Lyr 3 Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by neogeosnk, Mar 20, 2018.

  1. Nanekiu

    Nanekiu New

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    I've been listening for awhile with the Psvane-uk , and I don't think it's really a good match with this tube it makes the HD800 feel closed-in, and treble a bit piercing in some tracks, the other tube I have the MELZ 1578 metal base with steel brackets has a much better soundstage, not as sharp treble but it suffers a little in bass/dynamics etc.
     
  2. Mrip

    Mrip Friend

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    I haven't read all the posts here so it may have already been covered, but I remember there being some discussion somewhere about how the Lyr 3 dac cards introduced some hiss. Is this still a thing?
     
  3. Marko

    Marko New

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    Yes, I sure do! Has anyone tried 6F8G, 6J5G or ECC31/32 tubes in the Lyr 3? I've got a bunch of each I use in my Solstice...
     
  4. m17xr2b

    m17xr2b Friend

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    Make sure to introduce yourself first here https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/new-members-introduce-yourself.17/

    6F8G will work with an adaptor as it's a 6SN7 with one grid to the top cap.
    6J5 will work again with an adaptor but you'll need two as it's just one triode where the 6SN7 is a double triode
    ECC31/32 should not be used unless you're willing to risk the amp and your warranty. The heater current demand of 0.9A is far too much compared to the standard 0.6A of a 6SN7. Don't be surprised if one day the magic smoke escapes.
     
  5. Marko

    Marko New

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    Thanks for the reminder - I just introduced myself in the new members area.

    Thanks also for the info on compatible tubes. It's good to know the 6F8Gs and 6J5Gs will work, but a pity that I can't use the ECC31s, since I have four of the suckers.

    I currently have a Garage1217 Solstice, but I just ordered a Lyr 3 to do a comparison. As I mentioned in my self-introduction,
    my setup is:
    iMac (Audirvana) -> Eitr -> Modi Multibit -> Solstice (previously Horizon) -> Senn HD800 (modded)

    I've seen a few comments comparing the Lyr 3 and the G1217 Ember, but no comparison with the Solstice. I'll post my findings when I get the Lyr.
     
  6. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Good lord, please don’t start rolling all sorts of shit in your Lyr 3.
     
  7. Senorx12562

    Senorx12562 Case of the mondays

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    Inevitable. Deep breaths. In through your nose, out through your mouth.
     
  8. m17xr2b

    m17xr2b Friend

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    I know you're a fan of cheapo tubes but 6F8G and 6J5 is far from all sorts of shit like they're doing on HF with 6N1Ps,6SL7 and other 9 pins where the operating point is God knows where.
    The better than average tubes are scarce or the price is insane so the only choice is the get creative by using electrically identical tubes.
    I'd never pay the asking price for a TSRP 6SN7 but a round plate 6F8G for less than half is not bad.
     
  9. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    You have no clue how much money I’ve spent on my box full of 6SN7 tubes and equivalents. And it’s through that I’ve learned some valuable lessons. (It helps when your big boy amp takes 7 of them!)

    I’ve gone through the whole equivalent tube rolling. It can be hit or miss. I know sometimes a tube should be safe and within parameters, but then real life goes another direction. If it’s drop in, no adapter, and the manufacturer says it will absolutely work with no issues and keep your warranty, then go for it. Anything beyond that can just be a mess.

    I’ve got 6F8Gs as well and had major reliability problems, not to mention more noise than 6SN7. You never know if the adapter is all that great, grounded properly, etc. And they really always do seem noisier than even a noisy 6SN7. (Old people may be blissfully unaware of this.)

    Plus adapters seem to impact sound. Sometimes it’s a worthwhile trade off if the tube is suuuuper good, but often you’ll still deal with headaches along the way.

    And all this is quick to lead you down a path where you end up rolling a Christmas tree tube setup. Hence me saying not to start rolling a bunch of shit in your Lyr 3. It’s a good amp but not THAT good. It’s not worth getting wrapped up in crazy tube rolling.

    It isn’t worth it, and will inevitably lead to nervosa and/or headache.

    Having also heard crazy expensive NOS 6SN7 tubes, they’re always a letdown. If you feel you need to get creative with tube rolling because cheap options don’t get you 98% of the way there, you’re better off spending your money on an amp better suited to your tastes out of the box.
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    None of the 6FG8s sound the same as any of my TSRPs. Many other factors too, condition of the toob, variances, etc. I too have had problems with a near 40% breakage rate with the 6FG8s. The Amplitrex tester really adds to toob nervosa when you suddenly realize the triodes of "matched" dual-triode toobs don't even match, especially for gain. 1/3 of toobs I've purchased, I will never resell on eBay because they lag behind in certain specs, or relegate to extreme toob rolling on the likes of entry-level amps such as the Vali 2, Loxjie, Sunrise.

    Anyway, if you want a 6SN7 TSRP, then get a TSRP (or secret: an off-brand with the exact same round plate and glass structure). Some stuff is just gone now. No use obsessing about it because there are lots of good 6SN7s. Heck, even the new production Tung Sols sound good, especially on amps that don't require speshal tubes to sound good.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
  11. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    Used the new production Tung sol in the Lyr3 from the start. Never felt the need to roll, suits the Clears nicely.
    This tube has over a 1000 hours already and still is quiet and sounds great. Maybe a bit more smoothness over time but that's it.
    Cheap is good.
     
  12. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    ^ This.

    Listen to music, not tubes.
     
  13. gridmaster

    gridmaster Facebook Friend

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    Ya, I have 6sn7 tsrp and the 6f8g tsrp they do sound different. I actually prefer the 6f8g. Less sharp, more tonally correct to me. 6sn7 tsrp has a touch better resolution, but at the expense of sharper treble. Square plate 6f8g are really nice too, I generally just really like that variant. I own 7 altogether, and haven't had any fail, but I can definitely see them failing more than a 6sn7, because 6sn7 is a ruggedized / durability evolution of the 6f8g. Also with some amps that wire to top cap adapter can create noise issues as @Hands mentioned.

    New production tung-sol 6sn7 is my go to recommendation for anybody looking at 6sn7. At $25 it's a steal, the only other new production 6sn7 that I would consider on par, is the Psvane grey bottle 6sn7, but it's $70. Also I don't say better, because the trade off is grey bottle has better resolution and air, but I found the TS to be more tonally correct overall.

    I also agree with overdoing it with tube rolling. To even get the benefits of "holy-grail" tubes you need an amp that will let the performance realize itself. If I had a Lyr3, I wouldn't be going beyond a new production TS, it's just solid. If people want to go nuts with their $3k+ totl amp tho, I don't see a problem with that. It's all relative. I'm just never going to say you need X tube to make a tube amp good.

    If I could go back in time, I'd never have bought 90% of my tube collection. It's one of those things I just needed to try for myself tho.
     
  14. Marko

    Marko New

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    Righto. I've got a bunch of tubes I don't want and probably can't sell, but the year and a half I spent buying all those tubes was a lot of fun, and without it I never would have found the dozen or so pure gems I have now. Don't regret it at all.

    But if you're happy with a new production TS 6SN7, good for you. Look no further.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
  15. futbutts

    futbutts Friend

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    Would love some purchase advice/suggestions. I have a MD THX 789 coming late August (to replace my Asgard 2) but also noticed some Lyr 3 B-stock on Schiit, so they are now the same price.

    The 'objectively pure' 789 is an appealing concept (I think the A2 is a tad warm for me now) but as the owner of 600s, 650s, and 800s I'm also drawn to some tubiness (the CTH is still, in memory, one of my favorite amps I've heard, and I honestly regret selling it off). I also listen on 1540's and ZMF Ori's, source being a Bifrost MB, mostly to jazz, acoustic, and rock/metal.

    I'll probably make the trip up to the Schiitr tomorrow to do a little in-person auditioning, but was curious if anyone had input on parity between the Bifrost MB and the 789, in contrast to the Lyr 3, and the aforementioned headphones? I was also considering sticking with the 789 while also getting the ZDT Jr and so, in theory, having contenders in both solid-state and tube realms, though that might be overkill, and from what I've gleaned it'd probably be better to just save up for something a little more comprehensively strong when I decide to invest in a tube amp.
     
  16. NightPhotographer

    NightPhotographer New

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    I've been waiting for MASSDROP THX AAA 789 to go for sale again but now I like to know how it compares to Lyr 3.
    It seems that 789 is extremely clear with good amount of depth and layering.
    Tight bass, instrument separation and depth are the ones that I care for the most.
    Any idea?
    Cheers
     
  17. futbutts

    futbutts Friend

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    An update, I dropped by the Schiitr and did some listening via their Bifrost MB to the Valhalla and Lyr 3. I was dumb and didn't bring my own 650's (they had a pair there last time I went, but this time did not) so I was relegated to listening with their HD800S'es to audition the amps as pertains to my usual headphones. (I've directly A/B'ed the 800/800S enough that I feel I can approximate the differences between the two.)

    I'm starting to think there's either a tonality to Schiit's amps that doesn't gel with me, or maybe a tonality to the Bifrost MB that is getting on my nerves lately. It's difficult to describe, it's almost coming across as diffuse or hazy. I also did some listening with their Gungnir MB/Mjolnir set-up and while that was enjoyable, I thought I detected a whiff of that same diffuse/haziness tonality I'm getting with my current Asgard/Bifrost set-up, and that I was getting with the Valhalla 2 and Lyr 3 while at the Schiitr... so, I'm hoping it's an amp characteristic rather than a DAC one, since I adored the Bifrost MB when I first got it. But maybe I've just gotten used to it and so less positive traits are beginning to become more apparent to my ear.

    Obviously, I haven't been very clinical in my approach thus far, so there are about a hundred variables that could be contributing to what I've been hearing. So I'll need to go through my chain systematically and figure out where the annoyance lies.

    I do think the Lyr 3 trumped the Valhalla in terms of immediacy and slam, and microdetails seemed to have a little extra dynamicism or presence to my ear. It also sounded particularly clean compared to the Valhalla, with a blacker background. It also sounded a touch more neutral or even-keeled compared to the Jotunheim I'd borrowed for a few months, which had a very forward or aggressive kind of signature to it. (I have no way of knowing if that Jotunheim was the earlier brighter version of the silently revised, warmer one.)
     
  18. NightPhotographer

    NightPhotographer New

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    @Hands Can you please make a comparison between Lyr3 and Massdrop THX AAA 789?
     
  19. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    I haven't had a Lyr 3 since shortly after it launched nor have I heard the THX amp at all.
     
  20. NightPhotographer

    NightPhotographer New

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    Thanks for your reply. I've started reading Head-Fi too to see if someone has compared the two.
     

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