USB Nervosa Thread Decrapifiers, pro interfaces, and bears oh my

I remember seeing that a couple months ago... but it doesn't actually take usb out of the equation, and doesn't actually use an existing home network/wiring. So basically it's just a usb range extender with different cabling in between.

At least with something like the Focusrite Dante boxes I can plug into my home network instead of running a dedicated cable that just happens to have the same connectors (like that's not going to cause a fubar somewhere down the road).

 

They were experimenting with something similar in that head-fi thread, but at the point you'd add something like that to your usb decrapification chain you're probably better off just going directly to a rednet type device.

 

At the point when you have all of this stuff, like @Marvey wrote, you are better off with a better Dac. So how do you spend $ 3000? A used Gungnir Multibit, a Sonore micro rendu, a Berkeley audio sub or mutec3+, a kimber cable illuminations d-60, and an Oyaide usb cable? Or an Yggdrasil and a lanrover? Part from the sonic differences, I bet you the former option will sound better. Curiosity is fine, and it should be okay for the penurious, just get to the point where you enjoy the sound and walk away? The reason people dick around with all of this is they're not there, but they never really know what they want. The bazillion times a device makes their sound better only to be bettered by something else is legendary. Beware the different, digital is harder than analog.

I will labor to get the frickin sound to what I like, which, fortunately is also nearer to neutral. I had it once, not that long ago, but I lost it due to a (I think) usb to Spdif converter swap, and more system changes. Stupid stupid stupid.

 

The digital grass is always greener.....

 

Any new impressions? @RKML0007 ? I have the uRendu also, and can't quite make up my mind if I like it for what I listen to, so I was curious how you found it.

 

@Wfojas Yes, uRendu's good - definitely top of its class but clearly outpaced by the Rednet chain after some tweaks to both hardware and it's user haha!

I wonder what it would do with some speakers - let's try at your place hehe!

 

Sure, I'm almost sorted out with what to show. Ideally we should have a CD copy of the thing, I was running the urendu this weekend with the Mutec 3+USB at 1.02 then at 1.1, then the Berkeley Audio, and I switched speakers. Pretty interesting mix. Next up I will swap out tubes on the preamp and see.

I should be there in a few more days, work willing. Then we can have a hoedown!

 

Speaking of hoedowns..... (further writeup below)



@brencho and I met up at @drfindley 's last night with gizmos galore in hand. Thanks to whomever was involved in sending loaners to @brencho so that this could come together.

Tons o' fun was had last night. Heard the BW1 and BW2 along side my now maxed out T3. Heard a Vali(2?) for the first time. Heard the new Modi Multibit. And, of course, heard vinyl like I've never heard it before. But this is the USB gizmo thread, right... so on to that.... It was more of a whirlwind tour of much of what is out there in the land of computer audiophilia, and given the number of devices, this will just be an overview with the hope others can fill in any per-device details they might have. But, first off, I will just say I have not been much of a USB gizmo believer, researcher, etc. I wasn't familiar with these products, or with common wisdom on these products comparatively, and I had definitely not been willing to take what I've read about them at face value. I have my reasons for skepticism primarily rooted in my career as an ASIC designer and a simple need for greater technical understanding, but I also loathe Mr Autobiographical ForumGuy even when germane, and so on to a few takeaways of *mine* (the others may have slightly different opinions, but we were pretty closely aligned I think):


Devices: Mutec USB 3+ (unfortunately a FW flashing mishap sidelined this device), Mutec 1.2, Intona (industrial), Transient MK2, Wyrd4Sound Something, Regen without LPS.

Method: (In the loosest sense of the word ) Rotate through the devices in a MBP, Yggdrasil, EAR, Marten speaker setup. Three dudes sitting on couch all hearing the same thing at the same time wth @brencho in the sweet spot ;-) No headphones.

1. The Yggdrasil USB benefits from any of these devices. And I do think it's important to always talk about these gizmos not by themselves but at the very least in context of the particular DAC in use as well.

2. Regen by itself is the best bang for the buck in the lot. It cleans up some hash and adds a fuller body to the sound that many or most as I recall of the other devices lacked.

3. Mutec 1.2 by itself produced the best/cleanest sound with depth in the lot (noting that the Mutec 3 was down and out last night). SPDIF out to Yggdrasil was used.

4. Regen in front of Mutec 1.2 was my favorite sound overall. Definitely didn't want to believe that chaining devices would make a difference. It did.

5. The Intona is mine, and it didn't produce the same result in the speaker rig last night as it does in my headphone rig at home. I didn't like it last night. I like at home today again, though. Similarly the Wyrd4Sound device was not given much time after first listen last night. As stated above, YMMV.

6. The Transient device I'd be willing to give a longer listen to. Comparatively it sounded a bit syrupy, however it was pleasant overall. I do tend to prefer snappy transients and I think this device was a step behind in that regard.

7. And this one hurts, but: USB cables matter. Period; end of sentence. I've never considered the possibility before, the Furutech GT2 Pro simple sounds better than whatever run of the mill USB cable (like I use) we had next to it. I have never spent even a minute of time listening to USB cables. The 5 minutes spent last night was worthwhile.

My conclusion: I'll eventually end up with a Mutec and uRendu (which is supposed to also integrate a further improved Regen). And I need a new USB cable.

My other conclusion: After 3 seconds of Dave Matthews through the magically ethereal @drfindley vinyl rig, none of the above mattered any more at all, and I'm still sobbing somewhere deep down inside.

 

Yes cables make a difference. The difference between my old stock USB cable and LH labs 1G was not subtle.

 

Just to echo and extend @bazelio's already excellent post, we all agreed that the Regen improved the sound in certain ways but was not without detriment - notes sounded maybe a bit too round, etc. The Mutec and Regen seem to synergize in a really nice way, providing nice clean and clear notes that are simultaneously more full-bodied and rich. I was also a skeptic but this was a very very nice combination.

It's also important to note that these differences are probably more easily detectable on speakers than on headphones.

-- Brief USB intermission -- And, I can't get that sweet vinyl sound out of my head. Listening to vinyl had a calming effect, we stopped messing around, it ended the samsaric plugging-unplugging cycle of the headphone world, and we just sat there on the couch and relaxed, listened and enjoyed. -- End of Intermission --

 

Are there any worthwhile USB cables below the 3 digit pricepoint?

 

@Vent i've been using audioquest's cheaper offerings to good effect, i don't really think about it much. but we didn't compare them to drfindley's furutech usb cable so *shrug*

 

The one I mentioned above is $60 on amazon (normal price $140). Great cable.

 

On the other side of the fence, it seems USB cables don't matter that much:
http://archimago.blogspot.sg/2013/04/measurements-usb-cables-for-dacs.html

For me personally, I did hear difference between usb cables, and it wasn't subtle differences.

Maybe it's a good idea for SBAF to conduct a special USB cable shootout?

AudioQuest vs Furutech vs Belkin vs Light Harmonic vs Synergistic Research vs Ifi and etc.

 

Awesome, more "sound science". As if being satisfied with USB + DAC performance didn't already have so many damn variables involved!

 

Cable length could have something to do with it too. I'm guessing the cables involved last night were 3m or longer because we were stretching them across the room from an opposite-wall coffee table. Either way, I believe what I heard last night while sitting next to two pairs of good ears who also heard it. And I've been in the USB cables can *not* matter camp all this while.

 

I've actually done a very extensive USB cable shoot out (Audioquest Diamond, Synergistic Research, about 5 others I am forgetting. All top class cables). The Furutech GT2 was one of the cheapest in the group and bested all of them in my setup.

I basically told @drfindley about it and that is what he got. I'll be surprised if any of the current crop of USB cables will better it in his ear / marten system. A different system might change the results.

In about beginning of September, I strongly suggest u folks to revisit Adam. Prepare to forget about everything u probably know about audio and form new opinions about sound...about what an audio system is capable of reproducing

Here on out, Adams system will be purely sound. There will be no system...NorCal is about to be drowned in some of the best sound an audio system can reproduce at any price.

 

One factor that arose during my research was USB's susceptibility to signal loss, ie. it is VERY sensitive to signal degradation.

This relates to cable length but also the 'cleanliness' of the mating connectors as well.
So using the same able and comparing it both before and after cleaning the contacts, should reveal some interesting results.

JJ