ETA Genesis-G/P Impressions Thread

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by dematted, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. Philimon

    Philimon Friend

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    Ev sent me a specially tuned GenG that he thought I might like. It was fantastic except for one sore spot: 2kHz peak. Just painful.

    Ev is an unbelievable modder. We just have a disagreement on target response and different areas and degrees of sensitivities or priorities. I feel everything should sound a little more like Porta Pro. Whatever mod I made here is not new to Ev. He has explored many manners of tuning at dreadful length. He knows what the headphone will sound like by me just describing what mods were done...

    mod19 is intended to address the 2kHz peak which I find very fatiguing. I described fatigue in my original GenG 1.0 impressions earlier in this thread. Time with other headphones since then has led me to conclude that 2khz area peaks or bumps sound anywhere from dry to painful to me. GenG possibly has some resonance issues at that spot which makes it extra bad. Sort of measured by @purr1n 's CSD measurements. Ev explains this is part of the reason for the Gen makeover. *If these links don't work it's because they go to the club room.

    mod19 reduces front wave airflow to increase warmth thereby reducing 2kHz+ in relation. Driver control / damping may be higher but their are trade offs. It's a different set of compromises that suit me better. Gen1.0 was another set of compromises sort of chosen by Ev. Ev I feel personally prefers a warmer tuning than what he sells as standard in consideration of popular preference. The easily tweakable enclosure is the concession.

    mod19 compromises by making bass sustain and impact higher than natural imo, on verge of unpleasant or fatiguing. A more closed sounding headphone unfortunately. In return you get less 2kHz. The 2kHz peak in Gen 1.0 made vocals sound tinny.

    GenG 1.0.jpg

    ETA graphene drivers are more capable than THX00 drivers. The bass is awesome. The highs and mids are comparable. THX00 mids/highs is behind 6XX mid/highs. 6XX I put behind THX00 because 6XX bass suuucks (preferences what can i say). GenG is smoother too all around VS THX00 (problematic 2kHz area is debatable, THX00 has a bump there but not painful just dry). Interestingly I've tweaked both headphones to have similar responses.

    [​IMG]

    mod19 is my 19th mod in just a few days. It's the first mod I really liked and didn't find painful.

    Ev has apparently mostly rectified 2khz peak with GenG 1.1 update. Unfortunately this enclosure is flawed so would suggest getting the new enclosure rather than trying to work around.

    @E_Schaaf When will new enclosures become available? Supra I imagine will not have this 2kHz resonance or reverb flaw. Was this 2kHz issue discovered due to Supra enclosure prototypes sounding better in that particular area than Gen enclosures with the same drivers?

    I don't know what else to write for impressions. I'm still learning. Soundstage is okay. 1.0 tinny vocals also sound kinda tiny. Micro and macro dynamics are very good in the bass department.

    Oh yeah! Comfort is greatly improved due to Ev kindly stretching out the 58X headband for me. But this had a backfire. The stock angled pads were not consistently getting a proper seal due my long hair. This would cause bass to reduce and 2kHz levels to rise which caused intense ear fatigue. Padrolling led to the answer. More typically shaped pads held seal just fine on my head. ETA GenG pads are angled vertically and the angle is sharp. Flipping the stock pads around didn't really help.
     
  2. Philimon

    Philimon Friend

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    GenG mod19.jpg
    GenG mod12.jpg

    mod12 is same as mod19 except the cup vents are not plugged in mod12. Unplugging the cup vents fixes the overwhelming bass pressure and closed sound (improvements in bass sustain, soundstage, airiness, etc). mod19's overwhelming nature is a feature to mask 2kHz issues. mod12 preferred. I think I'm adjusting to once were previously issues (2kHz). Just wanted to show that the measured frequency response difference is nearly nil, but subjectively a much more obvious difference.

    GenG was designed with lots variables in place for tweaking to individual preference. A polarizing or under appreciated feature.

    mod12:
    - Accessory House lambskin pads for TRX00
    - TRX00 donut ring foam (denser to reduce airflow). This replaces the stock front-side white donut ring foam in GenG. An exact fit, drivers are same size.
    - Rear-side center driver magnet vent is sealed (I used electrical tape). Cotton rolls removed and replaced with foam cut to size. The cotton rolls were losing shape and not seating properly due to frequently removing for trying mods so had to replace. Foam is used for the same principle of damping driver. I don't have specs or source for ordering this specific foam. The foam was a happy coincidence. They are/were port plugs for my bass reflex speakers.

    [​IMG]

    edit: fixed attachments
    edit2: Forgot to add this measurement. It was the GenG tune sent to me but using mod12,19 AHlns pads. As you can see it was very good except 2kHz.:

    GenG Phil AHlns.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  3. dematted

    dematted Friend

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    Gen G Amplification Recommendations

    Several reviewers here have remarked that Gen G changes a good deal with amplification. In my experience, that's true, but that's not to say that one requires TotL amplification to enjoy Gen G. In fact, the headphone was developed using fairly modest amplification (Valhalla 2), and a number of users currently enjoy it with a range of what most on SBAF would consider "budget" amplifiers.

    I thought it would be useful to compile a list of what amplifiers people have tried and enjoyed with Gen G for future purchasers of the headphone. In my experience, Gen G works best with neutral to bright amplifiers that have excellent control over the driver, portray microdynamic nuances excellently, and have solid staging/layering capabilities. I personally enjoy Gen G out of lower-ohm outs, but this is by no means a universal preference. Without further ado, here's our list. Keep in mind that this is preliminary and subject to change as more people get ears on this headphone.

    Cheap

    Fulla E: A number of people have hopped on board the Fulla E, which comes with an in-built dac using an ESS chip. This amp supposedly has a great deal of energy, and it comes endorsed by both @tommytakis and @Merrick.

    Valhalla 2: One of the amps that Gen G was originally developed on. It complements many of the Gen G's weaknesses with its expansive staging and mid-centric tonality, and Gen G's smooth lower treble in turn helps temper some of Valhalla 2's characteristic dryness.

    SW51+: A classic SBAF favorite, more than one Gen G owner have enjoyed how this combo works. Like the valhalla 2, the somewhat mid-centric tonality of the SW51+ helps patch up the perception of some that Gen G is V-shaped. Be warned, though: some say that the Gen G loses some of its magic in the bass with the SW51+, which has a bit of a weak spot here.

    Mjolnir 1: It's hard to find this amp nowadays, but both @Vtory and @Azimuth have spoken enthusiastically about how well this synergy works. The mjolnir 1 is an incisive amp with clean, straight lines and an engaging, relentless sound. This amp is not for those who want to relax, and its impactful macrodynamics and expansive soundstage both pair extremely well with Gen G by all accounts I've read.

    Expensive

    Quicksilver Headphone Amp: A neutral tube amplifier with just a hint of romance, reviewers say this brings the best of SW51's qualities without the weakness in the bass. For those who want to spend some money on a tube amp but aren't quite willing to go into Starlett territory, this is an excellent option.

    Starlett: Although this is a SET amp, it has a neutral to bright sound that complements the Gen G well, and a sense of spaciousness, nuance, and resolution that synergizes nicely with the Genesis.

    To be investigated:

    Lyr 3: @ColtMrFire loved this pairing, and I'm going to get my ears on it soon!
     
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    Last edited: Nov 5, 2021
  4. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    Can confirm the synergy with Mjolnir 1, and the Gen G scales up to the Rag 1/1.5 without breaking a sweat.

    I bet the Lyr 3 with a laid back tube and the ESS card would be a hell of a combo.
     
  5. jaker782

    jaker782 Friend

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    I can also confirm the MJ1 is an excellent pairing with Gen G. The bass rumble these drivers can provide gets even more enveloping, realistic, and impactful powered by the highly dynamic thunder of Mjolnir's hammer! If you enjoy bass slam, this pairing is the ticket!

    I also concur that the MJ1 is an attention grabber that is not for those wanting a more laid-back, relaxing listen. I am sort of in that boat so have a love-hate relationship with this amp. It is undoubtedly fantastic, but for me, the MJ1 is a bit too forward and energetic for everyday listening while working from home. However, for late night listening when I can focus on the music without distraction, it is terrific!
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2021
  6. sheldaze

    sheldaze Friend

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    I agree with this. 3F and GenG are good, but - it is not the synergistic pairing, worth saving up for the purchase of a 3F to only drive the GenG.

    I have been switching between 3F, BW2, and Starlett - I actually like the Starlett, which I feel is bright, however with the DNA way of taking the edge off the brightness. DNA somehow manages to change the bright into useful, high frequency sound and space perception.

    You also mentioned driver control - my big surprise was the McIntosh MHA150. This is the only setup where I have heard the tight, precise deep bass driver control. It surprised me mostly because I considered this to be a planar-only amplifier. It was synergistic to the point where I was sometimes using the built-in Sabre DAC (yuck) because the overall sound did things with the GenG driver I had not heard elsewhere. It digs in and plays to the strengths of the GenG. I have heard from friends that the BHA-1 is also excellent!
     
  7. jaker782

    jaker782 Friend

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    Another excellent tube amp pairing falling somewhere between the cheap and expensive tier is the Quicksilver Amp. This is a SET amp similar to the SW51+, that is also somewhat mid-centric but overcomes the weaker bass of that amp by providing a much more satisfying low end that really digs deep and doesn't soften the impact of Gen G drivers like the SW51+ can. The QS is highly dynamic with good staging and instrument separation with some of that tube magic thrown in that results an extremely euphoric, engaging listen with Gen G. @Ksorota also uses this amp pairing.
     
  8. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    The thing about MJ1 and Gen-G that go together like bread and butter is the low end definition. Some amps, like my Dynalo clone, is warm, but it just throws the low end around. The MJ1 is there, well textured, controlled, but you also have to remember this is an incisive amp and demands attention. It also brings out more detail for more of that plankton stuff.

    The Rag 1.5 (and I would also assume Rag 1), is even more so. It is like a grown up MJ1 and addresses the lost details of the MJ1. Where MJ1 is aggressive, then Rag would be more effortless.

    Any amp that can handle higher impedances with ease should be no issue. But just like with higher impedance headphones, there is a scalability there. I would say they are a few db easier to drive than HD600/650. You mostly have to watch darker tilted amps, since they already a touch darker than neutral.
     
  9. dematted

    dematted Friend

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    Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I updated the list in accordance with some of the suggestions given.

    If anyone else has any additional corrections, caveats, criticisms, or castigations, feel free to throw em out here!
     
  10. ShaneD

    ShaneD Facebook Friend

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    So, are these still in the testing phase? When might they be available?

    All the reviews sound very interesting and I am curious about the final product.
     
  11. SCARED

    SCARED New

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    Soon, your patience will pay off. It's gonna take some time as we strive for perfection. :3
     
  12. Jinxy245

    Jinxy245 Vegan Puss

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  13. SCARED

    SCARED New

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    Thanks for welcoming me, jinxy245. Also nice cute cat PFP.

    I'm SCARED or Gan K X, the headband developer for ETA Headphones.

    SOOo.. to give you guys a little more confidence in Gen G2 (that's what I'm calling it), I'll talk about the headband development during the 3+ months period of me being onboard.

    After over 14 iterations; each with its own unique takes- seeking for a manufacturer to partner with (I swear, I wasn't trying to flirt with them), and taking a lot of coke (not cocaine; cola)- we've finally got our rough model in place for production, but further refinement required.

    I can't leak anything as they're confidential but I would say this: the headband design consist of ETA's signature Scandinavian looks(opinion) with my exotic twist and elegant engineering. The main objective for ETA has always been using the KISS approach for maximum cost effectiveness, excellent comfort with a high quality built as possible. ETA Headphones has always meant seriously business and no BS, so we're not gonna do anything unnecessary because ETA doesn't want to make customer pay a premium n'or wait for a Senn HD band to be in stock.

    I'll elaborate a little more here:
    The headband has to be a tall boi so it could stretch wider to compensate extra thickness from the foam housing and pads.
    I think the production version of Gen G2 would weigh less than 250 Grams without cables, even with extensive use of steel.
    We've learnt to avoid many mistakes from other headphone manufacturers.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 9, 2021
  14. loadexfa

    loadexfa MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Impressions

    Summary
    The GenG prototype loaner comes with some really interesting tuning mods, which were good for me to get to know the range of what these headphones were made to do. I'm not sure if all the "tuning bits" will be limited to the early tour here or will be included with the full-production model, but the mods helped me tweak the sound closer towards my preferences.

    After trying some tuning variations, I still found the mids too recessed for my taste. I think these are great if V shaped tuning is your preference, the bass is strong yet with a little less punch so it's not as overpowering and the upper mids/lower treble are brought out clearly and tastefully.

    For anyone else on the loaner tour, I highly encourage you to check the tuning info. Even a simple change, such as changing the foam between the cup and ear pad, changed these from "bass heavy" to "neutral-ish" (mids still further back in the mix).

    Chain
    Roon (Redbook/Qobuz) -> Pavane -> Freya S (passive) -> Stratus (briefly with the MJ1 as well)

    I tried with the MJ1 and Stratus and found them far too punchy with the MJ1. I can get fatigued easily, so Stratus was much better and where I did the remainder of my listening.

    Since other reviews compared these favorably to the OG Clear and Auteur, I focused my time with these.

    Comparisons

    GenG
    • Powerful bass and solid punch
    • Nice treble clarity without being overpowering or fatiguing
    • Very tunable
    • Least detailed
    • Sometimes instrument separation and air was lacking
    • Sometimes tone of brass instruments sounded off
    • Unable to tune for my preference. I found the mids lacking and the sound either too fat or thin depending on mods.

    OG Clear
    • Most "crisp" of the three (including mids and bass)
    • "Neutral" tuning more to my taste
    • Good detail without being too in your face
    • Can be fatiguing due to Focal "energetic presentation"

    Auteur (suede pads)
    • Most laid back of the three
    • "Neutral"-ish tuning with some bass emphasis
    • Favorite tone/timbre of the three
    • Bass is the most controlled, although elevated very tasteful
    I appreciate the chance to try these, I know a lot of hard work that was put into them. I think the GenG performs at their best when set for more V shaped tuning and this strays too far from my taste. If you like V-shaped tuning, you should definitely try them.
     
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  15. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I wrote up a review of the Gen G. And then I realized that being staff, and working on possibly starting a headphone company myself, albeit with different driver technology, a different target sound, and different methods, I feel like I should stay neutral on this one. So I'm going to pm my review to @E_Schaaf and @tommytakis

    They're not staff though, and I would love for them to write impressions of my headphones when they get them on any of my upcoming loaners.

    Unless someone convinces me otherwise this feels like the best thing for community health. Because I love ETA, both Ev and Tommy and don't want to start any competition. I hope to help each other out actually whenever possible.

    Cheers,
    Whitney
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2021
  16. Philimon

    Philimon Friend

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    @rhythmdevils Add MOT to your list of titles, then share impressions. You do already have a ortho mod business... There is conflict when you review Audeze loaners and you sell Audeze mods. You are staff though.
     
  17. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    I agree with giving him a MOT title if that's applicable. But not with the latter. Most MOTs in SBAF hardly (almost never) post impression on others' products probably for the neutrality reason RD wrote above. If you're still curious, shooting him a PM would be a better way.
     
  18. Philimon

    Philimon Friend

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    He usually doesnt respond to my PMs. :(:oops::D

    “Most MOTs”. @rhythmdevils writes about Audeze. Do they know he has an Audeze mod biz when he asks for loaners from them? If he had a MOT title it would be obvious. @purr1n works at Schiit (for fun). I love @purr1n but thats seemingly a conflict of interest. I know Purr1n will write negative opinions on Schiit products, but it can look bad from outside.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2021
  19. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    This is premature. I’d rather take it one step at a time to not create expectations. I’m just being careful. I’ll do what’s appropriate when the time comes. Anyways this thread should be about Gen impressions not me.

    back on subject please :)
     
  20. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    I think it's ok for MOTs to review each other's products so long as they don't directly A/B compare them against their own offerings. But with references and comparisons to other well known headphones I think it's ok, or at least that's how I've approached it.

    Edit - there's nothing in your review I felt shouldn't be read by public eyes. You were honest and fair, your feedback is valuable to everyone :)
     
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    Last edited: Nov 19, 2021

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