My new $99 Full Balanced headphone amp toy Loxjie P20

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by bilboda, Dec 16, 2018.

  1. Baten

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    amp looks cute though.
     
  2. Ryan2tawfiq

    Ryan2tawfiq New

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    How will it be effective for gaming??
     
  3. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    Effective at killing gaming headphones is a possibility.
     
  4. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    Funny you should mention it. There is a process that might do that. The amp comes default with unbalanced in and out selected. Frickin' manual was nowhere to be found. Plugged in my new Clears and heard sound, very quiet though and it would not increase. I remembered the process to select in and out. Pushed in the volume button, selected balanced in and out and BAM!!. Oh, that hurt. Had to deselect balance , go out of the menu and turn the volume way down before selecting balanced.

    Whew !! All us well.

    First Listen. New Clears and HD650K, balanced, unbalanced on MCTH XLR output. Gungnir Multibit as source using balanced and unbalanced connections

    I can't say anything bad about the sound yet. The Clears are new and sound terrific. HD 650 has sweeter vocals but the Clears may be simply...clearer. The amp has no issues at all

    Comparing to MCTH the Loxjie P20 comes out on top. The MCTH seems weaker I guess, not strained at all and very open, maybe it is plankton that's missing, a more complete sound, or, it may be more analytical, Can't say for sure. On one sharp intake of breath I hear more of the air whoosh than the chest/windpipe sound on the MCTH. The Loxjie P20 gives more of the chest/windpipe sound. Seems more natural to my ears, but who's to say, I wasn't there. This instance represents the difference I hear in the 2 amps, though.

    I will be comparing to the Crack and HD650 and a newly arriving MD THX amp later. These long weekends sure came at the right time. Listning to Clear balanced and Loxjie while posting and loving it.

    PS, the tubes are really cheap on this amp. A bent pin could not be straightened and the glass cracked in the process. I had ordered 5670's already, also from Amazon, and was gonna replace them anyway.
     
  5. antdroid

    antdroid New

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    I'm going to say you're old school. :)

    Just because it's Chinese OEM doesn't mean it's bad. And just because it's American-made, doesn't mean it'll work correctly. I mean, didn't Schiit (american-made) actually had the possibility to destroy headphones when they first released the Asgard?

    As far as the Loxjie - yes, word of warning. The volume default is set to "-20" out of the box which is very loud! I haven't listened to Crack yet, but another guy I know thought the Crack was better for his tastes using the Clear/Elegia. I prefer the sound of the THX-788 amp over the P20 usually, but the P20 is a change of pace. I have the Monolith THX amp/dac though, and not the Massdrop version.
     
  6. Baten

    Baten Friend

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    Definitely prefer the THX-789 over the loxjie. I think mine was defective though.
     
  7. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    Crack won't do well with the Clear/Elegia at all. One thing interesting in the Loxjie is the volume control using the JRC NJW1195. Volume is evenly matched everywhere on the dial. I imagine a standard pot is easier to add to an amp and they seem to have gone the extra step for a better solution, at least on paper. JRC calls it a resistance ladder network.
     
  8. Metro

    Metro Friend

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    Late catching up with this thread...

    The Jotunheim has SE inputs and outputs, and Schiit describes it as “fully balanced”: http://www.schiit.com/guides

    I would say that the term means that the product has the capability for full differential signal from input to output, not necessarily that this is its only mode of operation.
     
  9. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Balanced here effectively implies differential - two amps on each end working differential signals if fed such. The four gang pot should give it away unless Schiit put the four gang pot in there for no reason other than to increase BOM.

    Don't let that douchbag pseudo-engineer working at THX convince you otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2018
  10. Baten

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    I read once that balanced potentially cancels out more odd order harmonics, so you end up with more even order ones. So SE internal amps that just offer an XLR output or a converted pseudo balanced would end up with more odd order (more pleasing?) harmonics supposedly, would there be any truth in that or just an argument for their cost savings :)
     
  11. Sybase

    Sybase New

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    I just received this Loxjie and like it so far, hoping to run balanced to it soon with SMSL SU-8 on the way.
    I have a collection of 12au7 tubes and I found this adapter on eBay:
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/202260308376
    Wondering if it would be safe to use with Loxjie?
    Would there be any negative effect on sound?
    First post on SBAF :)
     
  12. Baten

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    You should ask the seller, SMSL / Loxjie. I asked them if it supported 12BH7 tube rather than 12AU7, and they said no. After all, with the supplied 12V power brick, the stock tubes don't even get hot!!! You can't place a tube that requires more power than the already underpowered 12AU7 on this amp or bad things will happen... worst case you brick the power circuit.
     
  13. Sybase

    Sybase New

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    Thanks for the info, didn't think it would work, worth a shot.
     
  14. pure5152

    pure5152 Friend

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    I got to try this at my friend’s place, and it sounded a bit lackluster and dry, much more flat SS sounding than tube sounding. Could be that it used the stock tubes, but not sure. This was source-fed from the smsl su8 dac (balanced), and listened with balanced cables through my pmx2 and his ether open (Not flow).

    Is it worth $99? Idk, I’d much rather get a Magni 3 for that money or little bear b4 (which actually sounds tubey)...
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
  15. antdroid

    antdroid New

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    In my listening vs MCTH and Monolith THX-AAA, I've picked up on a tubey sound with the P20. My measurements using EARS also show a increase in bass (subtle) when using it vs the SS and MCTH. I definitely hear the a difference in this region going back and forth using the Elex, HE560 and even more dramatically on the 58X (though I dont particularly like the additional bass on this headphone)

    Some of the edginess of the Elex is brought down a tad as well. Overall, I'm pretty happy for a budget amp. I don't use it as often as the THX-AAA but I do find myself using it more than the MCTH, which Ive subsequently sold off.

    IMO, if you want a more true sound, I'd pick up a SS amp.
     
  16. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    Some nitwit just spent $90 on "nos" Western Electric WE396a tubes for this $99 map :drunk:
     
  17. Pharmaboy

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    I need to be slapped silly for saying this (already have 6 amps, for f**k's sake)--but suddenly I'm interested in the P20. It would go in the secondary HP-only system: USB from laptop to Audio GD DAC-19 (I love the sound, so fire away) & SE cable to amp du jour (usually either LC v2 or Lake People G109-A). I love both of those amps, one described as somewhat warm (G109-A) & the other described as somewhat warmer (LC) ... so apparently I would tolerate the warmth & tube sound of the P20 quite well.

    The problem is that I love tube sound* (this goes way back to big/expensive tube amps & preamp for 2-channel). Like any addict in recovery, relapse can happen at any time.

    *One of the 6 amps is a Woo WA3 OTL which IMO sounds very nice & is easy to look at (people say I could spend big $$ to get a better OTL...but they say that about everything). The WA3 does well for high impedance HPs (>~70 ohms), but not so well for anything less (= most of my headphones). So I find myself wondering what the output impedance of the P20 is.
     
  18. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    I haven't tried the SE inputs, just the balanced ones. Previews indicated balanced was preferred. I have tried the HD58x out of SE and it was excellent, but using the balanced inputs. I switched to SE and listened to a track Alias Buster Henry, Clifford Jordan Quartet. Focal Clears, Gungnir Multibit, all 4 instruments have solos. GE 5670 tubes.

    SE input/balanced output:
    All instruments well placed. Piano and drum pans excellent. I can visualize the staging, including drum/cymbal placement.
    Bass nice and taut and present. Sax a teeny bit sharp at intro, sounds nicer later on. Easy to pick out and isolate on each instrument when they are all playing together, Very enjoyable.

    SE input/SE output:
    Not so enjoyable, bass has added bloom, as do kick drums. Instrument location is still there but not so distinct. I could really visualize the drum kit before. Now it sounds like they are all stacked together in a very narrow setup. The piano also shrunk in size. Sax is not that enjoyable, not bad but some added distortion. In this set up you seriously cannot appreciate this fine recording. Next...

    Balanced input/SE output:
    Much better. Bass has some, but less bloom than SE/SE. Sax is much sweeter, not fatiguing, drum kit has expanded. Piano is wider, Everything less congested, sweeter, more enjoyable.

    Balanced input/ Balanced output
    Very Nice. Sax tone is the best of the 4 options. Bass is sweeter fatter, maybe the edge of boomy, certainly has more impact, resonance, reverb. Piano is nice and wide. Distinct in the stage. Drum kit has the widest of the 4. Really like the bass in the mix.

    #1 BI/BO 100
    #2 Tie SEI/BO and BI/SEO , not the same but equally enjoyable.
    Overall SEI/BO is lighter and maybe better defined than BI/SEO, closer to #1 in stage.
    BI/SEO is closer to #1 in overall tonal character. 95
    SEi/SEO, not very good, fuggedaboudit. Maybe different tubes but no, I'll just listen to speakers. 60

    TLDR:
    Either input or output must be balanced, preferably both, at least with the Focal Clears.
     
  19. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    Verum headphone sounds lovely single ended with the WE396a tubes = synergy
     
  20. Pharmaboy

    Pharmaboy Friend

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    That's a very interesting looking headphone. It sounds good on the P20 w/WE396 tubes?

    My pair of these tubes just arrived today, well in advance of the P20, which will take another couple weeks to get here. Really can't wait to hear this combination.

    To get a balanced hybrid amp for $100 is kind of amazing, much less one that numerous people say sounds good.
     

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