SBAF DAC Talk II

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by Maxx134, Jul 22, 2018.

  1. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    I just got my Modi 2 Uber back from a buddy after 3+ years and its missing the wall wart. Thankfully he ordered a new one from Schiit for me.

    The M2U is the AK4396 variant. Could I expect an upgrade over the AD1955 in my Emotiva PT-100?

    Either way I plan to try it out and see if I can really tell the difference.
     
  2. Griffon

    Griffon 2nd biggest asshole on SBAF

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    Since my question in the general advice thread fell unanswered, I’ll ask here.

    I’m currently running DAC-less. I’m using an Onkyo CD player directly into TU8600 driving BK20s. I’ll need a half-decent DAC with optical, coaxial, and USB inputs. Budget around 4-500USD but can go higher. Any recommendations?
     
  3. winders

    winders boomer

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    Bifrost 2....
     
  4. Pharmaboy

    Pharmaboy Friend

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    Not familiar w/BK20. What is it?

    Also, where do you place your preferences on the detail/accuracy vs musicality/ear-friendly sound spectrum?
     
  5. Griffon

    Griffon 2nd biggest asshole on SBAF

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    Fostex speakers.

    I’d want some more detail/accuracy please.
     
  6. yotacowboy

    yotacowboy McRibs Kind of Guy

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    Backfolded/backloaded Fostex horn.
     
  7. Pharmaboy

    Pharmaboy Friend

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  8. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

    Pyrate Slaytanic Cliff Clavin
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    Depends on the DAC. Most people weren't rocking some 1000 dollar Lavry Black, old Apogee, or Prism type unit that will always sound good. Now the better cheap converters and better interfaces are much closer to top level two channel converters than before but there is more crap than ever coming out of China from both Western and Chinese brands.

    The Modi DS and better cheap interfaces (Motu Sabres, Apogee Element, Focusrite Clarett) are really good. The interfaces cost 2-6x as much. To really beat it up, you gotta drop around 1000 or more or go RME for the clarity uber alles approach.
     
  9. Baten

    Baten Friend

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  10. Walderstorn

    Walderstorn Friend

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    Ok this is my 2nd try of a reply.

    Trying to be short and sweet. There is a big difference in attack, refinement and headstage (depthness and hightness) between the two. The Nano sounded "insuficient" to me, lacking as a "good solution", unlike the Micro that, while won't be to everones taste, provides a better engaging, refined, sound.
     
  11. ogodei

    ogodei MOT: Austin AudioWorks

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    Looks like Holo Audio is introducing a new flagship Kitsune R2R dac, the 'May', a 2 unit DAC costing approx 4K

    "We have this May dac to finish up with the KTE model and next will be working on the Serene flagship headamp/preamp. More will be announced at that launch most likely." Tim Connor, KitsuneHifi.com / HoloAudio

    There's an ASR review out there somewhere...
     
  12. Maxx134

    Maxx134 Dunning–Kruger effect poster boy

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    Yes I believe so .
    In my observation.
    I feel that the "leSarbre" dac has gotten sweeter and more euphoric in top end.
    While the AKM chips do a more overall delicate sound, what they call "velvet".

    Both newer chips I heard in the small "all-in-one" players like the ibasso220 & fiio m11pro..
    They both are now pushing out way more details.
    I would even say total end-game level details...
    The only issue now is just how, they portray this info...

    I have found them to STILL both be more artificial in presentation.
    The detailing is pushed up and not layered.
    The depth is not all there.
    The width and height is very impressive.
    The holographic image is still very limited in space (in those units) .

    I still feel that the most natural presentation of sonic image is still inherently grounded in the R2R camp of dacs...


    soekris dac1321
    Real resistor ladders.
    Cant go wrong.
    Heard it myself.

    Old design I had and sold.
    Lots of power and good but a bit dark sounding.
    It can have issue with sensitive headphones and make pop sound on them when inserted.
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2019
  13. RedFuneral

    RedFuneral Facebook Friend

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    On the topic of budget barrel DACs, the latest Realtek 1220 codecs have caught up to the $99 price-point DACs (basing this on a sample size of one JDS OL.) Compared to the OL the computer lacks dynamics but also is less bright/bloomy than the OL(velvet sound?) It may be lacking in subbass extension. I'm not hearing any artifice as I did with the OL & Herus DAC(many years ago.) I'm also 90% sure there's more raw detail here than the Metrum Flint I sold earlier this year. For reference any other Realtek I've used has been some mix of noisy, buzzy, muddy, and grainy. Old realteks force hash down the throat of any following gear. I'm sure these chips vary widely by motherboard implementation but I'm using a crowded ITX board without space for isolation or shielding(possibly the worst case scenario) and its clean, I have to crank my Beyers up past the point of discomfort to hear the noisefloor.

    Plugging the headphones in direct show a lack of power but also was indistinguishable from the JDS Atom to my ears. Considering I've been using this built-in chip swapping between a Schiit Lyr2, Rag 1, and vintage amp and can easily hear the differences between amps/gain levels I'm quite impressed.
     
  14. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    Finally got my wall warts from Schiit. Shipping mix up, USPS sucks, etc.

    I hooked up the M2U to my main stereo rig and I was immediately blown away by the difference between the ad1955 and the ak4396. Was not expecting it to be so obvious. The M2U has way tighter, heavier bass (third hit on Doin it Right rattles my windows) and sharper highs, but slightly less mid-range presence. Not sure if the crisp highs are making it seem like there's more detail but right now I'm tempted to say there is. I'll leave the M2U hooked up for now and see how I feel about it over the next few days.

    Pics or it didn't happen:
    [​IMG]
     
  15. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

    Pyrate Slaytanic Cliff Clavin
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    The M2U was good. Emotiva kinda sucks. Their best products were a passive pre and wall filtering strip. Their power amps, CD players, and clones of Adam monitors were very mediocre.
     
  16. wormcycle

    wormcycle Friend

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    Emotiva got out of the dedicated DAC business entirely. They discontinued DC-1, and DC-2 never materialized.I used to be into Emotiva, I owned DC-1 twice. The first one fried my Beyer T5p, and itself in the process. I sold it after repair. The second one lasted 30 mins in my system. I was something seriously wrong with how it messed up the stereo image. Could be just a defective unit again.
    What I really liked were their XPA-2 amplifier Gen 1. I also heard Gen 2 and 3 and they are still pretty good for a price. But there was no really improvement, other than modular design, over the first gen of Emotiva XPAs.
     
  17. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    Psalm, the Emotiva Stealth 8s were the only decent monitor Emotiva sold. Each weighed about 40 lbs and had some serious damping. I like the power filtering strip, CMX-2 but the LED lights stopped working on mine recently. Still powers amps connected to it but not sure if that strip is operating as it should.

    DC-1 can be a great value if you can find a used one for cheap. I wouldn't spend more than $300 on it and I'd only get it for all the features it has. Otherwise a Modi 3 is the better sounding DAC. Emotiva seemed like a decent value option before Schiit came along.

    Yeah they shelved the DC-2 which was supposed to have the latest AKM chips. I've talked with Keith at Emotiva and supposedly they still have plans for a couple DACs. But they've been saying this shit for years so who knows.
     
  18. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

    Pyrate Slaytanic Cliff Clavin
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    Yeah I used the CMX-2 with an Asgard 2 with a bad power transformer. It lowered the mains hum minutely. Getting a replacement unit minimized the problem.

    Damn I would not have expected that from the Stealth 8. I heard a working DC-1 that impressed me a lot at the time for tone and warmth but it didn’t have any balls. These hype brands all have vaporware hardware and software. Then you get them and they’re worse than known names and made in greater quantities stuff for sound and usability. There’s no way any Emotiva box with any chip is going to beat a real Apogee, Dangerous, or one of the recent RMEs since they changed the analog design from Behringer and Presonus level 4580s everywhere budget design to real deal parts. They just lack the knowledge and expertise to do so. Schiit plays around more with different sounds but have hit the mark more than Emotiva.

    RME and Yamaha are still standing for good reasons and don’t have to pay people (with money or gear) to shill their crap on user forums or user content focused platforms like certain hyped brands do. You just saw it with the Kali monitors but Audio-Technica, Amphion, and UAD do it too.
     
  19. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    Yeah the Emotiva labelled "professional" gear is definitely prosumer. I am not surprised their stuff would be outclassed by true pro audio manufacturers. And yeah the AD1955 implementation in that DC-1? The Convert-2 destroys it. No contest. But if we are evaluating in terms of value, it's not that bad. Heck if I needed all those features (pre-amp, balanced outputs, remote control, all sorts of inputs, etc.) I would take it over any DAC under $400. It was super convenient when I had it.

    Schiit just has a better approach to what makes good audio than Emotiva. And they continue to improve their lineup. Emotiva doesn't have an identity, they don't know what kind of company they want to be (are we a Home Theater company? Are we speakers? Are we "pro" gear?" etc.)
     
  20. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

    Pyrate Slaytanic Cliff Clavin
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    They “are” whatever the house electronics designer at their Chinese OEM has cooked up.
     

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