Schiit Magnius Headphone Amp

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by Vtory, Aug 11, 2020.

  1. Aklegal

    Aklegal Friend

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    This needs to be said alot and especially to guys like me who became "audiophiles" 11-12 years ago when vilifying all things opamp related was all the rage. I spent quite a few bucks on discrete opamps out of fear of subpar sound. Took me a few years to piss out all of the "opamps are bad" kool aid I drank.
     
  2. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    I should be the poster child for anti-opamp. After all, I'm a discrete analog designer. And yeah, I gotta admit, I had many years of looking down my nose at them. However, Dave and Mike have always been fairly comfortable with op-amp topologies, and they have gotten good performance out of them.

    The turning point was really Bifrost 2. The implementation of the LME49724 was shockingly good*. Would Nexus be better? Maybe. But it would also be a lot bigger, and it would require heroic stuff like 1% matched JFETs that isn't such a great idea on an affordable product. That's really what led to me playing around with Heresy and Magnius and the like.

    Does this mean I'm gonna be doing all op-amps all the time? Nope. I still think discrete is usually better, at least to my preferences, and in my implementations. Someone else may think differently (or have implementations that are different/superior to mine.) What it means is I have another tool in the chest, so to speak, to be used when and where appropriate.

    If you really want your head exploded, take a look at Tubecad.com (John Broskie's site, which Marv has recently mentioned). Broskie freely mixes op-amps with tubes and discrete stages (then designs out the op-amps or "sand" for people who want all-tube designs). Head. Exploded.

    *Fun fact: Mike and Dave chose the LME49724 over a bunch of more expensive differential op-amps because they liked the way it sounded. Mike and Dave also tweaked and tweaked and tweaked Modius until it sounded like they wanted it to.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
  3. wadec22

    wadec22 Almost "Made"

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    This thing is impressively budget aggressive. High-end, German crafted SS amp makers like Violectric and SPL gush about using the RK27 in amps that start around 5x the price of this thing.

    Ive recently become very aware of crappy pots and their affects. Painstakingly taking measurements you intend to share can be extremely difficult with an inexpensive unit (THX 887 in my case). Then afterwards realizing their negative affects are with you in your day to day use case.... Obviously not entirety ruining your experience, but annoying for the OCD.... You can't unsee lol
     
  4. Grattle

    Grattle Friend

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    Have you guys done any testing with the OPA1622? It’s the best Sounding opamp I’ve ever used. I‘ve really, really wondered why it wasn’t chosen for the Heresy. I am no electrical engineer though, so I assumed there were technical reasons.
     
  5. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    $$$$$

    Or, to expand on that, actually the 1612 is my current favorite on the SE side. But it's low output current and even more $$$$$. Good for a phono preamp.

    A more feasible alternate to the 1688 would be the 1656, which would only require 7 packages in the Heresy, rather than 9. But it's way too soon to update Heresy, there are a lot of wheels in motion (purchasing, scheduled runs, etc).

    Edit: Oh yeah and the 1622 is a flyshit part. Nothing against them, just lazy. I'll try it in something, see what it sounds like. Too noisy for the front end gain of a passive phono pre, though. Tons of output current in its favor, not rail-to-rail against.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Count me as that way. What changed my mind about opamps were the latest differential opamps found in the Convert-2 and Bifrost 2 DACs.

    When Jason old me about the LME49724, I was like, screw it then, just use these for most everything except for TOTL because it's so close and in some ways better than the outputs on Gungnir and Yggdrasil (blacker and cleaner).

    However, for what I want to hear, I think discrete designs are still better. The Burl B2 with its discrete pieces was eye-opening. I'm still waiting for Schiit to do a balls-to-the-wall output stage like they (same guys) did on the Theta Gen V.
     
  7. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    You know those had a tendency to self-immolate, right?

    (But these days, with matched parts, tighter tolerances, and maybe a thermal sensor just in case...)
     
  8. wadec22

    wadec22 Almost "Made"

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    @schiit what about an amp meant to pair with pro gear? Or is the recommendation always going to be to pair with something like Freya in the chain? I do like how Violectric offers the 5 pre-gain settings..... Interested to hear yours and others thoughts. Maybe too off topic?
     
  9. Metro

    Metro Friend

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    It is the SAME pot, literally from a vast oversupply of pots originally intended for Jotunheim. Jason discussed it at length in his chapter.

    This worked out well in the end, but Jason must be wondering about other things at Schiit that he doesn't know about.
     
  10. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    I'd settle for optional rack ears.
     
  11. Melvillian

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    Even the better implementations i've heard recently seem to not handle microdynamics very well. Not sure if it's the feedback or what. My experience is limited, but that seems to be a common issue i've noticed even with good implementations i've heard.
     
  12. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

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    Thanks for pointing it out! I somehow misread the text or was not familiar with alps pot models. Wrong info corrected now.
     
  13. ufospls2

    ufospls2 Friend

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    Man it just blows my mind that this and the modius (and some other gear) exist nowadays, especially at the price they do. Can you imagine these two 5-6 years ago? With those specs? Crazy. Great time to be in the market for a neat little stack.
     
  14. lagadu

    lagadu Facebook Friend

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    While I get that a lot of people want this compared to the Topping stuff because measurements, to me this seems to be directly competing with the Massdrop LCX in feature set and perhaps sound.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
  15. Yethal

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    It's not just measurements, it's also the fact that both of these amps have the same target demographic.

    Aside, why are the preouts turned on all the time?
     
  16. Cspirou

    Cspirou They call me Sparky

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    preouts are just the headphone outputs with resistors to raise the impedance. On a headphone amp preouts are a bonus but not a main feature. So you won't get stuff like separate on/off switching or independent volume unless you get a Ragnarok or RME ADI-2 Pro
     
  17. Yethal

    Yethal Facebook Friend

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    All single ended schiit amps do have switchable preouts (with switch triggered on headphone plug/unpug). Moreover Jot R also has switchable preouts (via a front panel switch). I already have a rag 2 in my living room and while I do love it for desktop system I'd prefer something smaller (that still allows me to conveniently switch between speakers and headphones)
     
  18. Cspirou

    Cspirou They call me Sparky

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    Jot R is an exception since it's a radical current mode amp and cannot use the outputs for a preamp. If you read the manual the preamp is totally passive, or in other words skips the headphone section completely and just uses the pot. A separate switch is really the only way to do any preamping at all

    Balanced amps do not have switching 4-pin jacks yet which is why it's on all the time. Same with the regular Jotunheim.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
  19. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    Yep, SE headphone outputs give you a free switch for the preamp outputs. With no headphone plugged in, the signal passes through them to the preamp output. With a headphone plugged in, preamp outputs are lifted.

    Balanced XLRs don't have any such inbuilt switch. So you're stuck with (a) leaving it on all the time, (b) adding a front panel switch and relays to turn the preamp output on and off (added cost), or (c) designing and producing your own, unique XLR jack (uh, no).

    Two fun facts:

    1. Some people hate SE automatic switching, because they want the preamp outputs to be active all the time so they can run subwoofers, etc. It's about the same amount of people who hate having things on all the time. So it's a lose/lose, though we do it since it is slightly more logical.

    2. I believe Neutrik used to make an XLR with a plug detector switch. Now, this would only be a single-pole switch, so you'd still need a power supply and relays to switch all four phases of a balanced stereo signal, but it would be cool. The problem is that it doesn't show in 4-pin form on any of Neutral's current docs. I just saw it in an old catalog.
     
  20. androxylo

    androxylo Acquaintance

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    Hi Jason before you are gone can this new Magnius s* be used as a preamp in the following setup:

    Modius balanced -> balanced Magnius SE -> SE Aegir ?

    I already have Modius and Aegir SE connected by Sys and I'm super happy with the sound. Always could be even better though...
     

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