Grace m920 purchase decision

Hi all!
My current audio gear is low/mid-fi (Aune X1s + Matrix m-stage hpa-3u & hd650 + he-560). I'm a headphone user and definitely not a professional. I came across a lightly used Grace m920 which I can buy for around $1100, which piqued my interest. I'm trying to understand how good a deal it is.
I find that in the same ballpark there are other options like

• Oppo HA1 - nice display, balanced output which has a nicer display and provides a balanced out.
• Oppo Sonica Dac - Dac only, network streamer, supports thumb drive, has 9038pro Sabre chip, $300 lesser than what I would pay for Grace m920

May be there are even more options that I'm not aware of and am interested in knowing. I looked at the deals page here and in other places; i don't see Oppo products going on sale prices.

If I pick any of these units I'm sure I wont have the money to update anything else for at least the next couple of years. I don't want to face build quality issues so durability is as important as sound to me; I want the unit to last at least say 3-5 years

Has anybody tried any of these dac/amps. What are your thoughts? What would you do if you were in my shoes?

 

Marvey, do you think Oppo/m920 is a side-grade from M-stage? May be I don't appreciate what I have enough? As to waiting for a few months, I guess you must have a product in mind when you say that but can't disclose more info . If that's the case I can wait!

 

First of all, don't fool yourself into thinking you're in low-fi. You've got a very solid setup where you are right now; be happy with that and try to avoid the endless upgrade nervosa.

That said, 1.1k is an ok but not great price for a used m920. I know I've seen them go below 1k before. If you're curious about the Grace gear, the m9xx is significantly cheaper. Also, the Oppo HA-1 is terrible. I very rarely say that about dacs because I think most of them above the el-cheapo point are actually quite reasonable and people are just far too picky, but the HA-1 is one of the very few that made me actually take my headphones off and wonder if something was wrong.

 

This may be the first time I'm seeing someone being critical of HA-1, which is really awesome as it balances out adulation and fanboyism. May be the reason I feel M-stage is not as good it really is because of lack of synergy with hd650. This combo puts me to sleep every single time I try it. Aune X1s (being a bit bright) + M-stage + HD650 is slightly better as it's not so dark sounding.
My HE560 is stuck at my friend's place; I haven't tried it with the Matrix; hopefully that will be better.

 

Does the latest iteration of the M-Stage let you swap opamps? It's not something I usually recommend because that way lies more madness, but if you have a tweaking mindset then you can try a couple of the cheaper alternatives just for the fun of it.

Or if you want to keep yourself occupied instead of constantly reading reviews about new toys to buy, get a Bottlehead Crack and learn to solder. Mind you, that way could potentially lead into the DIY pit of doom, so advance at your own peril (but seriously, the Crack is classic pairing with the Sennheisers).

 

Or, if I may suggest, while you wait - pick up a little diy project and build a Crack. Love what it does with my hd650. Cheaper rolling tubes in it too. Will keep you busy in the mean time.

 

I want to try out tubes sometime. I live in India, it's going to be too hard (heavy) for me to carry a tube amp from the US. Getting it delivered to my place safely is going to be pretty expensive too . That's why I have to stick to solid state amps for now.

Yes, matrix m-stage supports opamp swaps. I have to try it out sometime, though I'm not sure how much difference i will hear. There are posts in the head-fi forum about modding M-stage, which is also quite interesting.
The m920 option I bought is an Amazon warehouse deal and it said 'Used - Like New' and I bought it for $1000 + change ($900 for the product and rest in taxes). I haven't bought anything from Amazon Warehouse, so not sure how good it's going to turn out. Good thing is I have the option to cancel the order or return the product in 30 days.

 

Wait, you already bought the m920? I would take the previous advice and cancel that purchase. I was really underwhelmed by it, especially considering the price.

 

That's not necessarily true. I live in the same city and I got the BH Crack+Speedball imported at a very reasonable price. I have had heavier amps imported pretty safely but yes, at a more expensive price point. PM me if you have interest in importing the BH Crack.

 

Ya, I ordered it as there was an option to return it. Do you mind sharing why you aren't enthusiastic about it and which alternate gear you are using?

 

It's good to know you could import it. PM'ing you inquiring about the details

 

I wanted to recommend a modded crack earlier but thought it might be too warm for you. It's a very fun and engaging amp, but I suggest speedball plus choke and upgrading the output coupling capacitors. That'll raise the price so keep that in mind. you should be able to find Mullard CV4003 tubes easily in your area, but they're expensive and so are the better output tubes like the TS 5998

I honestly would suggest waiting for what Marvey was hinting at earlier. I don't know what it is, but I would follow his advice.

 

It was a matter of synergy, whether it was with 598, 600, 800 (mine), m50x or X2 (the owner) nothing excited me. Since I had (still do) have the crack the different in "enjoyment" was the biggest difference.

I won't use the proper lingo, especially because many times it's badly used (usually I let that for the ones with proper knowledge and experience).

To make it easier here is the rest of the gear we used that day:

Bifrost 4490
BH crack + speedball (mine)
Asgard
Vali 1 (mine)
A chi-fi dac which name I can't even remember.

So i can resume by saying the sound was dull and unexciting. Tending it was the most expensive (by far) piece of gear it was an underwhelming experience.

 

I thought I've seen the same unit on massdrop new for 1100. No matter what i'd say a higher price than it should be used. It all comes down to opportunity cost though ~ whats available when you want to buy it. Good Luck.

 

I received the m920 (Used - Like New) early this week and I thought I could share my quick impressions. This is a Rando’s opinion, so please take it with a pinch of salt.

Packaging was packed pretty good, came with a manual print-out, a pretty good mini-usb cable, a power chord and a bunch of screws.

The dac/amp itself is pretty to look at and is also feels sturdy (not that I am going to do a drop test).

I’ve come to the US on a business visit, so I brought only my HD650 and Fiio X5ii and the rest of my desktop gear is back home. I have had my 650 and fiio for more than 6 months, so I am familiar with how

they sound. I also bought a nuforce HA-200 amp, to setup the following chain Mac (Audirvna) -> Aune X1s -> Ha-200 -> HD650. Probably not the greatest setup for HD650, I am hoping it won’t be ridiculously bad either. The Grace m920 was an impulse buy, a Used-Like New item from Amazon; where I thought it was a decent deal and could return it if I din’t think it won’t be substantial upgrade from my home setup. Since I don’t have my complete setup with me I only have to compare Grace with my home setup by memory (which in itself is hard, esp when done by an amateur).


Grace m920 vs Fiio X5ii / HA-200 (HD650)
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Grace m920 gives a much darker background compared to the Fiio/HA setup. Also Grade gives a nice 3d effect which the other setup lacked. In comparison in Fiio/Nuforce compressed all layers together and presented a much more 2D picture. If I was comparing video I would have said Setup 1 was much sharper and clearer. I don’t know how to describe it in audio terms though. Surprisingly Grace was, at times a tiny bit harsh and sibilant when I play low res files. Not sure if it’s improved clarity that I am perceiving as harshness, but this’s what I am hearing. Setup 2 wasn’t too pleasing to listen to either though. It definitely sounded like a few steps behind Grace. Back home I have compared Fiio’s line out vs Aune’s and Aune was leaps and bounds better in terms of space, realism etc. so I am hoping the real limiting component is the Fiio.



Grace m920 / Grace m920 -> HA-200 (HD650)
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After the previous Fiio/Nuforce combo was underwhelming I was curious about how replacing Fiio with Grace would fair. I was pleasantly surprised that this combo was much better and sounded pretty decent. Of course it wasn’t in the same level as using Grace alone. Grace, once again had much blacker background, better imaging, gave better sense of space, but nuforce wasn’t as far behind as it was earlier. May be if I were a bit more experience I would have identified more differences and certainly articulated them much better.



Grace m920 -> HE560
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Lows & mids are pretty good, esp. vocals are beautiful in clarity (in terms of tonality I think i still prefer the 650). But I think the highs are a bit too much. The 560s are pretty new, they have around 25 hours in them. Even if the highs settle down a bit after they’re broken in I’m not sure if I will like them as much. This combo is nice; not toe tapping nice; not $1000 nice.



Conclusion. So, even if I choose to keep Grace it won’t be too big an upgrade for my setup (considering I paid $1000+ for it). So, sorry Grace you will need to find another home.


Conclusion: Compared to Fiio/Nuforce setup Grace was much better. However from a value standpoint I believe Aune X1s -> Nuforce Ha-200 will be, say 80+% close to Grace (whatever that means). To me, it’s still too pricey for what it does and I will be returning them soon.