HD800 "French Mod" aka "SuperDupont Resonator"

Discussion in 'Modifications and Tweaks' started by sorrodje, Jan 17, 2016.

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  1. Wfojas

    Wfojas Friend

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    I also received them last night, @sorrodje . I will give them a listen tonight and post my findings here.
     
  2. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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  3. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    Just received mine. They're in good shape and I will measure them and post impressions here probably later today (or tomorrow).
     
  4. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Off topic...

    I misread the title of this thread every time I see it in the listings. OK, so I wonder what an HD800 would look like with a French Maid mod?

    o_O
     
  5. KurtSvensson

    KurtSvensson Friend

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    They arrived and they seem to have made it perfectly. Will have to give it a good listen tonight.
     
  6. MrTie

    MrTie Friend

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    My chain:


    FLAC - Jriver - DMG Equilibrium - Asus Essence ST SPDIF(low jitter clock vs the STX) - Bifrost Multibit - Valhalla 2(Orange globes/Russian 6N6Ps) - HD800( 33xxx, only SDR modded, stock cable)

    Impressions:

    Wow these do just as much reduction of the 6khz spike as my EQ was, without crushing the air and instrument separation as much up top. Along with my current EQ settings and this mod I have finally made the HD800 tolerable for lesser recorded music while still offer staging, imaging, speed, and detail in spades. I had been planning on a second pair of cans for the 30-40% of my music that aggravated the stock HD800, now I think I'll just invest in better electronics instead. Sorrodje you have really done a great thing with these! I still want to try the the SBAF mod, in conjunction if it brings up the mids as I am currently doing that via EQ. However I am pleased as punch with the general sound I am now gettign out of these cans on my system.

    I have a large Head-fi meet up next Saturday so I will be trolling for impressions of the mod there as well and will convey what others think.

    My EQ settings(Thanks Tyll)
    [​IMG]

    FIR Processing and Analogue Phase
     
  7. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    Ok, will be updating my post in a bit but what I can say for now is:

    There is actually a pretty noticeable difference between with the dust cover infront of the hole in place (that I cut) and without it. The resonator was tuned with this protective screen in mind and it is likely a good thing if you didn't cut yours. I might have to find a way to glue(?) it back on there ...


    Quick Update:
    [​IMG]
    This is the difference between with (orange) vs without (green) the protective dust screen over the hole
    (screen ONLY removed on the hole, not the whole driver).
    The small "step" in the FR may not look super bad but these things are always really bad in the IR/CSD. This step is actually pretty steep and there is quite a bit of ringing.

    I will also say for now that the SD mod measures WAY better than anything I tried (nothing unexpected here).

    I will have to try way more things so the next big update (to this post) might take a while.


    Mini Update:
    Virtually ZERO change in distortion. Verified a couple of times (and the ambient noise right now is WAY below the noise level of my microphone) and the distortion always looks pretty much identical.
    I don't feel the need to post pictures as the tiny differences are simply caused by measurement error.


    Last Update for today:
    Did some quick measurements with the mic in my ear and the changes are consistent (if not slightly larger than on my coupler). But most importantly: I finally listened to it. (Yes, I measured before listening to it)

    vs no resonator:
    -treble timbre vastly improved, the upper midrange lift is more apparent than the measurements would suggest (my inear-measurements show a greater change)
    -less bright
    -smoother
    -imaging and bass seem unchanged

    vs UERM:
    -Every time you think that you just improved the HD800 FR by 150%, you realize how far off it still is. The UERM is still closer to the HD600 (but more neutral than the HD600 to my ears) than the HD800. This is with mods similar to the anax 2.0 so I'm hoping that the SBAF absorber is much better.
    -The HD800 is still WAY too bright. I've not listened to the HD800 a lot lately, mainly because I realized how much more neutral the UERM and HD600 are still.
    For example Porcupine Tree - Trains sounds very bright on the HD800, yet there is nothing wrong with it on my UERMs and HD600 (except for it having like 6db DNR). This may not be as obvious with other songs but the HD800 always sounds somewhat artificial and bright. I also feel that at least some part of this can not be fixed with EQ because of the cups. Both the UERM and the HD600 actually sound pretty damn close to a speaker measuring like the B&K curve at the listening position to my ears.

    In short: This is a big step forward but it doesn't transform the HD800 into a neutral headphone. I will have to see how much the SBAF absorber changes but I highly doubt that the HD800 is going to sound neutral any time soon.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 16, 2016
  8. q2klepto

    q2klepto New

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    Will the resonator work as long as the material is dense? I'm wondering if i can stack layers of Creatology foam (maybe 3-4 layers) - or does it have to be a Shure olive tip
     
  9. kevnin

    kevnin #facetweeting - Friend

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    I got mine in yesterday, they were in perfect shape.

    Peeling back the screen to install them wasn't as hard as I thought it would be.

    My HD800 has been modded with the changstar anax mod template but with the new rugliner from the SBAF community mod. I removed the rugliner and added the resonator. I still have the creatology foam ring and trapezoid. Initial impressions are the sound is similar but with more bass. Very happy about this as I am hoping for the resonator to replace the rugliner.

    I'll post further impressions and measurements soon, probably after canjam. Thanks again @sorrodje !
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 1, 2016
  10. Maxx134

    Maxx134 Dunning–Kruger effect poster boy

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    Haha!
    That's great idea to simulate human head with your real head!
    Real human measurement rig!
    :)
     
  11. KurtSvensson

    KurtSvensson Friend

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    I actually expected to be able to contribute with some serious impressions of this resonator vs SDresonator 1.0 however this is the reality: It works exactly as you've been told, that's it. It decreases the brightness of HD800 quite significantly but it's still bright, the SD 1.0 had a bigger dip in the upper midrange, this is more noticable than I thought it would be and I prefer the most recent version by a wide margin.

    I don't have much to tell you, no other big differences, it doesn't sound damped, it doesn't seem to have affected bass or lower midrange, hasn't killed off the air. However I should add that in a perfect world, the 6k peak should be reduced further, this is a good improvement but the peak isn't gone (as showed my a billion measurements in this thread) it's still there and annoying, just less so than ever.

    But the real kick for me, an avid EQ user is that this is the first time I've been able to EQ my HD800 to sound somewhat close to what my ears considers neutral without destroying the SQ with artifacting or whatever the hell it is that's been degrading the SQ. This I'm fairly certain is a product of now being able to use exclusively wide Q equalizing since I don't need to bring down 6khz specifically.

    So kudos to France.
     
  12. sorrodje

    sorrodje Carla Bruni's other lover - Friend

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    Makes Sense. Very interesting !
     
  13. iDesign

    iDesign Almost "Made"

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    Regarding Tyll Hertsens' EQ settings, do we have any confirmation of what DSP settings he used (e.g. Processing Mode, Phase, etc). I am using EQuilibrium configured as an Audio Unit in Audirvana Plus. When using the same HD 800 EQ settings as shown in the Innerfidelity article, I have significant distortion unless the gain setting is set to -2.00 dB. Would love to see screenshots of Tyll's DSP settings-- I noticed Tyll is using 0.00 dB for his gain?

    Looking forward to getting the Super DuPont modification next week.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2016
  14. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    Whenever you boost a frequency you should lower the gain by the same amount or you get distortion/clipping. So for example you boost 80hz by 12db and you boost 1khz by 3db then you lower the gain by 12db.
     
  15. iDesign

    iDesign Almost "Made"

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    Odd that Tyll is using for 0.00 dB, right?
     
  16. MrTie

    MrTie Friend

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    I ended up settling on -6db after a lot of playing around. Very pleased, I honestly did not notice a ton of distortion even at 0db except when i got to very very bass heavy electronica.
     
  17. chakku

    chakku Friend

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    Always, always lower the gain on the preamp by the highest gain setting (or 0.5dB more to be safe) you have on any filter to avoid digital clipping.
     
  18. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    I never used Equilibrium so i couldn't say, maybe he saved his preset without adjusting the gain and just loaded it up for a screenshot.
     
  19. johnjen

    johnjen Doesn’t want to be here but keeps posting anyways

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    My DSP stack includes 'VU' meters near the end of the chain to monitor 'clipping'.
    In fact that is one of the reasons I really liked sonarworks plugin because it had both input and output 'VU' meters.
    This is especially helpful when there is a significant amount of very low bass compensation.

    I use a separate function within DSP to lower the gain near the beginning of the chain, and this might be what Tyll is doing as well.

    When 'clipping' occurs it sounds nasty, but some times it can just 'dull' the overall SQ when it isn't severe or only clips in the very bottom end for instance.

    JJ
     
  20. Hawkmoon

    Hawkmoon New

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    Hi where can I buy this superdupont mod for my Hd800
     
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