The vintage Ortho thread

YH2 with just the 2lb density foam looks a little less damped than mod2 (felt sealed with micropore). I could up the damping by cutting the diameter of the foam a little larger. I cut the foam to the diameter of the driver, but Ill try cutting to the diameter of the enclosure cavity, so less air maybe. Right side measurements looked better, but I try to stick with sharing left only. A(nother) reason for imbalance is that I didn't cut the foam in half well, and right side has a little more. But before I mod YH-2 more let me measure YH-1 and T30.

 

Getting measurements with oversize velours is unreliable for positioning and seal. However, my placement seemed reasonable and bass hardly changed at all with positioning but highs were more influenced. Upon putting on I felt a sharpness on my ear drum*. The peaky highs could be real. This fv (foam+velour) measurements also had the least highs... Hmmm. Probably wont mess with T30 much until I get some new pads.
* I only listened for about 30seconds pre-measurements, trying to get these done.

 

YH-1 looks like it could handle more damping. YH series might benefit from velours like T30. Will try 6pound foam and sorothbane next.

 

I'll add pics in a minute.



I replaced butyl with sorbothane. Not sure if I could hear the difference. I have listened to the YH1 very little. The upper mids are uncooperative. The 1/2" thick foam was a little too much damping, so I cut in half to 1/4" thick which fit much better, unfortunately looks like too little damping now just like the result with YH-2 (see an earlier post).

YH-1 sounds nice like this. Even though its not fully damped and sounding as clear and fast as possible atleast the upper mids don't grate, more like subtle pin pricks on some tracks.

Multiple materials probably better to get different frequencies absorption. Maybe reason why felt is so good, because the density is not uniform. Easy to see when held up to light. Perhaps the easiest or best mod is just add felt until just right.

I've ordered hybrids and velours for T30, and velours for YH-2 just to try (I don't think necessary). I would've bought something for YH-1 but Amazon was all out of stock, but I'll get some measures with the YH-2 velour pads even though they're a little small. Also am buying an RP18 kapton. woooooooooooo!

 

Sorb around driver edges. Butyl to fill in any gaps.

1/2inch thick foam that was later sliced in half to be 1/4inch. 2pound density open polyeurethane something from mcmaster carr.

 

Holy shit

 

Are HP-1 anisotropic magnets all black and smooth? My YH-1 is pretty smooth but like a dulled black (aka grey) like a blackboard with some washed out areas that are lighter color.

Looking for anisotropic HP1 comparisons to non anisotropic. Some claim no audible discernable difference besides sensitivity. Some say huge difference. But its hard to know what variables: damping and pad condition, and upchain. I would assume ani is better.

Looking at orthowiki, the HP1 used a 55mm driver with a membrane effectively 48mm. The HP2/3 links dont work. I was wondering what’s their membrane’s effective size. I posted this question to ortho roundup too, will update if I find the answer.

Not sure which is preferable: YH-1 or YH-2. 2 slightly more balanced but smaller driver, I can damp 2 more than 1 before treble gets too hot. Still working on mods and waiting to try alternate pads.

Felt may be best material. My craft felt when held to light shows sprinkled variations in densities. Different densities absorb different frequencies I guess. This thin craft felt in multiple layers could be best damping material. Im going to give it a go after pads arrive tomorrow.

 

I don’t think anyone has ever successfully changed the pads on any Yamaha. Not that I’ve heard of at lest. Something to keep in mind when you rip those pads off.

 

Ive ripped them all off. Light dabs of super glue and you’re good, easy to pull off again when wanted. Alternate pads have been found that improve Yamaha YHD series. Yeah, I have little hope velours improve HP/YH. More porous pads means front and rear damping will be more equal if that matters. Orthos sound bad with sealed enclosure. Maybe leather/sealed front side is less than optimal too. T30 and RP18 proven to smoothen out highs with hybrid pads. Just dont know what other effects it has besides frequency response and soundstage.

I still dont see how sorb is better than damplifier. Damplifier uses two layers of different materials for good reason fwir. Sorb is single layer.

Between RP18 and T30 I will likely only keep one. Ill trade ya for an anisotropic HP1. If youve not heard T30 you may borrow of course. T30 is neat because it uses the vintagey ortho magnet: circlular slabs with holes or slots for sound to pass through. The RP18 has more modern style magnets: rods spaced apart in a pattern.

YH-1 I listened to this morning for about an hour. The increased soundstage and dimensions of instruments in space particularly drums is nice... more driver is more. This is why I started researching HP1a more today. Some in ortho round up have got lucky and bought random non-descript HP1 and find an anisotropic driver inside later. Its the only way to tell the difference without having the original box showing the specs.

 

Cut foam too wide. I dont want it pressing against driver face, which it does some here. Felt in back of cup. Im trying to create a cavity and just damp at vents. I also redid the sorb so its all really tight. 2lb density foam
View attachment 25922
fcv = foam circle vent

 

Classic differential damping at work. I am loving all the graphical representations of all these methods

 

I remember like 12 years ago you telling me to make a foam donut and that this cavity behind the driver tended to increase bass response.

 

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These pads are a little snug on ears so wish I went one or two sizes up. Baffle is approx 82mm. Pads were specified as 85mm. They sell them in increments of 5mm. The pads are much thicker than the velour pads I was using temporarily. The foam is harder too so they don't compress as much. Don't sound bad, but not as comfortable.

Still waiting on that RP18 confirmation/tracking. Seller has gone ghost past couple days. I think they work long shifts.

 

T30:


Abyss:

 

Same mod as YH-2's last. Will try 6# foam next since looks like this driver may need more damping.
edit: As you can see lots of attempts to measure. The headband came apart...

 

hp = hybrid pads
f = foam
nd = no damping / no foam

You can see in the T30 photo that velours were on. I was not liking that 2kHz dip with hybrids, vocals were a bit distant. Velours though have a small bump at 1kHz that I think is the source of fatigue. With foam mod the hybrids are sounding good. I don't know what to expect from damping these serpentine style orthos - I haven't researched yet. Will there be a drastic improvement in speed/detail like with the Yamahas? T30 undamped is already greater than damped Yams though. Yam treble peaks are still noticeable after mods and not quite as resolving or dynamic compared to T30.

RP18 is a go and will come from Japan at some time.
@Merrick I expect will post some impressions. We will be trading phones and posting some Gen impressions in a few weeks hopefully.

 

RP18 disassembled, by @GREQ whom also has a great collection of pics and measurements of other vintage headphones.


Fostex T50 on a newer Fostex headband, by @takato14

 

Put twice as thick cut of 2lb foam in back of cup, then lined edges with felt. This mod is intended to seal seal/damp the slight gap between front baffle and rear cup. The slight gap is there to allow slight articulation for front baffle, maybe it doesn't leak but hard to tell, it's rounded/funneled in a way to help maintain seal (cant describe well). I tried measurements before of driver without enclosure and the bass still goes deep but there was roll off. This leaky baffle fix mod did show a tightening up in measurements. Then I bought 10mm larger version of the hybrid pads for more comfort and they changed frequency response more than anything. Oh pads... I do think more damping is needed currently. 6lb foam but cut thinner to replace 2lb foam. Maybe 2lb foam to replace felt since it could expand to seal/damp any gaps better.

95mm hybrid pads with above mod:


85mm hybrid pads with above mods (m2 shp) vs previous 85mm hybrid pads mod (1/2 thickness foam and no felt)


Looks like some 5kHz ringing but I dont have issue.

95mm pads slightly oversized for baffle (air leakage possible but doubt it, especially once compressed against head), slightly larger ear chamber. Not sure which sounds better to me: 85mm vs 95mm but the smaller ones are a bit too uncomfortable so didn't spend much time with. I've had a few hours on the 95mm and no complaints. There will be more pad rolling.

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I bought a Yamaha YH-100. Enclosure sucks which is why it's cheaper and easier to find compared to an HP-1a. YH-100 driver very similar to HP-1a, dimensions nearly same (YH-100 1-2 mm thicker), both anisotropic. I will try YH-100 driver in YH-1 enclosure.

Won't use THX00 headband for RP-18. Wife likes the THX00 and said not to sell. THX00 is good and comfy so not complaining (ebony with AH lambskin pads). Highs not as dulled as vintage ortho but the bass is better (atleast for now!...?), T30 no slouch though.

I'll send these orthos for loan tour when done modding: NAD RP18, Fostex T30, Yamaha YH-100. @Merrick first plus he is local so I don't have to pay shipping. I'll make a thread later.

edit: T30mod looks like @gurubhai avatar.

 

I’d be very interested in watching what you can squeeze out of the YH100 driver. I noticed you saw my failures with the YH100 housing on HF but I never considered transplanting it. My flat plate modded HP3 measurements made me too cocky:

 

Nice @Ishcabible . @bucketinabucket was telling me today how YH-100 is a tough one. @rhythmdevils warned the same. May just be the enclosure I hope.

Ive read and experienced that thicker pads are worse, or at least less preferable. These hybrids compress well but still probably quite a bit thicker than Hifiman pads. HFM pads are $40 pair though. Kind of would rather just buy the whole thing for spare parts/mods. Hmmm, I dont think any of the cheap ones new/used come with focus-a or pali pads though.

edit: 95mm pads vocals sound a little distant for my liking. Squishing them a tiny bit while wearing is major improvement. 85mm pads sound better because vocals more present.