Life after Yggdrasil: Watering the Ash

Going forward, in order to keep things trackable, I'm going to add essentially anything that's recommended to the list in "provisionally approved" status. That way, in the event I cannot get my hands on one, at least it will have been logged and people won't need to re-request things only to get shot down based on unavailability.

As part of that it is worth noting that if you can source/arrange a contact to to do so, a unit that's previously been moved to "rejected" status, there's no particular problem moving it back to "to audition" status.

As a result, I've added both the DC-1 and the SF Processor 3 to the list.

 

I can't help you with the DC-1 or Processor 3, but I could get you an SFD-1. I've got one that I didn't put in storage while waiting on my move, so it's just sitting here in it's box. If you think the SFD-1 would be useful on the list (as seem to pop up more often in both the used market and in recommendations), just let me know.

 

I believe there is genuine academic interest in the SFD-1. For what it's worth, it ended in Class E of Purrin's classification a while back (on par with the Theta DSPro Gen V-Va and just behind the Yggdrasil):
http://www.head-fi.org/t/693798/tho...da-sucks-just-to-get-you-to-think-about-stuff

I for one am quite curious how the older, excellent stuff fares vs the Yggdrasil, namely if Yggdrasil really is a step forward in the grand scheme of things...

 

I'm game to do the SFD-1 (I've enjoyed the Sonic Frontiers gear that I've owned in the past), it'll just be a case of timing.

The Ross Martin PCM1794A is up next (should start with that on Thursday ... would have been earlier this week, but "life" was doing it's thing). Then a four-way Schiit multi-bit DAC comparison. Following that will, if schedules stay as expected, be the Chord Hugo 2 (I'll have to do that one as it shows up, due to it being a tour unit) and then we'll see what's up at that point.

 

The DC-1 is not as good as Gungnir Multibit, Yggdrasil, or better pro DS DACs so I don't thnk you should even bother. It's just really good feature-wise for 500 bucks and can't really be beaten in it's price bracket. The Gungnir Multibit is better in every way but transient dynamics and I guess Gungnir Multibit bass phatness that's different from the dialed-in warmth needed for AD1955 timbre but the DC-1 is less than half the price, half the size, sounds good (much better than 50% of the Gungnir Multibit), has AES input, and a built in pre for powered monitors. It kicks the crap out of cheap interfaces, receivers, the Modi Multibit/Bifrost Multibit,but at the end of the day, I really like AKM chips better so ymmv but death to Sabres.

I wouldn't even call it a haze. More like it sounds like everything is coming off a tape or something. It's only really a big deal with sterile macbook music with a bunch of fake instrumental samples anyway or stuff you can't crank as it was recorded abysmally. The phat bass and upfront presentation can be more annoying but even those are really nothing compared to what most people are using or the ESS presentation.

Let's be real here: most of the people actually bitching that the Yggdrasil they bought are using crap, not endgame level, black-background implementations for their respective chips like the PerfectWave mk 2 for Wolfson 8741, Bricasti M1 for AD1955, Lynx Hilo for CS4398. They need to bitch about it as they want to defend their earlier purchases they are emotionally attached to or which they like the inferior overall sound of. Dudes like the Stereophile guy bitching about ANYTHING about the Yggdrasil when they're using some crappier R2R, FPGA, or ESS based DAC need to just shut up especially as most speakers struggle to hit HD 6X0 levels of detail and they're not rocking a Focal Utopia. The Yggdrasil, like all gear, has some unique pecularities to its sound but is high-fidelity; it's not imprinting some oversatured tape like sound over the entire spectrum like the Lavry gear (which still sounds really good but is too warmed over to be endgame) and many of the "better" ESS based DACs do.

 

Okay, just let me know if/when you're ready for it, and I'll make it happen.

 

I recently upgraded from a Bricasti M1 to a Yggdrasil and I am happy to admit the Bricasti was one the dumbest audio purchases I have made. I thought long and hard about getting a Yggdrasil, but had trouble believing all the hype around it. So much hype in this hobby that it becomes very hard to distinguish between the hype train and reality. So I bought the Bricasti M1, and it is a good DAC, but not what I was looking for. It still has that treble that sounds like ass to me - I guess most DS DACs do that. Bought a Yggdrasil, sold the Bricasti, and been happy ever since.

My opinion is that the folks at Stereophile (and elsewhere) have a somewhat sinister commercial motivation behind ignoring / disparaging the Yggdrasil. A product that is:
1) better performing that almost any other DAC below 10K (perhaps all of them, and quite a few above 10K), at a fraction of that price, AND
2) is sold direct over the web
represents a massive headache for them. The Yggdrasil is a threat to a good chunk of their revenue stream. How much advertising revenue and free test gear would Stereophile get from Bricasti if they stated the information that is of real use to a consumer - "Yggdrasil sounds significantly better than the Bricasti, unless you absolutely need some feature unique to the Bricasti, or are more interested in a DAC as a prestige product, buy a Yggdrasil and bank a hefty saving" - bugger all, obviously.

So Sterophile takes a giant dump on the face of the consumer, the people they care least about in all this, and perform the usual manufacturer/distributor/supplier truck stop fellatio. Their commercial model doesn't allow them to do anything else. They will nitpick and snipe at Yggdrasil on the most flimsy pretexts.

 

Ross Martin PCM1794A, Resonessence Labs Concero HD and Mousai MSD 192 are in hand courtesy of @atomicbob.

Expect thoughts those starting in a couple or three days ... they're on warm-up for now. Likely tackle them in the order they're listed and will update the main posts as I do so.

 

Not to bias your findings but having heard the MSD 192 and that AB has high regard for it and the Ross Martin dac, I suspect they may fair well given your evaluation methodology.
But I doubt they will be up to Yggdrasil standards.

JJ

 

At this point it's more about using Yggdrasil as a common reference, than specifically trying to beat it. I'll include commentary in regards to how competent units sound compared to other well-known units in Schiit's line-up as well (simply becauseI have them available to do so and they're well known here).

I could, reasonably, change the thread title to something that didn't reference Yggdrasil ... but that's much less fun (for me) when certain types from another place get all worked up about me not liking their DAC-du-jour. That said, most of those types haven't found the new thread yet which is just fine by me!

 

More like they know about this place, and are too scared to post here. With good reason.

 

Since Yggdrasil is your reference, it makes sense for it to stay in the thread title.

Sound quality is a highly subjective and personal evaluation. It makes little sense to me that some people get all upset when some guy (albeit well respected by many) doesn't like their DAC as much as he likes Yggdrasil. The important thing to them should be how much they like their DAC. Instead of getting upset, go listen to the Yggdrasil and some other DACs that might rate higher and see what they think and like best. Then buy that DAC if it is not the one they own and it makes financial sense to them.

My DAC budget was right at $2000 and I stretched that a bit to buy Yggdrasil. I bought it based on two factors. First, it is reputed to be one of the best, if not the best, DACs under $2500. Second, I really like what Schiit Audio was all about and liked Modi Multibit DAC I already had. If I didn't like it I could always send it back. Based on the sound quality I am getting I think I made a good decision so it's not going anywhere!

Now, your evaluation of the Holo Audio Spring KTE/Level 3 DAC has me intrigued. I am looking forward to listening to it. I have not spent any time listening to NOS DACs and I would like to learn and understand what the sound is all about. A friend is getting one soon so I should have a chance to do just that. When using NOS DACs, do you upsample in software or just feed the source material at its native resolution?

Anyway, I really enjoy reading your evaluations and I appreciate the time and effort you put in doing this. In a way, I get to listen to these DACs vicariously through you. Thank you!

 

Oh man, can somebody with some web design savvy help bring Ross Martin's site out of the geocities era? Even if his stuff were golden schlong worthy, it's hard to tell what you're even buying from his page.

 

Yep, I have to admit that it put me off, when I was perusing it, ages ago. I had a nagging feeling that the DACs on offer might be decent, but it was hard to shake the shoddy impression that the site gave. It doesn't need to be overdesigned to the point of uselessness like the Auralic site, but something a little smarter and less ugly would be good.

The Schiit site nails the balance between lack of fuckery, functionality and looking halfway decent, I think- when they remember to update it!

 

@Torq: looking forward to your view on the Concero HD. IMHO it has a reasonable USB implementation. Feeding directly over USB I prefer it to the Modi Multibit.
I often use it as a usb-spdif converter for the Modi Multibit, and it does improve the sound enough that I prefer this setup just a little better than any of this two dacs by themselves. Maybe you feel like adding some comments on the Concero's merits as a converter.

 

@atomicbob has some rather emphatic opinions on the Concero...

 

But what when the headphone is a ZMF Eikon?

 

@zonto: why the dislike?
My ZMF Eikon is smooth and the treble tuning tilted to the mild side. It kind of compensates for the Concero´s Sabre edginess. The Modi Multibit just does not cut it from its USB input IMHO. That´s why my preferred setup is Concero as USB converter into SPDIF Modi Multibit. It does many things well and many better than the Concero by itself but things get a little too smooth and Modi Multibit is just a little too warm for the Eikon´s for my taste.
I am looking for a dac upgrade in the near future. So I am eagerly looking forward for Torq´s comments while:
1) it will give me another reference point making my dac wish shortlist when he describes the Concero HD
2) I need to consider if it is worth keeping the Concero as a converter or if I should have it float down the river as Marv urged me to do already a year ago ;-)

 

It would help if you also told us your choice of amplification, as this might be more directly relevant re the Eikon than the choice of DAC.

 

Trafomatic Head 2 tube amplifier (push-pull) with Nos tubes. First stage has Telefunken CCA's, second stage Russian 6N6P (not the "i" version) from the 60's OTK 1 quality Army Tubes.
The Trafomatic, especially with this tube choice, is not a warm or rolled of amp. Preferred impedance settings on the Trafomatic for the Eikon: 100 or 300. 300 is slightly more alive, musical and holographic. 100 setting has less background noise though.