HD600

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by SpaceLaser, Oct 8, 2015.

  1. Mr B1

    Mr B1 New

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    I had the HD600 on my old 'I-just-don't-get-the-hordes' list: glary, lack of bass, fatiquing. Anyway overhearing the comments of the locals at the bar convinced me to give this another try, so this week I borrowed them again from my collegue and took them home... and wow - it was all due to p**s-poor upstream. I can not get over the 'free from transducers', absolute positioning of sounds in space and naturalness of the sound including the overtones and transients of struck pianos and plucked guitars. I'd say there's even more plankton than the Ether 2 (although it's still a new pair).

    After swapping Japanese 6EM7s for Philco 6FD7 (darker, more dynamic/impact) on my tubeamp, it seems I've got a nice pairing for the HD600 as it dishes out the speed and beautifully textured, present lows on the level of my Violectric V220, yet goes a bit easier on the treble which is on my border for comfortable. We'll see where this goes, I've ordered the 6XX now. The only headphone that I think is not on route to getting the flick, is the Verum which very nicely complements the HD600 in the sense that it trades some qualities for others - but it's a fair deal.
     
  2. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    I had a little trouble with a buffering preamp at first, but after I got them attached (ifi 'phones amp) to the purely passive output, I never heard a fatiguing sound from them. It was like old-fashioned hifi speakers all the way! And if it wasn't for the HD800s acting as hearing aids for my now mostly-missing HF hearing, I would probably still be listening to the HD600s.

    So, while upstream can count, I can also say that, except for lack of volume, they also sounded good plugged straight into my phone.
     
  3. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    After my loaner time with the 600, I went ahead and picked up a pair. $199 brand new from TMRaudio...I couldn't resist.

    Many have said that there's no point in owning the 600 AND 650 since they're more the same than different, but that hasn't been my experience. Yes, there are similarities, but I'm finding that specific albums are clearly better with one choice or the other.

    It varies significantly depending on how well recorded the album is, genre, guitar type, etc.

    Eric Clapton - From the Cradle really highlighted this for me. The 600s left me in a puddle on the floor...so good, vibrant, and present with great guitar crunch and energy. The 650s sounded fine, but couldn't compete. The guitar sound was more rounded and lacked bite.

    Then, you switch to something like The Cranberries, and the 600s sound fine but rob the songs of that dream-like quality that the 650s portray so well.

    One headphone will live mostly at work with my Modi 3/Vali 2 combo and one will live mostly at home with my Gungnir MB/Liquid Platinum...I haven't figured out yet which headphone meshes better overall with each system.

    But, I think there's absolutely room for both in your headphone stable. I'm glad I gave the 600 a second listen.

    Thanks for the advice, everyone!
     
  4. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    There comes a time when a good headphone requires maintenance. Specially as pads ware out. $17 later, new life for my HD600s:

    IMG_7480_small.jpg

    Not only good sound, but maintainability (and for a reasonable price and no special needs).
     
  5. joch

    joch Friend

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    You can build a whole set of HD600/650 from just parts that Sennheiser sells. And interchangeable between the two. I have 600 drivers on an extra 650 headband.
     
  6. Jerry

    Jerry Friend

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    That's what I love abt the Sennheisers. Just so easy to maintain. Guaranteed good night's sleep.
     
  7. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    $17!?!?
     
  8. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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  9. fraggler

    fraggler A Happy & Busy Life

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  10. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    I'll measure tonite.

    They are going to change the sound no matter what. Not necessarily because of the brand of the pads, but because the old pads start to give up, and result in cup volume reduction. Old pads might result in a darker sound.

    Again, I'll measure. I did perform a visual inspection. Nothing out of the ordinary.

    The materials seemed similar. HD600 pads do have a small ring of protein-like material close to the attachment ring. These do so as well.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  11. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Measurements of now vs Nov 11, 2016 (old pads):

    Then_Vs_Now.png

    It seems the treble increased a little with the pad change. It's always a bitch to put the pads on though.
     
  12. Baten

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    Interesting!! Pretty good for third party pads. I'll order a pair :) thanks for measuring~
     
  13. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    Got a pair of HD600s for an honestly WTAF price (sincere thanks to the previous owner, who may or may not appreciate being named), couldn't say no especially considering how I like their aesthetic way more than that of the HD650. That's immaterial to how they sound but luckily I rather prefer their sonics as well.

    Impressions out of a Sunrise III with a Genalex Gold Lion ECC81 and a LPS, a Lake People G109A, as well as a ZDT Jr. with GE JAN tubes. Source is laptop USB>Bifrost Multibit (A1) Gen 5. References are Klipsch HP-3 (lol), 250ohm Beyerdynamic DT880 (felt modded, more "neutral"), and extensive home demos with HD650 with both stock (yay) and Yaxi pads (bleh). Pads on HD600 are not new, which is likely to the headphones' benefit.

    Comfort is excellent, being a used pair— lightweight and unobtrusive when worn. Cable supplied isn't stock I think, but seems perfectly sturdy and isn't particularly inclined to kink.

    Make your jokes now, hah.

    [​IMG]

    Microdynamics on Senns best those on the HP-3 (unnaturally over-emphasised) and DT880 (simply less evident); HD600s are by far the more natural in conveying subtle reverberations in guitar strings and vocal nuances. Room cues more evident on HP-3, though that could be more a function of their semi-open construction and their being "hyper-sharpened". On the whole I'm more easily conned into perceiving people as singing right in front of me (e.g. Frank Sinatra, Aretha Franklin, Hayley Williams) with the Senns, since the Klipsches make it hard to forget that I'm listening to reproduced music thanks to their sonic colouration, enjoyable as it is. Soundstage is not massive, but roomy enough for me; excellent conveyance of "layers" that's on par with Klipches in presentation aids that perception, lacking as it is in actual "space".

    Low-level detail is as good as anything else I've had at home save for the HD800, which is pretty f'ing impressive; can't speak to Focals as those have all been store demos. Out of the relatively modest rigs I have at home I pick up roughly as much subtle tics and rasps as on the Klipsches, which is pretty much a resolution beast. Home is often noisy thanks to a ton of animals around and construction besides (I'm no longer awake at 3AM when it's reasonably quiet), so I might be losing some information to ambient kerfuffle. Even then it's easy to pick stuff out of Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here album, or any of Pizzicato Five's discography (fun J-Pop group I grew up with) that I don't catch on most other gear I've demoed. The less fucked tonal balance at times makes it much easier to catch macrodetail than on the Klipsches at times, which is pleasant. Case in point: chatter at the beginning of Adele's Send My Love to Your New Lover, which is actually hard to make out on the HP-3 at non-earbleed levels.

    Why yes I have marvellous taste in music, thank you.

    Decay is somewhat lacking, cues that otherwise give a sense of space and "room" not as evident as on other headphones I've tried, but again could be due to my environment not being very nice with open backed cans or my less-than-superlative-but-not-horrendous upstream. Driver reactivity/attack is about on par with DT880— more rounded and less incisive than on HP-3s, so less energetic. Thought it was a function of FR at first, extensive listening hints otherwise.

    Bass isn't particularly lacking except in Billie Eilish/Radiohead-esque, eyeball-rattling lows. Quality is somewhat mud on all amps, I'm told a better tube amp can alleviate this but I can neither confirm nor deny. Textures here are well passable, just that some complex bass solos (Primus, Sailing the Seas of Cheese) come across as confused. Treble extension is... fine as far as I'm concerned, I like the fact that they're less sizzly from midtreble on up than what I'm accustomed to, but lower treble/upper mids are hella aggressive; they come across as more fatiguing than HP-3s in that the sound on many instruments is perceived as more raw and in-your-face— try listening to Amon Amarth or Machine Head (the band, not the Deep Purple album). It does wonders for electric guitar, which is something I miss dearly on the HP-3s— Cap'n Crunch levels of addictive with certain metal tracks.

    This is an excellent match for the ZDT Jr. fitted with GE JAN tubes (high impedance out); it mellows the aggressive presentation a bit while improving the holographic quality of the headstage. The Sunrise has great control over the low end and slams even harder, though it has a fair bit less air up top than the ZDT Jr does, as far as I can hear. Tubes and HD6__ series cans seems to be a match made in heaven, primarily for reasons outside tonality (i.e. ambiance, texture, headstage). I'm one of those who thinks that the ZDT Jr. has some mild bloom, and unlike the HD650, which can be somewhat too sleepy/cosy on it, the HD600s wear this sound well. There's some mild out-of-my-headedness on Bifrost MB>ZDT Jr.>HD600, though that could be my lack of experience with speakers speaking.

    Solid state amps, at least this one I have sitting around, works well enough, though this specific model kinda kills that sense of ambiance I'm hooked on. It does get loud enough off my phone, which thankfully has a phono jack, but I just think it offers a blander presentation than any other source I have on hand.

    Could be expectation bias or Audiophile Syndrome.

    In summary, I'd rather listen to Ol' Blue Eyes and classic rock on the Senns but head back to the Klipsches for Radiohead or anything even remotely "pop". Barring more affordable ribbons/the SR1a depreciating appreciably in the near future or my joining either team ZMF or Focal (more likely the former), I'm probably set for headphones for a long while.


    *I own neither the G109A nor the ZDT Jr; both these are on indefinite loan from the same person as he doesn't use them at all and didn't mind my killing some tubes. I've had the G109A at home since early August and the ZDT Jr. for just under a month as of this writing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
  14. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    The pads are indeed a bit different (these are aftermarket), with a change in sound signature (little brighter both heard and as the measurement shows). The pads are also a PITA to install. But they retain the house sound signature to a large extent.

    I believe the real deal pads are like $50 or so.
     
  15. Majestyk

    Majestyk Acquaintance

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    Last edited: Dec 12, 2019
  16. cryptout

    cryptout New

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    Long time HD600 owner reporting. I've had the same pair since 1998 and they still sound great. I might buy a new pair as backup since I have the feeling they will become rare because of the new release.
     
  17. dematted

    dematted Friend

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    I recently bought my second pair of HD 600's, after going several years without owning one. I must say, I'm supremely pleased with this headphone and how it compliments my Focal Elex. I don't think I'll have anything new to say here that hasn't been said ad infinitum about this headphone, but I think it's worth saying anyways, just to add another voice to the nearly endless chorus of critical acclamation this wonderful headphone has received.

    To use a metaphor that's a bit overworn, I find myself listening to the music with this headphone, whereas I find myself listening to the headphone when I listen with my Focal Elex. This isn't to say that this is a better headphone on the Focal Elex. On the contrary, the Elex has a more exciting, in-your-face presentation that makes it easier for me to be "wowed" by music. With the Elex, I find myself wanting to just sit down and listen to the music because of its liveliness and energy, whereas with the HD 600, I often end up doing different things while I listen to the music.

    However, the HD 600 does several things that the Elex is not capable of. For one, the HD600 has a naturalness to its presentation that the Elex simply lacks. The plucks of strings, the nuances of vocals, and the subtle interplay between piano notes and violins in a sonata all sound just more true to the original music with the HD600. The Elex, meanwhile, has a forwardness that makes it sound artificial compared to the HD600: it sounds as if the Elex is trying to make the music more dynamic and exciting than it is, while the HD600 is striving solely to reproduce what's already there. This isn't to say that the Elex is unsuccessful in its task: often, music does sound more exciting, more impactful, and more visceral with the Elex.

    In fact, my biggest complaint with the HD600 is a lack of punch, dynamics, and excitement. I think this is probably exacerbated by the lack of ultimate extension at both the top and bottom ends of the register. This is probably at least partially a result of my poor current upstream gear, but I feel as if there's very little that "pops out" in the music the HD600 reproduces. Electric Guitar notes or drum-kicks that might stand out from the rest of the music on my Elex are instead blended seamlessly into the overall rhythmic thrust of a track. This has some benefits: it makes the HD600, at least for me, extremely pleasant and non-fatiguing to listen to. There is a smoothness to the music which makes it a fantastic headphone for relaxation.

    Overall, I'm very happy I purchased this headphone (again), and I plan to use it to listen to quieter, less forward music for which timbre and overall smootheness is more important than attaining every last bit of microdetail or having dynamic swings that slam your ears hard enough to make your eyes pop. The fact that it is handily superior (in certain respects!) to a $700 dollar headphone is pretty damn impressive, especially considering that I'm using pretty bad upstream gear that isn't really optimized for the HD600.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2019
  18. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    Shudda kept that old granite countertop look.

    HD650 is even more relaxed. The treble is smoother and darker, where the HD600 has a bit forwardness in the upper mid/lower treble region 2-3khz. Because of that bump I find it just a tad bright for my ears. It's more refined and just a tiny bit colored sounding compared to the HD600. I prefer the HD650s sonic signature over the HD600. The HD600 is extremely neutral, eases up on the sub-bass of the HD650 to where it transitions the bass/mids/treble just a hair better. I'm comparing all stock versions of these headphones, so with mods that might change some of these characteristics.

    I've become way too sensitive to treble since I don't listen to headphones that much. HD650 (and depending on mood HD600) is the only headphone in stock form I can listen to for hours without any kind of treble spike penciling my eardrums. HD800 or HE-6 in stock? Yagottabekidden me.

    Bro those are as flat as pancakes! My beater HD650 is on its way to looking like that.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2019
  19. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    Just saw your edit, my bad. Yeah I'm pretty sure the worn out pads are to the HD600s' benefit cuz of how (at least IME with the HD650) newer pads make for an even brighter sound. I may replace the headband cushion eventually (even though I had no problems using the HD650 without any padding at all— fluffy hair or thick skull to blame), but unless they disintegrate I'm probably keeping the ear pads.

    Besides, they're ridiculously comfy when they're this soft. I've got smaller ears too so no problems with them touching the baffle... yet.
     
  20. Majestyk

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    I recently bought the 650's (6XX) and sold them the next day. I liked the relaxed treble but damn, the bass was way over the top. I just bought a used pair of 600's so I'll see how that goes. (Haven't heard them yet).

    Of all the comments I've read about the 600's I have never seen anyone complain about them being too bright. Most of the comments say they are the opposite of bright and that the 800's are a lot brighter. In fact, a friend of mine ditched his 600's because he said they were too veiled.

    I just noticed this review about someone complaining about the treble...

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-...f=cm_cr_srp_d_rvw_ttl?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B00004SY4H
     

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