Schiit Gungnir Multibit impressions

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by Bill-P, Oct 7, 2015.

  1. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    My experience with A1 vs A2 is it was drier and cooler (less warm) than the A1, but still not “cold” by any means. More neutral. On all other technicalities (“blackground”, instrument seperation, etc) the A2 was a bit better. I didn’t find it brighter at all. Perhaps the reduction in warmth and drier/squarer attack/decay is what people perceived as brighter. Also Gen 5 USB was better technically than Gen 2, so this may contribute as well (not sure in which direction, but I believe Gen 5 may be a bit more incisive, but it was cleaner/less noisy).
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2020
  2. MLegend

    MLegend Friend

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    Don't forget to take into consideration the added warmth/bloom that Unison has.
     
  3. Senorx12562

    Senorx12562 Case of the mondays

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    I am still on gen 5, and mostly use the electrical s/pdif inputs anyway, but I do run it through Freya S at 4x gain SE to my speaker amp, which also adds a bit of those characteristics, seemingly without much penalty. Not zero penalty though.
     
  4. MLegend

    MLegend Friend

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    It wasn't pointed at anyone in particular. Just a general statement to keep in mind when comparing A1 vs A2 and different USB implementations or S/PDIF/BNC inputs.
     
  5. Scott Kramer

    Scott Kramer Friend

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    I posit it's not UNISON adding that flavor, but digital finally getting out of the way. So you are left with what the DAC actually sounds like.
     
  6. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Do any of you who own cool running Gungnir’s stack amps over the top vents of the Gungnir? Is this considered ok to do assuming the amp has “feet” that let air flow?

    I’m asking because everyone says the Gungnir runs cool but I’m borrowing one that is pretty hot.

    Also I’m currently supplying myself with the stuff I’ll need for a future Gungnir and if I can’t stack amps on top of it ill have to relocate it and have a longer XLR cable made.

    Thanks
     
  7. dncnexus

    dncnexus Friend

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    It's not a Gungnir Multibit but I stack my amps on my Yggdrasil. I believe the Yggdrasil and Gungnir Multibit run around the same temp, even with low clearance between the amp and dac it doesn't get any hotter for me. And my amp and dac stay on always. Hope this helps!
     
  8. Roman

    Roman Facebook Friend

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    Top vents? As far as I remember there are no top vents. All those holes are just decorations, not real vents. If there is no extra heat from your amp bottom the DAC will be fine.
     
  9. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Yes it does! I wanted to check while I still had time to get a longer cable.

    It’s strange how hot this one runs. But it’s been to Schiit for a checkup so I guess there’s just variation.

    haha figures. Like the fake air scoops on the “sport” models of old Subarus.
     
  10. Xen

    Xen Friend

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    I have Gungnir Multibit A1. The top has decorative cylindrical drillouts, but are not through hole. The top of my Gungnir runs around 105F or 40.5C. Not cool to the touch, at all, but just warm. I have my Eddie Current BLack Widow 2 stacked on top of it using cheap rubber feet found on wooden chairs to create a 2" (~5 cm) space between the two. I like to think of the Gungnir as a Pre-Warmer for the BW2.
     
  11. Senorx12562

    Senorx12562 Case of the mondays

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    I have my A2 stacked on top of a Freya S (the top of which is warmed by the bottom of the Gungnir:cool:) both of which are always on. The whole stack, plus a one inch thick piece of plywood, placed directly on top of the dac, is a small stand for my TV. Gungnir is warm (maybe 120-130F?) but I wouldn't call it hot. About the same as my Jot. Don't have any way to measure though. I used to put a speaker amp on top of it with no problem, but it was a class d integrated so ran cool anyway. I don't worry about it.
     
  12. Jinxy245

    Jinxy245 Vegan Puss

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    I was worried about the same thing. When I had the Gungnir D/S I bought one of those glass monitor risers, the dimensions worked & gave a little more clearance. From what everyone is saying though, it sounds like that was unnecessary .
     
  13. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Thanks for all the responses about the heat. This unit is hotter than all of yours, close to being uncomfortable when I leave my hand on it but not there yet. I tried to get a temperature reading using a forehead thermometer that also has a “surface” measurement mode but it must be on the fritz because it said 95 F which it obviously isn’t.

    anyways.

    in other news. I’m not that impressed by the sound of the Gungnir using usb5 and RCA SE output. So obviously the worst it could sound. But this is an over 1k DAC the se output can’t be that bad. my RDAC seems more detailed and nuanced than the Gungnir which is surprising. The Gungnir sounds flatter too.

    Also the FR is wildly different from the RDAC I can’t imagine the difference wouldn’t be measurable just using a pair of headphones connected to the same amp. The Gungnir makes my Andromeda 2020 pretty close to neutral without ieMatch which is awesome. Bass is neutral. The RDAC with Andromeda 2020 and no IeMatch is bassy and shelved with a southward sloping FR. It’s not subtle. I’m very curious how 2 technically proficient DACs could cause headphones to sound so drastically different in frequency response when both DACs presumably measure flat. I prefer the Gungnir for this reason alone because I’ve realized that the ieMatch dongle really reduces resolution and dynamics.

    I haven’t A/B’d them yet. But I just got a passive rca switcher so I will soon. I guess I’ll try to setup 2 iPods both playing the same song ha.
     
  14. lerrens

    lerrens Facebook Friend

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    Just got the Hugo 2 for IEM usage and wanted to share my impressions & thoughts comparing it as a DAC with Gungnir MB (A2)

    DACs: Schiit Gungnir MB (A2), Chord Hugo 2
    AMPs: Topping L30, SMSL SP200, Jotunheim, Audiolab 6000A
    Headphones: IER-Z1R, HD800S
    Speakers: KEF LS50

    Sound Comparison:
    Gungnir has a better reproduction of the dynamics of the music than Hugo 2, the sudden change in emotion of the instrument or vocal performance in a song would be delivered truthfully, creating a very engaging, immediate involvement in the music. The lower frequencies also sound fuller on Gungnir, having more density in vocals, and giving out more impact and sustain of drums and bass, the drums sounded very lifelike.

    Hugo 2 on the other hand clearly has better resolution and more clear view of all the details in the music. Not that Hugo has more detail quantity, the same details could also be found in Gungnir, but Hugo has a way to make the edges of the details very prominent, along with blacker background, creating this transparent window of view to the sound. To me the soundstage is also a little bit wider and taller on Hugo. However, something about the dynamics on Hugo is just not as enjoyable as on Gungnir. Hugo sometimes sound a bit too calm and even a bit lifeless compared to Gungnir. The lower frequencies on Hugo is very clean and fast but tends to sound a bit lean. Overall the tonality is brighter than Gungnir, and IMO brighter than what I considered neutral.

    On each of their own both of them are really good and enjoyable DACs, having a very solid density and insight into the sound they reproduce, and I did not find the ‘digital harshness’ & ‘listening fatigue’ I normally found in off the shelf delta-sigma DACs in either of them after long sessions. It's still hard for me at the moment to say which of them I prefer more, would probably come down to what music I'm listening to also what other gears are being used.

    Other thoughts:
    I wonder if anyone has noticed that the Gungnir MB seems to have an interpolation filter that is longer length in time than Hugo 2? (If I'm not mistaken that is)

    Here's how I reached this conclusion, first referencing the whitepaper about why interpolation filter length is important to Chord DACs, the conclusion is: for 44.1kHz sampling rate, the total length required for creating interval samples that are accurate enough is 1.443 secs, and that's the holy grail Chord wanted to reach when building the M scaler.

    For the same sampling rate fs = 44.1KHz, the filter length (in time) of the following devices could be calculated as follows:
    M Scaler: 1.443 seconds
    (1 million taps used on the up-sampled 16fs = 705.6K Hz signal, 1M/705.6K)
    Hugo 2: 0.07 seconds
    (49,152 taps used on the up-sampled 16fs =705.6K Hz signal , 49.152/705.6)
    Gungnir MB: 0.1 seconds
    (18,000 taps used on the up-sampled 4fs =176.4K Hz signal , 18/176.4)

    After the comparison and some reading about the technology behind, I do look forward in what technology advancement in chipsets performances may bring us in the future, especially with Jason hinting at the performance advancement they are secretly making for MB DACs...

    References:
    Chord Million Taps White Paper:
    https://www.moon-audio.com/files/chord/chord-tech-profile-hifi-critic.pdf
    18000 taps is mentioned in FAQ:
    https://www.schiit.com/products/gungnir
    Jason hinting MB advancement:
    https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...most-improbable-start-up.701900/post-15388698
     
  15. JeremiahS

    JeremiahS Almost "Made"

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    Do you guys think that the Sonic Frontiers SFD-2 performance level is closer to Gungnir Multibit or Yggdrasil in general?

    The reason I ask is because in here, the price between SFD-2 and Gungnir Multibit are almost the same. I currently have the Gungnir at home for assessment but have no experience with SFD-2. It's very hard to get one for testing...
     
  16. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I found a nice looking 75 ohm BNC cable on AliExpress and thought all you Gungnir owners might be interested. I haven’t been able to find anything other than Joe Shmoe broadcasting quality except for this and some super expensive cables (300$+)

    this one uses neutrick connectors and Canare wire and it’s 20$ for a 1m cable.

    https://a.aliexpress.com/_mLX7iqt
     
  17. rott

    rott Secretly hates other millenials - Friend

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    That looks pretty sweet.

    In my case it's more common to have 75 ohm coaxial RCA cables sitting around and the non-pro transports may not have BNC output, so I like this cheap and convenient BNC adapter:

    https://www.markertek.com/product/b-pf/b-pf-rca-female-to-75-ohm-bnc-male-adapter-bnc-rca
     
  18. Xen

    Xen Friend

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    Bluejeanscable.com
    https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/shopbycable/LV61S.htm
    If you choose BNC, then the connectors are also Canare.
    Pricing is close ($23.25 USD for 10ft/~3m or $17.25 USD for 3ft/~1m) not including shipping.
     
  19. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    BJC is what I use, never had any issues with their cables and I avoid aliexpress.
     
  20. roshambo123

    roshambo123 Friend

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    Currently running Gungnir Multibit A1+MJ2 but want to play with an SE Valhalla 2 setup, because different. Short of Bifrost 2, is my best SE DAC option to simply use my existing Gungnir Multibit's SE outputs for Valhalla 2? Or would I be better off with a Modius or Modi Multibit?
     

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