that RTings offers for TVs is largely of low consequence or of little difference from model to model.

 

Honest question, are you aware of any display tests that can account for perceived richness or contrast as it might relate to common viewing, having two eyeballs, and so on? I have yet to find anything like that.

Good news is that it seems panel technology is moving very quickly these days. I was completely caught off guard to find both IPS and VA panels ready that do 240Hz at 1440p with adaptive sync. TVs still need a good kicking, but even there you can now find 120hz, adaptive sync TVs. I think it’s pretty exciting stuff!

 

I knew about the 7000 (super cheap at Best Buy), but opted for the X800G because of a slightly better viewing angle. Need to wait for RTings for the LG 43UN700. I didn't want to spend to much. The response time and 4K 60Hz 4:4:4 input lag (10.2ms) are already very good for the Sony.

 

I suspect the Viewing Angle measurements* on RTings has a very high correlation to "perceived richness or contrast as it might relate to common viewing, having two eyeballs, and so on?"

RTings has a lot of good measurements. They just don't know WTF to do with them and weigh them improperly to get at usable scores, that is scores that actually mean something. They make bullshit assumptions that higher contrast ratio means less grey blacks, or Movies score be improperly weighted with 25% contrast ratio and 25% local dimming. Local dimming suitable for movies? Seriously? I found local dimming to be so problematic on the TCL 6 (lots of zones too), that I simply turned it off.

The X800H here I am finding so much better for movies vs the TCL 6 I had before, despite the TCL earning a higher score for Movies under RTings. The only thing that TCL 6 did better was that it was brighter. It could get fricking bright with everything cranked up. The Sony's IPS panel has limits, it's performing perfectly fine in daylight.

* Specifically black level raise and color washout.

Theoretically if you are at proper viewing distance, it shouldn't make much of a difference per measurements. But sometimes simple measurements can be a indicator of what our senses perceive. Maybe it's something like polar response with speakers. Note the the TCL 6 below washes out the colors and pumps up the blacks as we go off angle. Maybe this has to do with color richness, even with on-angle or close to on-angle viewing?

The point of the large TV was to get close to it enough to have a cinema experience. If I can't do this without the colors looking gross, then what's the point? Maybe this is why I found the TCL 6 series VA panel picture to be rather gross with extended use. (The Sony maintains color to 10 degrees. The TCL colors start to wash out immediately off-angle.)

Here is the X800H


Here is the 2019 TCL 6 which I had

 

@Hands (or anyone else): Will I need a uber graphics card if I want to run Warhammer Total War 2 in 4K? What should I get? So confusing. I thought AMD was the uberist just a month ago. I haven't taken a full two weeks off ever since I can remember. Going to enjoy the beaches with kids and then game in the evenings all of next week.

 

I still have a GTX670.

 

There is simply nothing available right now. People are even price gouging for GTX 1080Ti.