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Focal Elear and Utopia Impressions at Source AV

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by purr1n, Jul 7, 2016.

Page 4 of 24
  1. songmic

    songmic Gear cycler East Asia edition

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    Well Marv did say avoid OTL amps for Elear. But then again, ZDS is no ordinary OTL amp (has an output Z of 3 ohms) and sounds very tight for a tube amp. I still haven't let go of my modded HD650, and if the Elear is really the uber-HD650 they say it is, I'm eager to try one for myself.

    While the Elear sounds like one hell of an awesomesauce headphone, does it scale madly like HD650? No headphone I've heard, other than the HD800(S), scale like HD650 does on endgame setups. My modded HD650 sounds flawlessly magnificent on the hi-Z output of ZDS I can only imagine how it might sound on the balanced output of Studio. I suspect the Elear, given its low impedance and high sensitivity, might fare better with the lo-Z output of ZDS, but given the incredible scalability of HD650 I'm still doubtful whether the Elear could still trump over it in this regard.

    I guess I'll have to wait until Marv brings an Elear into his own personal lab.
     
    songmic, Jul 8, 2016
    #61
  2. mtoc

    mtoc SBAF's Resident Shit-Stirrer

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    Tyll, I have a question about the measurements of distortion on the headphones you've done. Why limited to about 7kHz?
     
    mtoc, Jul 8, 2016
    #62
  3. mtoc

    mtoc SBAF's Resident Shit-Stirrer

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    btw, looks like Tyll is having honeymoon with Elear|\/|
     
    mtoc, Jul 8, 2016
    #63
  4. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    It's a limitation with 44/48kHz sampling and THD measurements: The 4th harmonic at 7kHz is already at 7*4=28kHz and thus not captured by a 48kHz sampling frequency. Does this mean the THD plots are really only 1st, 2nd and 3rd order?
    This is another reason why I prefer the distortion measurements where you can see the individual harmonics.
    Tyll touched on this before but I can't find it right now.
     
    Serious, Jul 8, 2016
    #64
  5. Rthomas

    Rthomas Friend

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    Wow! I’ve never seen Tyll react like this to a headphone before and it’s $999 instead of $3000+ for a change....

    I really hope he’s not having a Fidelio X2 moment ;)

    I can’t wait for the IF review and video. Hopefully this knocks the Ether off the WoF.

    I’ve been holding off on going summit-fi due to the various deficiencies in all the major contenders.

    I think I may give Focal my money, my small contribution to reversing the crazy pricing trend.
     
    Rthomas, Jul 8, 2016
    #65
  6. Koth Ganesh

    Koth Ganesh Friend

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    @Rthomas I might take you up on your offer after all....;)
     
    Koth Ganesh, Jul 8, 2016
    #66
  7. Rthomas

    Rthomas Friend

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    Sure Koth, especially with the pound to rupee rate at the moment. I could also try to get a deal for buying 2, one for me as well!

    Best option is I buy you a Utopia and they throw in an Elear for free :D
     
    Rthomas, Jul 8, 2016
    #67
  8. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Don't forget that many headphones show a similar dip in this range on Tyll's rig. It does not necessarily mean it will exist or be audible with your own head and ears. I've listened to and measured quite a few headphones on my own that did not have any sort of dip like Tyll's did, though a couple matched. On the other hand, I've had headphones that did have dips for me, but not for Tyll. I think it comes down to different rigs and how headphones interact with various couplers. Your head and ears do shape the response, after all, and sometimes in rather "severe" ways.
     
    Hands, Jul 8, 2016
    #68
  9. Tyll Hertsens

    Tyll Hertsens Grandpappy of the hobby - Special Friend

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    After my head measurements at Harman, I'm beginning to believe that a dip after 3.5kHz is okay. Flat after the dip is likely fine as well. The Elear does just that.
     
    Tyll Hertsens, Jul 8, 2016
    #69
  10. KurtSvensson

    KurtSvensson Friend

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    I believe orthowalls are to blame, those small resonances cause the treble to maintain it's character fairly well regardless of what you do to it. When it comes to midrange and bass I've always felt planars EQ just as well. Just a small theory of mine.
     
    KurtSvensson, Jul 8, 2016
    #70
  11. OJneg

    OJneg The Most Insufferable

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    That's a decent analogy. These sound a lot cleaner and clearer than any BA that I'm familiar with FWIW

    There was.

    I think it very well could be such an FR anomaly. The Elear's tone from mid to treble just wasn't as cohesive to me.
     
    OJneg, Jul 8, 2016
    #71
  12. gbeast

    gbeast Mighty Moral Power Ranger

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    Man... This is making me wish I had my Elear. Monday seems to be the day.

    Someone said that the Elear is not as good as the nighthawk technically. That the nighthawk has better bass and the same midrange balance.

    Scratching my head on this.
     
    gbeast, Jul 8, 2016
    #72
  13. OJneg

    OJneg The Most Insufferable

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    Head-Fi Translator 101:

    More = Better

    Effed up and impressionistic = balanced and/or "euphonic"
     
    OJneg, Jul 8, 2016
    #73
  14. RiddleyWalker

    RiddleyWalker Friend

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    RiddleyWalker, Jul 8, 2016
    #74
  15. Azteca

    Azteca Friend

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    Very interesting. Thanks for the impressions, and thanks to Tyll for chiming in to provide even more substance.

    Those of you who have heard the Elear: how does it compare to the Focal Spirit Pro? I bought mine off of Marv and really like them, but using Sonarworks to correct frequency response showed me how much more they could be doing in terms of treble resolution and linearity, while also showing how good and capable the drivers were in the first place. I'm curious if the general FR is similar.
     
    Azteca, Jul 8, 2016
    #75
  16. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Well, the Nighthawk does have low distortion. It's possible the bass is better. It's just the whole rest of the frequency balance, or lack thereof, that makes it so awful. :)
     
    Hands, Jul 8, 2016
    #76
  17. Azteca

    Azteca Friend

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    Well, I took the FRs from the InnerFidelity graphs.
    https://imgur.com/a/TZAHz

    Looks like Elear is more linear to 1000 and doesn't have as big a boost in bass and extension may suffer as well (I imagine this is very seal-dependent though).
    2-5kHz is also more linear. Elear seems more extended after 10K as well. This could bode well for my stated preference of an FSP with greater linearity and treble extension.
     
    Azteca, Jul 8, 2016
    #77
  18. Malabargold

    Malabargold Flipper

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    Elear to Focal Pro/Classic would be an interesting comparison as I owned the Classics for a short period and found them enjoyable for their price. They had a warm pleasing frequency response
     
    Malabargold, Jul 8, 2016
    #78
  19. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I think I have FSP measurements somewhere. Changstar is down. Really no contest. From memory, the bass is similar, but upper mids / lower treble is smoother.

    The perceived lack of clarity is extremely minor. Think of it as Utopia being faster and clearer than Elear as opposed to Elear (or HD800) not sounding clear, which it not the case. Don't make too much of it. I suspect it's more related to the Elear's (and to a lesser textent, the HD800's) broad bass bump that bleeds into the lower mids. One mastering trick to make things sound more clear is to depress the upper bass / lower mids. The TH900 has great clarity because it has a depression in this area (and also because it has low bass distortion.)

    Generally a depression around 5kHz will result in less edge or bite. Particularly noticeable with trumpets, snares, etc. I felt that the Elear may have been laid back in this area with some recordings where snares and guitars didn't bite as hard. This didn't happen with all recordings, so I suspect the depression might have been narrow. Not enough time and run through enough recordings to say for certain.
     
    purr1n, Jul 8, 2016
    #79
  20. Azteca

    Azteca Friend

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    Thanks, Marv. I was hoping the bass was similar as that's the biggest disappointment with my HD600 and most of the "high end" cans I've heard. Focal seems to know how to do clean tight bass. Hot-rodded HD600 with Focal bass sounds like something that could make me spend the money someday. Woo!
     
    Azteca, Jul 8, 2016
    #80
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