Review: 64 Audio U18t (with lots of comparisons including Andromeda, Ara, og Solaris and more)

Discussion in 'IEMs and Portable Gear' started by rhythmdevils, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. Rockwell

    Rockwell Friend

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    And those people inevitably have their own biases and preferences as well. SBAF helped me get a more grounded perspective on Campfire Audio amid the hullabaloo I had to sort through when researching IEMs back in early 2019. One of the reasons I love coming here is the general appreciation for the company and their IEMs.
     
  2. yotacowboy

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    Alllllriiiighty!

    Quick Take (MBA to iFi Nano iDSD BL, and comparing directly to Andro OG):
    • treble is kinda fucked
    • Uninvolving sound
    • Falls apart on a bit on more complex material
    • Bass is okay, but that's the problem, it's just average
    So, usually I'll have the patience to fiddle around with different amps and impedances and whatnot but not with the U18t's. I think it'd only be a waste of time. Also, normally I'd tap out a quick outline in .txt, then come back in and fill things in for a more thorough review. Honestly I don't think that is worth anyone's time. These are just overpriced, that's all there really is to it, to me. So here's the review outline. I'll be happy to answer any questions!

    • Doesn’t look like $3k. Or $2k. Maybe $600 if made in China. Folks, normally manufacturers sand blast the aluminum to hide crappy tolerancing or the fact that the pieces are cast rather than fully machined. That's not even what these employ. The U18t is just cheap ass cast aluminum with hardly any finishing - not even blasted. That's completely unacceptable at this price.
    • cable isn't just laughable, it's nearly criminal
    • If I bought this and that cable came with it, I’d probably return them thinking they were fakes or demand the dealer send a cable at their cost, something that's commensurate with the price of these IEMs.
    • Somebody is making a lot of money off of these
    Again, compared to Andro (OG):
    • Lacking air, instruments don’t stand out in space
    • Less open headstage, closed in; no depth whatsoever
    • suckout sounds like 12-14kHz; maybe as low as 10k? need to listen to a couple more things
    • lacking image delineation, and specificity
    • A little more brittle and less fluid sounding, less cohesive in the treble
    • upper midrange “cuppiness”
    • lower midrange hump causes a mini-w effect within the broader response
    • creates a sense of less intelligibility in the the midrange altogether - it’s slightly confused sounding
    • A little less chesty on male vocals
    • Good extension in the bass, but it trails off a little below 40Hz
    • not a whole lot of punch, more slam
    • prominent wide hump centered around 50Hz, kinda nauseating
    Edit: So the plan was to do a few songs comparing U18t to Andro, then move on to Solaris. Then fiddle around with different amps and whatnot. Then listen to a few entire albums all the way through. Not worth it. Of all the IEMs I've owned, the U18t is probably most comparable in resolving ability and micro/macrodynamics to MDPlus, though MDPlus (on memory) had a more even, closer to neutral response. The Noble K10Us I had a while back were more even and less fidgety in the midrange, knowing they kind of varnish over things and fall apart at the extremes (too little definition in the treble, and too bloated in the subbass). In closing, the U18t is a highly disappointing IEM at $3k. I bought a used VW Passat GLX Wagon for the same price as these. Maybe I'm deaf, but there's just nothing there, to me.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2021
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    @rhythmdevils or anyone else: does this deserve a brown starfish award?
     
  4. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    You can get two CA Aras and still have money left over if you get the U18t MSRP. I even think the $109 Starfield Moondrop sounds much nicer than this POS.

    This IEM deserves to lick my anus on how much it was crap IMO.
     
  5. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I think so. I liked the upper mids when EQ’d but they weren’t designed to be EQd so that’s kind of irrelevant. Otherwise I think they were pretty crap. The Sony M7 sounds better in every way without EQ and cost me 500$ msrp. They also have 3 drivers. Vs 18 drivers at 3k$. The Gaudio Nair isn’t as resolving as an EQ’d u18t’s upper mids but is better in every way without EQ.

    you have he Sony M7 there in the 3 iem’s I loaned you when you have time.
     
  6. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I would likewise take the 100$ EDC3 or 100$ ish Brainwaivz B400 over the U18t.
     
  7. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    The M7 is a 4 driver IEM, but you're right on every other count.

    Speaking of, I wonder what people here would think of the Sony M7/M9. I know the Z1R got some shit for driver incoherency and being too bassy, but the M7/M9 don't really have either of those problems. Well, maybe they might still be too bassy for some, but I don't think it's as immediately overwhelming as the Z1R, at least.
     
  8. YMO

    YMO Chief Fun Officer

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    Me and others like the M9. @shotgunshane have the M7/M9 on his list with the bang for the buck going to the M7.
     
  9. yotacowboy

    yotacowboy McRibs Kind of Guy

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    Personally, I was more impressed with MD Plus. At a nearly good used car price, the U18T is just f'ing people out of money.
     
  10. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I also reviewed the M7 in my neutral iem roundup review. Very good with one of the best FR of any iem (dethroned by the Nair) but rubbbery tonality in the mids to bsss that ruin them for me. If Sony had given it 2 bass drivers (better not moar bass ala Ara) they might have had a real winner. And this problem likely isn’t fixed In the M9 since they added a treble driver.

    I’m sending the M7 out on a loaner tour but there isn’t much interest unfortunately. I’m not sure people here think a $500 iem could sound good.

    I think @purr1n will probably like the M7’s strengths and that may create more interest.
     
  11. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I took a good listen to the M7 before I moved. All the stuff is still in storage and I can't wait to get them out. The M7 almost awesome, but the bass is a showstopper - but then again not $3k, not even close.
     
  12. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    Nah, M9 bass is about the same. The gains going up to M9 are mostly in raw detail retrieval and treble extension. Not necessarily as good of a value proposition, but as good as that kind of sound gets, if you want to chase after it. You can get it used for under $1000 which greatly sweetens the deal.
     
  13. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    i already like the treble of the M7 (except for nit picking at some upper treble roughness). Sony was stupid to just add a treble driver. And stupid to leave that rubbery mid to bass on either model. Hard to understand when it was tuned so well. I fear it may be an issue of “design by committee”.

    I don’t know what you mean by “as good as that sound gets”. There’s nothing about good close to neutral tuning that necessitates high distortion (likely what causes the rubbery tonality). Sony could have done better.
     
  14. animus

    animus Almost "Made"

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    I suspect the rubbery/loose/flabby bass may be a limitation of the custom BA they used. Of course, I'm no Sony engineer so I can't say for certain, but I think the BAs they used managed to pull off one of the better BA designs when it comes to timbre while falling a little flat with transients. Distortion would definitely make sense on both fronts.

    By "as good as that sound gets" I mean that it's the best there is with that kind of sound on the market for now. I think it's pretty unique in that it's fairly relaxed and laidback sounding, where most BA IEMs without some sort of chamber design have really upfront presentations. Not to mention that it's one of the few BAs that, in my eyes, does timbre pretty well, and also sounds pretty cohesive and coherent while it's at it. I would love to hear a followup that fixes some of the issues with transients and staging/layering, and maybe brought a little more liveliness and macrodynamics to the sound, but knowing Sony it'll be a good 5-10 years before we see anything of that sort from them.
     
  15. DrForBin

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    hello,

    finally got to stick these into my head.
    (normal disclaimer, old, damaged hearing, sub optimal sources.)

    why all this bass? like nothing else seems to be there.
    midrange details are; muted? lost? covered up?
    this is an iem i just don't get.
    and the MSRP is USD$3K???

    sorry, not for me.
     
  16. Precogvision

    Precogvision MOT: Reviewer at Headphones.com

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    Honestly, I’m surprised to see how many here find the U18T dark. It’s quite the bright IEM to my ears. I hear fair amounts of treble below 10kHz, and unlike some of the other 64A IEMs, I don’t think it dips as heavily post -10kHz and preceding the 15-17kHz treble peaks. If it’s possible, one might try swapping in the MX/M15 module which should lend to the perception of more treble.

    I think the U18T’s a fairly solid IEM even if I would agree that it does not merit its price. It’s probably the least “64 Audio sounding” of the company’s IEMs; it’s very flat in dynamics and the tuning is quite “mainstream” in that it goes for a crazy mid-bassy shelf.
     
  17. shotgunshane

    shotgunshane Floridian Falcon

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    Not this tour unit. Based on your measurements at Headphones.com versus Crinacle’s and Purr1n’s, I’d say there is definitely some unit variance. The tour unit here was pretty dull. 15 ohms impedance made it bright though. I believe the tour unit only had M15 and 20 modules.

    Headphones.com
    upload_2021-4-14_7-58-53.jpeg

    Crinacle
    upload_2021-4-14_8-1-47.png

    Purr1n
    upload_2021-4-14_8-5-46.png
     
  18. Precogvision

    Precogvision MOT: Reviewer at Headphones.com

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    Oh, I didn't realize Purr1n took measurements. Yeah, that does look dark. One of the issues behind the un-lidding process for BAs seems to be that it's still not entirely consistent.
     
  19. paranoidroid

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    I have the loaner U18t now. Unfortunately it has a major issue where the left unit connector is bad and it cuts in/out but I'm able to test it enough and compare with my U12t. It came with the M20 module installed and that made it sound too mid-bassy and congested (same with my U12t). They sounded pretty bad to be honest. I then put in the included M15 module (which I also prefer on my U12t) and it opened it up with less mid-bass and I like it much better. They have quite a bit of treble detail to me (more than the U12t) and don't sound at all like a dark IEM. So far they seem to match what others say about the U18t compared to the U12t - increased mid-bass and treble.

    From what I'm hearing so far with the M15 module it's a somewhat bright detailed IEM. I'll switch back to the M20 module later..
     
  20. paranoidroid

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    Loaner impressions. I compared a OG Solaris, U12t and the U18t directly.
    • Both U12t & U18t have similar presentations where they both sound 'distant', like you're hearing the stage from further away. This can contribute to a very muffled sound if the seal isn't right, I find it more sensitive to seal than other IEMs. This also causes me to turn the volume up to attempt to get the sort of intimacy that's more engaging (like I get with the Solaris & Andromeda).
    • Sound stage and imaging similar with both U18t & U12t. Separation is good but the distant presentation makes it less engaging. Solaris has that intimate, yet wide and holographic image both of them lack.
    • With the M15 module I hear a somewhat bright analytical IEM, not much warmth in mids, has a mid-bass hump, not much sub-bass.
    • M20 module, too much mid-bass, better sub-bass. Less bright but congested and a bit muffled sounding. I preferred the M15 module.
    • Upper highs are almost too much, but it lends to a lot of perceived details. The chimes in Pink Floyd Time were ear-piercing. Didn't have this issue with the Solaris or U12t.
    • Upper mid on up, very clear, open and resolving. Lower mid maybe recessed. Vocals in general sounded unnatural and without the warmth the Solaris has.
    • Bass quality all around was poor, especially now I've figured out I greatly prefer the timbre of the DD Solaris.
    • U12t has similar timbre and presentation, but more balanced FR - although doesn't sound as open and clear in upper-mids and beyond.
    • Both pricing and number of drivers seem to be from a different time. A time when companies were competing on driver count. I don't really hear a merit to the number of drivers they used for the sound nor the retail price.
    Overall what stood out to me the most is the amount of high frequency detail, almost too much. Going back to either the Solaris or U12t I get less sense of detail but the more balanced FR was a relief for my ears. Most of the rest of the range sounded off or mediocre in quality.

    Packaging and cable is poor. The cable is only slightly less offensive than the cable Hifiman supplies with their Susvara, but similarly insulting. They also arrived with some connector issues on the left unit and I hope @rhythmdevils can get them repaired without much effort. I've heard this is a common weak point of 64 Audio builds.

    These were really interesting to try, especially given the wide range of opinions here. Thanks to @rhythmdevils for the loaner.
     

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