The Two Channel Advice Thread

Discussion in 'Advice Threads' started by purr1n, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

    Friend
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2017
    Likes Received:
    6,522
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Canada
    Sensitive modern floorstanders in the price range you’re looking for with a highish sensitivity and a non-agressive sound seem to be somewhat rare. I was going to recommend one of Polk’s new Reserve series (R600 or R700), but they only seem to run around 88dB sensitive. Might be ok at moderate listening levels with 1 Aegir. I believe Crutchfield sells them and has free returns (minus shipping). Might be worth looking into. Check out the recent YouTube reviews for the R500 and R600. I’ll keep looking around a bit and let you know if I find anything else.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  2. zonto

    zonto Friend

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2015
    Likes Received:
    4,399
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Boston, MA
    @lithium, I don’t have first-hand experience with Aegir, but from what I’ve read monoblock Aegirs could get you a little more flexibility with speakers with slightly lower sensitivity. However, careful attention would need to be paid to the impedance curve of the speakers (i.e., their minimum impedance and at what frequency/ies). Aegirs are not going to have the balls required for speakers with impedance dips in the bass region and are not rated as 4-ohm stable. Schiit should be releasing their ballsy monoblock amplifier this year, so could wait and see. Otherwise, the Vidar is going to be more versatile.

    However, I would try to demo speakers if you can before buying. Reading online can only get you so far. If there are no dealers closeby, perhaps you can plan an overnight road trip one weekend to drive to the closest dealer with the brands you’d like to try (or hit a few dealers along the way). I’ve done that once and it was a very helpful experience. You may also find members here or on other HiFi fora or Facebook groups that live near you and would let you listen to their systems. That’s also helpful, and the impressions you’ll get are often more candid than what a dealer will give you. Plus there’s no dealer pressure / sales pitch.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 2
    • List
  3. lithium

    lithium Rando

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2016
    Likes Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Thank you for your help. I am looking into possibly going to the Triangle distributor to try them for myself.
    I will definitely try to get some actual listening with my own music prior to a decision- I am definitely conscious that "slightly bright" for older reviewers can be searing for others.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  4. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

    Friend
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2017
    Likes Received:
    6,522
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Canada
    Home auditions is the only true way to know if you will like something. Hopefully they work out for you. The Triangles are a very nice looking speaker and may be a bit more “tilted up” rather than aggressive or fatiguing, which plenty of people like. Good luck.
     
  5. yotacowboy

    yotacowboy McRibs Kind of Guy

    Friend
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2016
    Likes Received:
    6,078
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    NOVA
    Home Page:
    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/full-range-speaker-kits/fostex-bk-20-folded-horn-kit-pair/

    https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/sensitive-speakers-for-tube-amps.68/

    Worth considering, maybe? I had a buddy with a pair of the BK16s and a pair of Bottlehead Paramours and I was pretty envious of that setup, performance for dollar. I could imagine BK20s and Aegir might pair pretty well, are there any SBAF folk running that setup?
     
  6. nishan99

    nishan99 Friend

    Friend
    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2019
    Likes Received:
    825
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Layla
  7. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

    Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    5,335
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Winnipeg
  8. ohshitgorillas

    ohshitgorillas Friend

    Friend
    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    509
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    I'm in the market for an upgrade to my Schiit Saga. I am looking for three things in particular that the Saga can't provide: 1) MOAR TOOBZ, I want a fully tube-based preamp to give my system (neutral, linear) tube sound since I've committed to a solid state amplifier (Aegir), 2) higher input impedance, the Saga's 10kohm input impedance is its achilles heel imo, it doesn't jive with my Eros 2 phono preamp, so I've made a special cable with 47kohm resistors in the Saga end to alleviate this for now, 3) a small amount of gain.

    I'm tempted by the Bottlehead BeePre2 kit, however, it is expensive (at budget limit), quite large, and would require me to rearrange my rack. It would be the most expensive piece in the system (currently Schiit Sol > Eros 2 > Saga > Aegir > Tekton Lore, also Pi2AES > Bifrost 2 > Saga > Aegir > Tekton Lore), and I'm not sure how I feel about that. The Moreplay kit is also tempting, however, I would probably go for the WTFamps Sofrito which uses the same 6V6 tubes, but also employs a tube rectifier and shunt regulator.

    So currently the WTFamps Sofrito is looking like the best option, but I thought I'd ask if anyone has recommendations since I'm not too familiar with the preamplifier market. Doesn't have to be DIY but it's a plus.

    This is a duplicate post from the Preamps forum, the main discussion of which ends with several requests for recommendations which have gone unanswered... I thought I might get more attention here.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  9. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,857
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Found your post by searching perhaps you(or anyone else) have had ears on these. Thinking of building some Audio nirvana super alnico 15 speakers. I’m pretty sure i can make a cabinet with some help, something full range with a crossover might be a good first diy project.

    Also BWC… i want that shit.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  10. crazychile

    crazychile Eastern Iowa's Spiciest Pepper

    Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Likes Received:
    2,246
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Eastern Iowa
    I looked into single driver stuff for a while but never pulled the plug so I can’t give any listening impressions. I might build a small bookshelf speaker at some time to try out, but if I do it will probably be a 6.5 to 8 inch.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  11. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,857
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    I found some smaller stuff by Markaudio that looks interesting as well. I'll do some more digging...
     
  12. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,839
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Better fight with something like this. Unless you REALLY know what you're getting into.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  13. JustAnotherRando

    JustAnotherRando My other bike is a Ferrari

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2017
    Likes Received:
    1,437
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    I put together two or three foam board mockups for Markaudio speakers (uh... Pluvia or Alpair? Can't remember the names) and really, really didn't like them. Spikey, sharp treble around 5-6Khz. I had to run them wildly toed-in and with severe EQ before they became bearable. Did the recommended 100+ hour burn in. I tried both the smaller boxy designs and the tower/pencil design recommended by the manufacturer.

    My comparisons would have been to the Overnight Sensations and Zaph SR71s. Driven with an Akitika DIY kit amp. Both the OS and the SR71 were far more pleasant and less... painful to listen to.

    Kind of bummed out, because the company is local to me. Their office is literally within a 10 minute drive, though they ship from across the border.

    Edit: If you are going to look into them, pay particular attention to their FR graphs, off memory they run quite an expanded y-axis.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
  14. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,857
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Well i REALLY don't hahaha. Thanks for the recommendation!
    Yeah i found some of your posts, that is not something i want to deal with. Smooth treble is quite important to me and it seems most have this kind of problem. Just the lure of a point source without paying Tannoy money is appealing.
    I'll go explore @Hrodulf's recommendation.
     
  15. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,839
    Trophy Points:
    113
    With all types of point sources treble is the hardest thing to get right because you're radiating highs from the center of a cone. The proverbial pie in the sky of course is the bigass 12-15" driver which covers from 40Hz to 20kHz, but I haven't heard of anyone who could pull it off in a way that has none of the drawbacks. IME only widebanders 8" and smaller can do okay treble, but generally they excel at mids and hate high-ish SPL's, making them very specialized. A quasi-point source array is the best I've heard in this school of thought -

    [​IMG]
    The horn plays to around 800 - 1000kHz with a 1st order X-over to 4x18" drivers. The low crossover point makes the horn acoustically invisible, so the directivity is very good. Of course, this is hardly a mainstream solution, so maybe it pays to explore proven MTM designs first.
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 2
    • List
  16. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,857
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Hmm you're right i don't think that's a good candidate for a first speaker build. MTM does intrigue me, surface area of a bigger driver and pretty much point source without the treble fuckery. That's seem like a better route to explore and there should be some nice kits and designs out there. Just gonna have to accept the fact i have to do a crossover, can always make that external so i can just build the box and easily tweak it to my liking/learn.
     
  17. Priidik

    Priidik MOT: Estelon

    Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,909
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Estonia
    Hi @Riotvan

    It could have been that I started roughly from same place myself. When I would have not decided to make speaker building my greatest passion, and could go back in time to advise a novice me, I would tell him to get a kit from someone who knows what they are doing.

    A really good complete speaker is much more than some experiments with xo, quite blindly choosing drivers and a general idea of enclosure design.
    It takes years to gather the experience and knowledge of what goes well together. Not unlike a chef preparing food.
    • Almost no money and abundance of free time and burning desire to build speakers--> go ahead and start from scratch, you might end up reinventing the wheel (as big of a chance as there is THD in chinesium amps/dacs). You need all the tools and skill or contractors for cabinet building, measuring equipment and a place to build. Do not expect great sound any time soon!
    • A bit of money, lots of free time and some interest in diy --> get a more open source kit that can be easily tweaked and upgraded, not straight step-by-step build, but vision is laid out for you. Basic measuring equipment is still must have on this level (gated fr response and impedance).
    • Money is less of an issue, some free time and you like carpentry (or milling stuff from aluminium) or have access to a contractor --> build a full kit from a well established designer and build it exactly as is instructed, Troels, J Baggby etc
    • Money is not an issue, no time, no interest in getting dirty --> buy good speakers
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 3
    • List
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
  18. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,839
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Agreed 100%! Basically it's about "having a speaker" versus "building a speaker". I'd always advise on starting out with a proven kit and then if you feel you're ready, dissect the reasoning behind the design choices and maybe try optimizing some of the compromises. Starting out from scratch is a good way to end up dissatisfied with the whole ordeal. Then again @Riotvan is from NL, these guys have speaker mojo in their genes!
     
    • Like / Agree Like / Agree x 1
    • List
  19. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,857
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Thanks for the great advice guys!

    My thought process was as follows: Get a nice kit everything pre designed as mentioned above. Then i started reading about full range stuff so if i get a full range driver that doesn't need a crossover like the Audio nirvana super alnico 15's building a cabinet would be straightforward enough(they do have plans you can use).
    But full range has problems and i want point source ish. So i was back at the start. Basically Priidik's 3rd option fits my preference, i already went down route 4 multiple times and i am happy with what i have don't get me wrong.

    It's just i also like diy and always wanted to build some speakers but if i do something i like to do it right if you know what i mean. Picky genes? haha. The journey is fun but the destination is just as important or even more so. Perhaps it will lead to more diy or just a great end game speaker.

    Some kits i have been looking at are Troels MTM Discovery, Seas Thor and GR Research has one too that looks interesting but import duties and shipping are prohibitive especially if a flatpak is included. There are bound to be more but these came up in a search and seem to be of high enough quality to have the potential to be end game.
     
  20. spwath

    spwath Hijinks master cum laudle

    Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2015
    Likes Received:
    7,596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    Building the Illuminator 66 Illumina-66 (troelsgravesen.dk)
    Thoughts on amplification for it? Right now I have no 2 channel gear at all really, so need to build a whole setup, looking to keep it under $1000 (excluding speakers obviously)
     

Share This Page