Lyr 3 Discussion Thread

Spoiler

I started out as a 2-channel guy so I tend to look for qualities in headphones that aren't as great on speakers, namely plankton and clarity, and less so for macrodynamics and soundstage since speakers do that well (and I don't think my ears can pick up staging well with how headphones are placed).

My musical preferences vary from various rock genres to vocal music, so I'd say my greatest concern areas are usually midrange, bass/midbass would be next, and treble I'm least sensitive to since I've probably been to too many loud concerts.

I got the opportunity to listen to @EagleWings's Lyr 3 this past weekend (with stock new production TS tube) and I'd say the short answer is that for the 6xx, I would easily recommend the Lyr 3 over the Mjolnir 2.

Strangely enough, the first two things that impressed me the most were the macrodynamics and soundstage. The Lyr 3 had less slam, but it did macro better by having more range of dynamics and presenting the soft passages more softly, whereas the MJ2 just makes everything loud. Whereas for soundstage, the MJ2 has an in your face presentation compared to the Lyr 3's stage which felt small room sized.

Otherwise, I felt they were relatively close for plankton and microdynamics with neither amp taking a sizable lead. The MJ2 takes the lead for slam and bass. Additionally, I felt the treble was rolled off slightly on the Lyr 3 by comparison (could be the stock tube).

I also got to try out @EagleWings's HD800S while we were at it, and I felt that it paired better with the MJ2 (with Siemens A-frame tubes) than it did with the Lyr 3 because the MJ2 helped overcome some of the 800's shortcomings and vice versa.

I wouldn't say the Lyr 3 was so good that it made me felt like I had to sell my MJ2 to buy one, but if it was for someone new to the hobby, I would easily recommend it. It can power a wide range of headphones from IEMs (my Vega couldn't pick up any buzzing until probably 10-11 o'clock on the pot) to high impedance Senns and planars.

 

This is an update to my impressions on this amplifier that I posted a few pages back. Recently @MrTeaRex sent me a few 6SN7s from his glory days as a tube roller so that I could better triangulate the inherent traits of this amplifier. After mild experimentation, I am semi-disappointed to report that I think this amp sucks; and I think I went easy on it in my original post. I believe my complaints with it are not really nitpicks but instead obvious sonic shortcomings I can identify in nearly every recording. I do not believe it to be worth $499.

For starters, the stereo image feels both distorted and congested. The center image feels out of focus relative to the L&R channels, which are fairly narrowed in. This leads to homogenization during more complex passages especially at louder volumes, which I find are required to counteract how flat this amplifier feels dynamically. If I had to crudely illustrate the stereo presentation, I would do so like this: |^| versus something like this /^\ or the Valhalla 2 more like this /^^^\.

Irrespective of tube used there is a strain and lack of effortlessness in the mid-range and presence region that makes vocal harmonies or backing vocals difficult to listen to. There is, in general, a veil or off-timbre smoothness to the presence region that removes bite from instruments such as the electric guitar. The bass presentation is still the worst part, lacking in punch and elasticity of dynamics. At times I will begin to play a track that has a guitar and lead vocal and think what I'm listening to is alright until the drum line starts and I am jarred by how disjointed the lower frequencies are.

I really do not care for this amplifier personally and would have returned it to Schiit within my 15 day window had I had more time to spend with it initially. I can see these issues not bothering less critical listeners, but I could say the same for the Magni which is 1/5th of the price and more or less just as compromised.

Below are some individual tube notes for anyone who cares. I'm not aware of the prices of any of the below and didn't bother to research, this is just what was sent to me.



Stock 6N8S tube: Flat in dynamics, veiled, no punch. A touch more resolving and open sounding versus the new production TS.
New production TungSol: U-shaped, more punchy than stock tube. Compressed in that everything appears more loud and in your face, but still more enjoyable than stock.
Raytheon 6SN7GT: Accentuated in the treble. Sounds especially hard in the presence region. Lean in the bass. Got fatiguing quickly.
Ken-Rad VT-231 smoked glass: Slightly darker and more laid back than all of the above. The result is this highlights the smothering veil in the presence region this amp has. Best bass, but still disjointed.
Sylvania 6SN7GT: Sounds the most normal out of the five, in that it has the least of it's own character. The result is I hear more of how shitty the amp is overall.

 

@k4rstar Liked, because I think it's fine that this amp is not everyone's cup-of-tea. Appreciate reading your honest impressions.

 

@k4rstar, no issue with your dislike of the amp, but I am curious (given you're a seeming outlier) what amp (in that general price bracket if possible) does a better job?

 

Interesting perspective overall. Regarding your assessment of the stereo presentation, maybe it's more prominent (and damning) on this amp when using the HD650. Seems to be mounting evidence that it's not an ideal match.

Luckily I'm not a critical listener nor do I spend much time with the HD650.

 

Amar at Verum Sonus is also not super enthusiastic about the Lyr 3 (http://www.verumsonus.com/dc-area-head-fi-meet-impressions-4-7-2018/), making a similar comment to @k4rstar about disjointedness:

Amar was more enthusiastic about MCTH, however:

I first saw these quotes over at head-fi: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/mas...-dropping-monday.857673/page-36#post-14167744

 

And sometimes even HONEST impressions are just dead wrong. Just giving k4star a little crap.

This amp continues to impress me the more I use it. I like it even more as I dial it in with NOS tubes. I'll say it again, this is my favorite amp from Schiit. I want to thank the guy who gave me a good price on this used. I feel like a stole it.

Why is the lyr 3 different/better than other Schiit amps? Because the transparency is better for one. There's nothing murky or musing about the presentation here. The windows into the music is "cleaner" than other offerings in the line up.

Next, tone is very nicely reproduced. This is critical for me. If instruments and voices don't have accurate tone and sound natural, then it's a fail for me. I was a musician for 25 years and my ears refuse to accept unpleasing and inaccurate tone.

Finally, the price/performance is very good. Especially when I consider that I like the lyr 3 better than the mjo2 or Rag. Knowing that I got a great deal on it makes me enjoy it all the more.

 

@Ice-man - Sometimes they are, but can't please everyone. Some people may have different perceptions, what they hear might not match mine, all good.

I do give k4 credit though for sharing his honest impressions. This place would suck if we all had to sing kumbaya and agree on everything

p.s. Use to waste time with my ex GF who just couldn't get why some people like sushi, in her mind it just sucked, but it doesn't to everyone. The blur between objective and subjective is a blur at times. Hope that helps clarify.

 

I pretty much agree with everything you're saying.

My only hesitation in all of this is that I still come to my work and listen to my eitr/Modi Multibit/vali 2 and think...man...this is good. My home setup is objectively better, but I don't know if that actually translates to greater enjoyment. It might, but it's going to take more time to tell.

There could be a fire sale in my future, but I plan to give it the summer to decide.

Essentially, as k4star pointed out, I'm not a critical listener. I go by pure subjective immersion and enjoyment. And man, am I grateful for that.

 

Yeah, I have basically the same experience with the Vali 2. I own a Valhalla2, which is probably better than the vali2, but sometimes the vali2 just seems to win on actual enjoyment factor. This makes me very curious to here a Lyr3 though.

 

Listened to the Lyr 3 alongside my MCTH last weekend and thought much the same, although I wasn't as disappointed. I felt that this sort of thing is part of the Schiit sound and it's either something you care for or not. The Jot has similar problems with consistency in that everything is fine until someone hits a snare drum or the passage becomes too dynamic and then the amp starts to honk.

 

Lol this was honestly fun to read, like a comic doing a roast of a beloved celebrity.

I guess this amp isn't for everyone, but it's hard for me to comprehend a quote like this when the same tube is my personal favorite with the HD600 and my new HD800S:

Sylvania 6SN7GT: Sounds the most normal out of the five, in that it has the least of it's own character. The result is I hear more of how shitty the amp is overall.​

I still can't read it without cracking up

 

Honestly? This is the part of the product lifecycle I love the most: the bit where the honeymoon's long gone and even the tiniest little niggles start eating at you. It's not so much that people are more honest about their experiences so much as they manage to better present what it's like living with a headphone/amp/DAC/whatever. I've had a Bifrost Multibit for a few days and I'm still smitten; will I feel this way next week, next month, in a year? No f'ing idea, but I've got an iFi Micro iDSD to compare it to and will have a Hugo 1 in house soonish; getting an HP-3 sooner or later and the recent "meh" reviews actually make me even more excited to hear em for myself, finally.

@JoeKickass Pardon, but how is that funny? Perhaps the "shittiness" another hears just happens to play well with your cans and preferences. Don't think @k4rstar is an HD800/S fan, which may explain this. Also, I think they're part of the "need smooth treble" club? Based on your posts so far, don't think tastes are compatible.

Which reminds me, don't think you've posted here yet? https://superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/new-members-introduce-yourself.17/

 

Frankly speaking I've thought lyr 3 didn't like senn 6- series, because I was not wowed as much as lyr3+lcd2c (note: eqed to correct tonality problems). At least it was true to me with my kiss 6xx. Don't mean lyr 3 sucks, but it isn't magical for me enough to muse poems. And that's one of the reasons why I avoided posting my impressions (yes, all my previous enthusiastic impressions came from lyr3+lcd2c) with 6xx in this thread.

And now I am hearing lyr 3 with hd600 with dekoni fenestrated pads .. Oh... shit...

Definitely need to hear more (and indeed I continuously to play all my favorite tracks now..) for final verdicts. But this combination (lyr 3 + hd600 + dekoni) is amazing me. Easily one of the most impressing setups among I heard this and last year regardless of total price. Every note is reproduced with f'ing level of synergy. Damn, I am now slightly regretting elex drop (still looking forward to hearing it though).

Lyr3 + hd600 + dekoni >> Lyr3 + hd600(stock pads) > Lyr3 + modded hd6xx

More impressions to come (or not)

 

For the hex which is a better combo for anyone who has experience lyr 3 or jotunhein

 

Maybe the better question is whether you're willing to pay the extra $100 for the lyr 3.

 

yes its for a friend he has no issue he just wants the better of the two

 

Lyr 3 is the better amp irregardless of the hp IMHO.

 

ok awesome which of the stock tube configurations should I get and any recommendations for extras?

 

Tung Sol is quite good.