The Ultimate Lurker’s Guide to Pinning Yourself to a Cross

NwAvGuy was actually... Jesus.

 

Maybe we should change the name of this thread to The Ultimate Lurker’s Guide to Pinning Yourself to a Cross.

 

It was a good thread.

Maybe I'm one of the people who needs to shut up. Consider it done .

 

"NwAvGuy was actually... Jesus."


Right or wrong at least he was thinking by himself....

It is easy to mock people who are not sheep...

By the way i never think that his amplifier would be good and never buy one ...He was too dogmatic for me....

 

Speaking as a person who almost exclusively buys used stuff outside of necessary appliances etc (it IS often great value), it's a bit disingenuous to deny that there's not an element of snide rarefication to "buy this long out of production item and if it's not quite sea-worthy then you'll have the absolute pleasure of playing the 'find out what's busted and fix it, or find someone allegedly reputable that'll do it without driving you into cheaping out on a few meals!' game".

There is no denying that excellent deals are there to be had in the used space-- I personally advocate for keeping things around and usable for as long as physically possible because dear f'ing God we all are literally running out of food that isn't impregnated with microplastics, but to unilaterally denounce all that is new as reprehensible claptrap is precisely what disgusts me about the fountain pen community, and why I stopped attending larger scale meets and only go to more intimate meetups where I know I'll at least be among good friends.

It's true that many things made nowadays have obsolescence baked into their very being (good luck keeping those wireless IEMs alive for very long) and it does seem to be the case that, as a perfect diametric thereto, vintage audio gear/televisions/light bulbs/cars/electric fans/sewing machines just about reek of permanence, but it doesn't take more than a few minutes of due diligence to realise that there's always a fair risk of venerable items needing exhaustive service in some form or other, or of their contributing to waste volume sooner than an equivalent modern piece may.

Neither buying exclusively new toys or museum artefacts makes any sense because that's a gross oversimplification of things. Find what works for you and be happy with it,but belabouring how you must be, unequivocally, right about something because it works for you, specifically, and the music you listen to in particular, also has echoes of the "audio elite teaching the masses what to buy."

 

I only advised this:

Beginners must look in audio history and learn basic acoustic instead of buying only hyped basic product which are NOT long term solution to good audio experience...
Because the best S.Q./price ratio is often in product of the past verified good and more than good product by time.... Saying the truth is not selling "truths"...



Only two or three people here complained about common sense: Before buying we must study a bit and we must learn not to trust hype ...

 

This is a sentiment I can appreciate and fully stand by.

Besides there being factors off-forum that don't warrant talking about, the main reason I saw fit to write all that was that implicit denigration of New Things that read as being prejudiced.

Don't get me wrong, a lot of what I see being marketed in audio and assorted other sectors is indeed made with a faint modicum of effort and pushed in a predatory manner, gutting people's insecurities, but while I found nothing reproachable in your first post here there was a plethora of things that I disagreed with later on that you insisted on doubling down on, particularly that there are NO companies in the modern day making improvements or that people in prior decades were somehow more saintly and eminently skilled than the unbathed and disease-ridden late capitalist bugbeds being made to churn out mediocre product after mediocre product by virtue their being the latter's forebears. That is an unkind perspective.

Drawing equivalencies of cost across decades is disingenuous. The AKG K340 launched for USD300 in the 1980s, so the modern cost would range from USD1,369~925 in modern currency depending on if this was launched closer to 1978 or 1982, and the fact that you've modified those headphones as well further distances it from a fair comparison to contemporary releases, even considering that they can be had for a fraction of their retail cost now.

Granted, who knows if any Focal headphones will still be functional by the next decade. I like how their headphones sound, but I hesitate to buy them, even used, because they are expensive and fragile by comparison. That they are so is sickening, and I hope the lack of news I've heard of units breaking isn't merely due to people getting tired of whinging about them on public platforms; I know one person whose Elears had to be replaced FOUR separate times, and he's either lucked out with the death number or has simply given up.

I agree that people should look beyond marketing and make a proper study of things as best they're able (I used to work with ad agencies and such, and this is why I have lost good faith in advertisements; they will seek what is sacred to you and convince you that you'd be a meaningless heathen for not paying greater tribute to it through a convoluted means that inexplicably profits someone else). That said, not everyone has the privilege of having the time or tenacity to learn acoustic theory if and when it's leagues removed from their field-- the modern world is unkind to the like of renaissance folk, and unfortunately to many now the line between marketing fluff and earnest research paper is well blurred.

This also only applies to audio gear, but while music is an integral part to many people's lives, rarely is it the case that it's the sole impetus by which a one lives, so their attention is then diffused and distracted, and they're only left further confused and at an impasse of choice when so many loud voices clamor to disregard what others say and to "do their own research" without being sufficiently aware of the elemental basics of what need be understood prior to doing so.

 

Lyander, i partake with all your last post content ....I will sign all your clarifications...

I will never claim that no new actual company rival old one... It would be stupid to say so... I only speak about a big company of the past with the means and the desire at this era to pursuit not only innovation but introducing new technology too... It was only an example about the nec essity to read audio history a bit.... Thats all ... There is for sure some companies like that today in the headphone world...

But none can give at this used price anything rivalling the K340....I was speaking for people interested to see more by reading about past TOTL component... Thats all...

 

As solid a list as any thus far.

 

Yep. And not to send them on a study course.

They don't even know they are interested yet.

Jesus!
(What would he buy?)
.

 

Vinyl.

 

spinning it on a Mag Lev

 

DJ JC reps Maglev, NOS Western Electric, and Porta Pros exclusively. On the ones and twos and trinity.

 

Krishna preferred CD (or might have been DVD, it is hard to tell from the TV series). He span it on his finger. And if someone really, really annoyed him, it flew off and decapitated them.

Neat, eh?

I have no idea if he studied audio history first. I think he preferred cow girls.

 

First personal preferences alone are meaningless for others if they are not informed preference to begin with... Acoustic is not a question of taste...Nor engineering... Brand name cult may be just an uninformed personal biases reflecting only a lack of knowledge .... It is the reason why we must study a bit to give meaning and direction to our own choices...It is useless to buy budget or high end speakers if we dont know how to embed them the rightful acoustical way in a room...

Second our own personal preference are meaningless even for ourself if they are not guided by a studying journey....

The personal preference to emerge meaningfully must be born in an educated mind or in a mind who try to educated itself ... Then forget hype reviews , it is way better to study past audio history a bit for enlightened choices and basic acoustic to learn how to use our audio system in a room or help us with basic acoustic and psycho-acoustic how to choose the best headphone...Especially in this world when most of us we must buy sometimes without being able to listen before buying...

We developed informed preference, we dont put preference on us like a sales tee-shirt...Only children act like that or blinded consumers... I am to old for the first category and too experienced to be captive of the others...

S.Q. experience is more about acoustic experience and experiments than about innate "taste" or market approved "colors"...Save for zombies consumers...

Anybody can put a list of budget new hyped products to buy....This is often useless... Only personal opinion heavily invested and experienced with a single chosen product or very few one, which they defend by precise arguments means something for us... Marketing rethorical list of products is useless...

Then personal preference are developed in an auto educated journey and they become meaningful then for us and perhaps then for others.... A clue: we do not develop personal preference by reading reviews of new gear for the sake of upgrading till the end of time...But by thinking and studying a bit by acoustic experiments and enlightened informed purchase...

And vintage products at low cost by the way may be " easily acquirable and affordable"...

And about synergy the essential point is the synergetic component is bought to SERVE an already critical component in our hand : we dont buy speakers for the cable but we buy the cable for the speakers... Then the first critical choice is the speakers choice or the headphone choice.... These will orient the synergy direction... The amplifier must serve the headphone or the speakers not the reverse... Then BEFORE SYNERGY creation we must choose wisely the critical component out of any synergetical chain...OUR FIRST CHOICE IS KING AND CRITICAL not synergy " per se"..

Generally people buy a dac for example to improve the speakers or headphone experience, not the reverse...

Anyway It is ok to list 3 synergetic basic components for newcomers, like some already did above, but t this is not the best and definitive terminal solution for educated better choices for sure...

Why mocking my basic common sense advices then? My advices does not and never contradict basic new audio system recommendations here... But excluding vintage is imposing blinders.... I only said that a basic low cost system is only a temporary situation for most, then instead of upgraditis without end,( some buy dozen and dozen of headphones unsatisfied ) , i advise to read past audio history to improve our choices and study a bit of acoustic to understand our own experience... Why pointing a pistol against my post then ? Crowd mentality perhaps?



And in an educated mind a critical component like an headphone may be a vintage one why not? And a vintage reputed amplifier could be better synergy than a cheap recent one for the same price...

It is incredible that some people here think that others people beginning in this hobby must be guided like children toward their self approved chosen list of hyped product... By the way i dont buy tee-shirts with hyped brand name....

 

Calvin Klein FTW. All day long.

 

@richard51 , I do think you have more than stated your point. Happy Listening!

 

Comical move... Instead of arguments he put a label on my post about misinformation...Like some others in their political self approved context...

Remember that i ONLY advised people to read audio history and study acoustic to improve our choices... i proposed sometimes to look at vintage material choice because they could also be rewarding and i gave 2 exemples from my own journey and this is labeled misinformation....

Did i must use also the right approved "words" to be here?

He decided like "a seller" that synergy is king, but anybody with a brain know that critical FIRST choice are the most important one.... Synergy comes after... The only who doubt that are sellers who want to sell their officially appointed promoted ready-made system in one selling swoop... Never let the customers the time to think... Buy that newcomers and your problem is solved...

Amazing ....

 

Sure, we've had this discussion before. And we already have a thread devoted to careful, unhyped, honest, and throughly documented system synergy experiments; some new gear, some old gear, but you better know your own preferences before you go out and mimic any of the systems in that thread.

Your "advices" are but one "direction to orient a synergetical chain." The intent of this thread is to provide a lower barrier to entry for folks who may not care to wade through the bullshit of "hype". We're trying to offer low-mental-investment shortcuts to adequate, if not noteworthy, audio enjoyment. No polemics, no manifestos. If you feel the words like: "MUST," "SHALL," "ONLY," "ALL," "ABSOLUTE," "PERFECT," or "UNQUESTIONABLE," are necessary words to state the value proposition of any specific set of audio components you're recommending in this thread, I feel you may be missing the point of the thread.