SBAF DAC Talk II

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by Maxx134, Jul 22, 2018.

  1. ReAlien

    ReAlien Acquaintance

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    Like I said, way too expensive to pair with $250 DAC.
     
  2. ReAlien

    ReAlien Acquaintance

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    Yeah, my audio buddy highly recommended it, just out of my league at the moment. You can get it for $250 new in China. https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?sp...PTH2u&id=577443097616&ns=1&abbucket=15#detail
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Who is this Whitigir and where is this breakdown? He sounds really dumb or he got the white-man price from the China dudes, which means he dumb dumb numskull with broken head.

    Unless it's a Lundahl, that transformer is a few dollars. ESS doesn't give out price sheets. In fact, no one does. Parts pricing direct from the makers is a mystery, just as mysterious as a price on CT scan or liver transplant. Its cheaper to buy parts from China than the same part from Digikey or Mouser. Sometimes five to ten times cheaper.

    That clock part is $2.50 for qty < 10 public price. Buy more and get better deal. Bargain like Chinese, get it for $1.50. Bargain like Indian, get for $1.43.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  4. Thenewerguy009

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  5. Mithrandir41

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  6. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    That only means you are dumb dumb numbskull with broken head.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    He's thinking DIYer prices where availability may not even be there, hence a huge jack up in prices.

    Here is the clock part from a China retailer / wholesaler. (I regret ever going on Alibaba, because my inbox get filled with spam from Chinese outfits offering me great deals on parts every hour).

    https://www.newbecca.com/product/561664273538

    Said "elite" clocks for $2.50 from China source. The same from in the USA fro Mouser might actually be $40.

    BTW, all this "elite" clock part here, clock part there, is pretty much marketing nonsense which has no bearing on the sound quality. Most manufacturers have mastered clocks in 2019. So please, all SBAF members, old and new alike, please please please do not fall prey to such idiocy. Brands of caps, clocks, resistors, boutique parts. It matters much less than people think, especially for sub $1500 gear.

    China gear is very good at advertising latest ESS, latest Armadillo USB, latest Dr. Feingold LPS, high quality BB opamp, most awesome torroid, etc. None of it means anything.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  9. weicheheck

    weicheheck Almost "Made"

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    I'm thinking about snagging an allo digione signature based on @skem's experience. Seems like the plug and play version comes prebuilt and with an SD card loaded up with the necessary OS, it can be purchased not built and without the SD card for $60 cheaper, that's an easy enough process that I should go ahead and save the money right?
     
  10. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    They're charging $60 to put it together and load an OS??

    Update: They're actually charging ~$15 to do this. The pre-built unit also comes with an SD Card and the RPi3 B+ board, a cost of ~$45 USD. Factoring that in, the difference is much smaller.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  11. skem

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    I did the calculus and decided one doesn’t save much going with parts. Pre-built and with a case, it’s just not worth the headache of going with parts. That said, I’m old enough that I value my time a bit differently.

    I do like the Allo a lot. Will buy a second for my other system. I use it as a JRiver end point and stream packetized data to it from my central media server. Since it’s TCP, there’s no quality loss. Just don’t use on-board WiFi if you want to minimize RF interference with the audio board. Also be sure to use an appropriate 75ohm coax cable of reasonable length to avoid reflections. See here for details.
    https://positive-feedback.com/Issue14/spdif.htm
     
  12. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    The article also seems to suggest that if true 75ohm I/O of devices is accomplished, then you can use a shorter cable with confidence.
     
  13. skem

    skem Friend

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    In theory I think you're right: if every interface is impedance matched then there should be no reflections. I think in reality there are always some reflections off of connectors, but they may be small enough so as not to matter.
     
  14. Priidik

    Priidik MOT: Estelon

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    Even bending a cable will result in some unevenness in wave impedance.
    Connectors and connections are an obvious issue.
     
  15. Walderstorn

    Walderstorn Friend

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    Just to end it. I had the u12 and it's a waste of money.
     
  16. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    I think BuyaPi.ca will be the best avenue for Canadians once in stock and to build it themselves. Sadly, we get absolutely hosed with shipping and the FX rate doesn't help us either. I've done a couple calculations ordering directly from Allo, a couple in the US and even Europe, and BuyaPi for CDN users seems to be the cheapest, with a couple caveats. (1) They don't have stock for the Signature or Sig. case (2) You either need two 'dirty' power supplies, know that you're going to buy an LPS, or track down a suitable battery pack to use.

    If shipping wasn't such a raw down for CDN buyers, the pre-built one with power supply and battery back directly from Allo as Skem mentioned is, frankly, your best bet to get you up and running asap.
     
  17. neogeosnk

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    This is exactly what I did and it was super easy to assemble and install Roon or Volumio. Picking up a Gustard U16 when it's on sale again and report back.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  18. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    Why add the U16?
     
  19. Baten

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    I have zero faith in Gustard as a capable DDC manufacturer, the price being so much cheaper than a Singxer or Allo Signature a dead giveaway for one. They are using an ESS USB chip supposedly made for cheap sound-bars for Christ sake. From ESS:

    We are aware that a particular customer in China is using the ES8620 in a new DAC. This device was originally designed for Soundbar applications and has been non-preferred for new designs for several years. We do not recommend this device for new designs and we are not supporting it here in Europe. Sincerely,

    I have more faith in Singxer, although from what I've seen from measurements including here on SBAF it doesn't really seem to be a 'big' improvement from your average on-board USB unless it is truly shite.

    The Allo signature on the other hand has squeaky clean regulated power, and squaky clean jitter specs. Doesn't surprise me skem found significant benefit when using it in his chain during his DAC-off.
     
  20. neogeosnk

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    I pc game quite a bit (usb), using the Allo Signature for roon only. I also switch back and forth between the matrix and Yggdrasil depending on headphones used. But the main reason, it's easier for the wife.
     

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