Mistakes Were Made, A Tale of Spending

I can admit as I think many of us can, that I've bought a lot of stupid shit that I simply don't need. Especially audio-related things. And some of the things, I've certainly begun to sell or trade away in an effort to reduce clutter, but I am just swamped by the number of things that I bought that frankly now do more harm to my life than the temporary enjoyment that they brought. Once I finish up with what I have here, I will start with the pile of stuff at my parent's house.

For context, one of my good friends is currently deep in credit card debt at age 24, and it really gave me a reality check about my own spending habits. I know many of you here are parents, so as a young person I thought some of you might like to hear my random thoughts. But primarily I just wanted to put this out into the world to hold myself accountable.

When I was a kid, my parents taught me a lot of valuable lessons about saving money and spending wisely and certainly a lot of them stuck, but a lot of them didn't pan out. I used to think that spending 10 dollars was a big deal. My allowance which I didn't get until I was in 9th grade was 5 dollars a month. I remember the first time I bought a 20 dollar TV season on DVD I felt guilty. I've been sort of reflecting on that and how I can spend like 100 dollars on audio equipment now, not even something essential for survival like rent or food, and not bat an eye. And yes it's true that I'm not in debt or in any financial duress, but that's not good enough on some level. I do have savings, but I could have had a hell of a lot more. If my parents hadn't been as strict I think I would actually be screwed.

I think for me where the problem started was youtube. Every day I would watch these tech reviewers, Zeos (yes I know), unbox therapy, etc. Every week they would show new products, new phones, new gadgets. And I almost got sucked into the mindset that this was how I should be living. So for longer than I like to admit, I would just constantly buy these relatively inexpensive IEMs. Getting a new amazon package like every other day. Eventually, these started piling up into headphones, amps, etc. And with each purchase I would almost become blunted to the cost. 20 dollars used to be my threshold, then it was 40, 60, 80 etc.

I think the worst thing really though was paypal credit. That one was killer. My parents had scared me enough about credit cards as a kid that I knew to pay it off every month, but paypal credit was a new phenomena. The kicker is that you have 6 months to pay for a purchase interest free after which they slam you with a pretty high interest rate that has been building interest the entire time. This definitely goaded me into buying things I really shouldn't have. Case in point, the focal clear. I straight up did not really have the budget for that. I cut it real close. I wasn't making enough at the time to justify that purchase. I didn't need it. The 6XX was perfectly good and made me happy. I like the clear, but it just kind of sits there as a reminder that I had no self control.

To add insult to injury, if I had just refrained from buying all that cheap mid/lo fi stuff. It all would have added up to the cost of my current setup anyway. There are certainly some random items that I'm planning on just selling on craigslist, but I've decided to just start giving things away to people I know who I know would appreciate them. As far as all those random "cheap" IEMs are concerned (they were all like 100 dollars, which isn't cheap), I have no idea what to do with them.

At this point, I am quitting video games, unsubscribing from every tech youtube channel, closing my paypal credit account (they are giving me the run around currently on that, sigh), and I'll probably take a long break from this site too. I've decided I need to do better. I'm just too immature to handle this stuff. I admit it. I am a fallible human being like everyone else, and I am not smarter than Paypal/Amazon/Ebay.

 

Your honesty is commendable. We all need to assess our limitations and gauge how we're spending from time to time. I'm glad you're talking steps to sort this out.

 

Important life case. Just adding a note... as you are giving some stuff, I would like to respectfully inform that I do have plenty of space in my house... just saying

 

not to go too "super best financial friends" but I try to stick to a couple general, but certainly fallible "rules":

• No single audio purchase in a year for more than a single paycheck.
• But, plan for once-a-decade major system overhaul (which can take a year or two to sort out given system synergies).
• No credit cards used for hobbies.
• Anything under $250 should be kicked to the curb if you don't touch it for more than 3 months (I'm failing on this one with a pair of MD TH-X00EB—should probably post these in the FS section).
• The bigger/heavier the box, the longer it should stay in the system.
• HD650.

 

Yeah, you sound quite young.

I was going to write 1000 paragraphs on my life story as a student but... that's too long. Here's a reduced version:

1. Find a headphone you are happy with and stick with it. And do not purchase anything else until you have heard it (or have some way to try it on your system) and find that it'll fit you better than what you currently have.

2. Mid-fi purgatory is real. If you can't help it, buy the best flavor of the month mid-fi amp thing (I consider the THX AAA to be that mid-fi thing) and just stick with it until you can somehow afford a TOTL amp with one paycheck.

3. DAC is just like whatever... ya know. If you can afford the TOTL units currently being raved about on SBAF like Yggdrasil or Holo then... go for that. Same one paycheck rule as above applies. Otherwise buy a Modi 3 and be happy.

4. If you're 24 and you don't have a college degree, and you're potentially good at something that the industry is paying a lot for (biotech or computer programming for examples), do consider going back to college for a degree.

5. Again, this is important: if you can't afford it on one paycheck (and especially after other expenses), don't even think about it!

And that's it. In case you are wondering, I still don't have any problem with THX AAA + Modi 3. I barely have enough time now at home to use them, and at work, I just use Amiron Wireless because it's super comfy and convenient. When you realize that it's all about the music and not so much about the gears, it's easier.

 

Never buy anything on a credit card that you cant afford to pay off at that very moment with cash.

 

Have you seen my wall of shame?

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/where-is-the-endpoint.6822/

 

Understand your budget limitations and don't go hungry to buy amps, but with that in mind, in the long run it's definitely cheaper to go for high-quality one shot's if you can't resist fiddling around with the mid-tier stuff. Quality pays by taking you out of the cycle.

I'm younger than most here, and my advice is going to be a bit different from the replies I've seen so far. Of course absolutely do not take on debt to buy audio gear, that's pure stupidity. But also don't apply absolute rules - to be young is to enjoy yourself and be irrational, to some small extent. If the bottom line isn't hurting and audio is important to you, there's nothing wrong with splurging a bit.

That said, draft your budget and estimate living costs and discretionary spending religiously. There are apps that will help you do that, even lock up your money for you if you can't help but spend it. Think about purchases in terms of cost of ownership and depreciation. More specifically, think about purchases in terms of cost over time - "this amp is $1,000" versus "if I sell it in $700 in a year, this amp will cost me a dollar a day to own".

If you can find an amp used for a good price and sell it for a small loss, you're not losing much on owning the amp. Something like an HD800S or T1, the used market hasn't budged much in years, and if you take good care of it you're basically paying interest to own it. Much better than getting 2-3 pairs of cheap cans with poor, if any resale value.

If you manage them well, credit cards can be nice things to have. I buy all of my clothes with card rewards because I get 20% off a bunch of brands on top of whatever sale they're running. Again, the same rules apply and the companies will be sneaky about slipping in fees or denying you bonuses if you aren't careful. And I would stay away from Paypal credit , especially if you've had bad experiences with them in the past.

 

I've used paypal credit for years from when it was still bill me later. Everything I have audio wise was bought with 0% interest and no fees over 6-12 months. Even though I could afford the vidar/saga/Modi Multibit the thought of spending that much at once is disturbing to me. So I do it that way. I do suffer from buyers remorse and guilt though but that was probably more from being raised catholic....
I never thought I'd spend $600 on a headphone amp and if I don't use it constantly I feel bad about it. When I sit down for a session however that all goes away !
I don't buy anything until it's paid in full. (usually the same month it's paid off )

 

I relate to that, I can buy pricy gear without the blink of an eye, but a $5 album requires lengthy deliberation. I remember when a $200 headphone felt like an incredible luxury. I've cleared my bank a few times for this hobby.. to put that in perspective I'm disabled with no expenses, no current income, never used credit. Cheapskate tendencies, I'll downgrade my PC if I don't intend to game for the next few months only to throw the same parts back in a year later(Yes it saves money but it's a hassle.)

Glad to say I started downsizing before it became a problem. As I'm moving closer to beating disability I'm realizing how quickly 'spending tolerance' can get out of hand. I'm picturing people I know and their cars.

As for how it begins, It's easy to convince yourself that you're developing a skill & deserve more 'serious' gear. That it's your duty to own it all to be better able to guide the newbies. Or just getting caught chasing bottlenecks wanting to hear your headphones, amp, DAC at 100%. It's dangerous to let a hobby become your identity unless you make it profitable.

 

Based on your post, I think you have a couple of really important things going for you:

1. Self-awareness
2. A desire to change

I think you’ll be ok.

Try to think of yourself as an audio connoisseur, not consumer. Ravenous consumption of anything never leads to true happiness - it just feeds your brain’s desire for another dopamine hit. True happiness can be found in the appreciation of what you have, and finding new and surprising aspects about it. Do this by actually listening to and discovering more music, and focusing less on the gear. Easier said than done I know, but actively telling yourself the type of person you want to be can actually create that person over time.

 

I was lucky in that I found two companies that put out really resolving gear and undercharging for it. Sennheiser and Schiit. The HD600 was my first audiophile can and thoughts of owning the 800 sometimes kept me up at night. But the 600 got me 90% there and really really cheaply. It was easy to stick with that headphone. Cheap and practically TOTL.

And Schiit's product line is a natural progression up the ladder. Magni > Asgard > Valhalla/Lyr > Mjolnir > Ragnarok. Modi > Bifrost > Gungnir > Yggdrasil. I stuck with them too because that progression instinctively felt right, and better than jumping to random brands chasing the last FOTL toy and wasting a bunch of money in the process. It also allowed me to discover my preferences and know what I ultimately liked and disliked. Valhalla got me into tubes and Lyr 2 made me realize I wanted less neutral tubes and a more euphonic tube signature. Modi Multibit showed me the value of R2R and so I chased after Gungnir Multibit and that was like reaching Nirvana. That and Torpedo 3 was an easy jump into TOTL territory, because Rag/MJ2 wasn't quite what I was looking for, but I wouldn't have the T3 if it weren't for Lyr2 helping me understand what I wanted.

If there's a lesson here, it's keep it simple and take your time... while discovering your preferences along the way, and eventually saving for TOTL without breaking the bank. T3 was just under $1K used. Same for Gungnir Multibit. HD800 was $700. HD600 way way cheaper (600 in that chain is still end game). In the grand scheme of things and for the resulting sound you get, its one of the best bargains in this hobby.

 

You mean raising your personal debt ceiling and spending your way out of debt isn't the path to solvency? But, but....

These are good lessons to learn now tho. It's less fun when those chickens come home to roost down the line when you have actual responsibilities.

 

Agree with this. I learnt this lesson the hard way playing with portable gear for about 7 years, thinking back now I probably spent more than my current desktop setup, which I am super happy with.

When I got into desktop audio I targeted one TOTL piece of gear at a time and saved for months for it. Took forever and my audio experience wasn't great in the meantime, but now I'm really happy. There was a quote by someone (Chief Purr1n? Not sure) that went something along the lines of: you want to reach a point where everything else is a sidegrade or too much of a hassle to upgrade to. I try to live by that because it saves time and stress.

People in this thread have given better advice, but if anyone wanted an alternative mindset then here you go.

 

@scapeinator1
Yours is one of the most honest and useful posts I've seen on this forum. Thank you. I don't read any request for advice so I won't give you any ... I think you are onto yourself and are equipped to figure out what to do next. If you do take a break from SBAF, I'd love to see you come back and update us on how your efforts to re-balance yourself have panned out.

 

I might be the odd one out, but I actually really enjoyed my time in mid-fi purgatory. It helped me develop a sense of what I did and did not like, I was very active with trading/buying/selling (which is fun if you're in the mindset for it*), and in terms of overall sonic enjoyment I was probably happier there too. Now I'm just a miser sitting on my throne of unobtanium gear listening for the differences rather than the content.

*While playing in mid-fi-land, I was careful enough with my trades that I basically never lost out on money except for some shipping here and there which would have been no different than buying. So in that sense I was able to stay secure in my finances, only slowly trading "up" when the budget allowed.

 

Thanks to everyone here for your input. This site is full of honest, good people and for that I am thankful.

I worked up the courage to tell my parents and my sibling. My parents are the kind of people that immigrated here with literally just two suitcases and had their first house in like less than 6 years (not an exaggeration).

They were understandably upset. But they calmed down when they realized I still had some savings at least. It's not the end of the world. But I've definitely spent enough money to have had a modest down payment for a condo or something. And I think that's what I've been most disappointed in myself about. I had a decent span of time where I had full-time income and essentially no expenses and I really squandered the opportunities that could have created.

This will be my last post for a while.

 

Hit a low-point in 2015. Sold my AKG K500s (had two) and my Sennheiser HD250 II Linears (had two) and practically had to start over.

I keep a Koss PortaPro to remind me of how good audio can be on the cheap. Also why I have a G-Shock 5610 Tough Solar, find a better watch, almost impossible in the watch hobby (unless you need a Sea-Dweller for serious diving).

I just passed my 20-ties last year. Everything I want to do now depends on cash-flow. Remember Wu-Tang Clan's song "C.R.E.A.M"? They were right. Wu-Tang financial is where it is at...

 

I was deep in the credit-card trap years ago. Somehow managed to pay it off. Now I don't even use one.

The main piece of "consumer" financial advice I try to follow is it is much cheaper to buy only once. I bought a camera: just two years later I bought a new one, the one I really wanted at the time. Excess cost: several hundred UK pounds.

The thing that goes with that is that if you buy what you really want, and keep it for years and years, the initial purchase price will cease to have mattered at all.

All of that is completely incompatible with short-term upgraditis. That's a dangerous (well, ok, expensive) disease. We should remember that the stuff we loved yesterday didn't get worse because something maybe-better came out today.

 

Thank you for sharing this. I'm going through the same thoughts and it's nice to know that I'm not alone. I grew up in a pretty poor family and just until recently I've realized that I've been buying stuff that I wanted as a kid. I bought loads of expensive gadgets, PC components, and audio stuff in a span of a year that I have absolutely no savings left. I don't even use everything I've bought all that much since I'm pretty busy with work nowadays, which makes me feel even worse for buying them all in the first place.

To add to this, seeing my brother suffering from a manic episode and getting into more credit card debt every day is a great wake up call for me. I need to do something to help him out, but I won't be able to do that if I can't even sort myself out. Ever since then I've tried by reading fewer reviews (and SBAF unfortunately) and focusing more on work and my brother, and so far things seem pretty okay. Things do get better when you realize your mistakes.

Anyway that's enough about myself. I hope you're doing and feeling better about yourself, and don't forget to give us an update on your progress whenever it may be!