Magni 3 released

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by neogeosnk, Sep 19, 2017.

  1. PacoTaco

    PacoTaco Friend

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    I've owned the Lyr 2 twice and it only ever went with two headphones. It has a weird texture in the treble I never liked, had the smallest soundstage out of all the schiit-schtuf, and, it had terrible resolve.

    The Asgard 2, surprisingly, had a nice amount of resolve and smooth treble. It had the bloaty bass the other solid states didn't have, but it was akin to the Bifrost Multibit.

    I had both of them years and years ago and compared them with a tube-rolled Lyr 2. Even the Golden Lions, which were probably the best I found for the Lyr 2, didn't help the Lyr 2 much.
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Warm, punchy, but ultimately UNengaging sound. Vali 2 should have been the replacement for Lyr 2.
     
  3. FlySweep

    FlySweep Friend

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    Marv.. does the prod Vali 2 you have now change anything in the "Vali 2 x PS Horizon III x mCTH" death match rankings?
     
  4. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    It might. If anything, it might be closer if not equal to the Horizon. Too close to call without a direct comparison.
     
  5. crazychile

    crazychile Eastern Iowa's Spiciest Pepper

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    I owned a Lyr 2 for about a year. Like a late 60's muscle car, it's all about the horsepower, but it can't corner for crap. Some of the funkiness I was hearing with the Lyr 2 I originally thought was headphone or USB related smudginess, but once I was able to compare to another amp, I realized the Lyr 2 was the issue. I even tried better tubes and Lissts, but it didn't help. However, for the $$ where are you going to find something with that much power?
     
  6. Kattefjaes

    Kattefjaes Mostly Harmless

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    This is an excellent description- it makes me want to hear a Lyr 2 now, just to triangulate. Very clear and to the point.

    Also, back to the Vali 2:

    Do we conclude from Jason's intervention that there are no running changes to the production Vali 2, and thus those of us with a secret Vali 2 habit need not be experiencing nervosa about it?

    (When my normal tube amp was in for service, lately, I did break out the Vali 2 for a while- I've used both the Vali 2 and the Modi Multibit lately, so I feel better about not having sold them..)
     
  7. DigMe

    DigMe Friend

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    That was my conclusion
     
  8. crazychile

    crazychile Eastern Iowa's Spiciest Pepper

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    Another thing I just realized...My first Schiit was a Vali 1 and Modi 1. I was still experimenting with finding a headphone I liked, and was transitioning from Audio Technica ATH-M50 (original model) to AKG K702. So I upgraded to the Lyr 2 and Bifrost Uber for more power and versatility. I remember being struck by the rather substantial jump in sound quality between the two DACs, but going from Vali to Lyr 2 was a sidegrade.

    Based on that I pretty much convinced myself I was a DAC guy and amps made less of a difference except in extreme cases of power mismatch. That was probably an unfair assessment, but influenced by the Lyr 2 performance. The Lyr 2 was eventually replaced by the MicroZotl 2 with the LPS, which despite not getting much love around here was a revelation compared to the Lyr 2. I figured it was probably attributed to the MZ2 being almost 4x the price. I bought the loaner tour MZ2 for roughly 2x the price of a Lyr 2 so It was a reasonable upgrade.

    I bought a Massdrop Cavalli amp to use at work but got impatient and decided to spring for a Magni 3 to use in the interim. It should arrive in the next couple of days. I will definitely be doing some comparisons with the MZ2 to see if the differences are as big as what I remember with the Lyr 2.
     
  9. bboris77

    bboris77 Friend

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    I got my Magni 3 yesterday and here are my first impressions plus a question for other owners.

    I also own a Valhalla 2 so I compared them head to head using HD600. Keep in mind that I do not have an A/B switch so I actually had to unplug/replug the headphones so it is not really a scientific comparison.

    The Magni 3 sounds spectacular for the price. It has a sound signature that, to my ears, is quite similar to that of the Valhalla 2 with some key differences which I will attempt to highlight below:

    Bass and Slam - this one goes to the Magni 3. It sounds meatier and it hits harder.
    Speed and control - Magni 3 wins this one, which is not a large surprise considering it's a solid-state amp.
    Headstage - The Valhalla 2 wins this one as it has a slightly wider soundstage. The Magni 3 is a bit more center forward but not really by much.
    Plankton - Valhalla 2 wins this one. It simply has that tube magic.
    Mids/Natural sounding timbre - Valhalla 2 by a very small margin - voices and instruments sound amazingly natural and relaxed on it.
    Treble - a tie - Magni's extends more and it is not harsh, but Valhalla's treble has that tube liquidity and magic.

    Basically, I think that the Magni 3 perfectly complements the Valhalla 2 as it really excels in the areas that most OTL tube amps do not do well in - speed and slam. At the same time, it does a very respectable job when it comes to soundstage, natural sounding mids and pleasant treble.

    I am definitely keeping this amp since I need something that will do a stellar job with lower impedance headphones and give me that solid state slam and precision.
    Side note - the Magni 3 supplied more than enough power to HD600, DT150 and Q701 even in low gain mode.

    I do have a question for anyone that owns a Magni 3. Have you noticed any whooshing/scratchy sounds when turning the volume button in high gain mode, near the top of the volume range? I never use the amp at this volume level anyway, but I noticed that when I use more sensitive headphones there is a spot between 3 and 5 o'clock on the volume knob that makes this small "whooshing" sound when increasing or decreasing the volume in high gain mode. The noise is proportional to the volume level and it only happens when I have something plugged in the input jack. If there is nothing plugged in the back of the Magni 3, there is no noise. I suspect this is a quirk of the current feedback technology rather than a scratchy pot but would appreciate any insight. I emailed Schiit tech support as well and will report back when they get back to me.
     
  10. bboris77

    bboris77 Friend

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    I have been able to reproduce the "whooshing" volume pot noise very easily by playing any single tone test track and trying to adjust the volume. It is very easily heard on low frequency tracks (10hz-60hz). For some reason, this makes it apparent, where it is almost not noticeable when adjusting volume on music tracks (but it is still there).

    Once again, I would really appreciate it if anyone can test their Magni 3 with this track and see if there are any weird artifacts when adjusting the volume pot. I really don't want to return it if it is a quirk common to all the units.

    http://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencychecklow.php

    Thank you.
     
  11. kman1211

    kman1211 New

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    I owned the Lyr 2 for roughly a year as well, I did manage to get it to mostly sound right but it took the right tubes and a thicker power cable, the treble was just funky and gritty otherwise, it still was a little off in the treble texture though. The LISST tubes honestly made the treble texture worse. Had the HD 600, HD 650, K712, DT 150, and Nighthawk at the time.
     
  12. TIS100

    TIS100 New

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    I love the magni 3, (I liked the magni OG, and magni 2 also) but it seems like a problem with these little amps is the small Alps pots, they all suck. If you have a preamp it makes a difference to just use some resistors and jumper it... Of course maybe that defeats the purpose of a small amp you can take to the office or whatever, but it sounds pretty good without the crappy pot an a nice power supply.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2017
  13. bboris77

    bboris77 Friend

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    What puzzles me is that I had the original Vali and the Vali 2 and had absolutely zero issues with the volume pot on these. I believe they use the same Alps RK09 pot as the Magni 3. Moreover, these pots are actually not that bad at all and I find it very strange that there was a number of complaints about the same whooshing sound issue for the Fulla 2. I contacted the Schiit tech support yesterday and they told me that they consider it a defect and that they would exchange it for a new Magni 3.

    I have a feeling that it is not as simple as a bunch of subpar quality Alps pots that Schiit decided to install in their product - I think that the technology that Schiit utilizes in the Magni 3 and the Fulla 2 simply exposes and magnifies any small imperfections in these pots that would be masked if they were used in the Vali 2 for example. I have never ever heard anyone ever complain about the Vali 2 volume pot and it uses the same RK09.

    Anyway, I will post when I get a replacement unit, but I do get a feeling that even that unit may develop this whooshing sound when adjusting volume in time. Unless they found the actual issue that is causing this and took care of it.
     
  14. Kattefjaes

    Kattefjaes Mostly Harmless

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    Vali 2 has the same pot, I think. Mine has no such issues- just microphonics with the stock tube. That said, if the Magni 3 topology is anything like the Jot, could it be to do with grounding/potential issues? I know my Jot can make some crazy noises when I touch it...

    (I do like the BIG KNOB on the Jot, though, I must admit.)
     
  15. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    I have issues with the pot on the m3. If I'm using low gain and get to the 2:30-3 location on the pot, the volume stop going up in a linear fashion and goes WAY up.
     
  16. crazychile

    crazychile Eastern Iowa's Spiciest Pepper

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    My Magni 3 came in last night and I spent about .5 hr comparing it with a MicroZotl 2. Source was Tidal through a Yggdrasil and using the KISS modded HD-650s. The comparison was too quick to be able to describe the differences in great detail, but the Magni had the plankton and separation, while the MicroZotl (with LPS) had a certain delicacy and easiness to the sound. The Magni is a better match for HD-650s. Maybe because of the extra power, but it seems to control the Senns better. I'm seriously thinking about getting rid of the MicroZotl.

    So now the office system is iPad (Tidal) -> Bifrost Multibit (w/o gen 5) -> Magni 3-> HD-650 and the sound is fantastic. I don't normally use open back phones at work but the music is still really engaging at low volume. I have the gain set to low. There is a little bit of channel imbalance at the first 1/4 in. of the dial, but on low gain with '650s I have the volume just above that and it works just fine.
     
  17. Kattefjaes

    Kattefjaes Mostly Harmless

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    If you have a Sys lying around*, you could attenuate the level going into the M3 with it a bit, maybe? That would give you more play with the volume knob.

    *Such a handy box, every home should have one.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017
  18. Mkoll

    Mkoll Acquaintance

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    My Magni 3 has something similar, a slight scratchy sound heard when turning the pot starting from around 9 o'clock using the TH900 on low gain using a 60 Hz test tone. Its noticeable when changing volume in some songs when there are no higher frequencies playing, not sure of the exact cut-off.
     
  19. dmckean44

    dmckean44 In a Sherwood S6040CP relationship

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    I'm guessing it's just a matter of it's easier to replace units for people who are bothered by it than it would be to pay for the labor to test every single pot before it's put into a product.
     
  20. Zed Bopp

    Zed Bopp Friend

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    Damn it, I have a Lyr 2 - this talk of Vali 2 & Magni 3 being better troubles me... Are they really? (I'd save some space, at least.) My most used hp is a non-modded (& slightly EQ'd) HD800, LCD-2.1 comes a close second. I most of all enjoy punchy and tight bass with good subs. Overall resolution is a nice addition, certainly.

    Should I go for one of these small cheap-o boxes to replace the Lyr?
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017

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