HiFiMan HE400S with Focus Pad Measurements

Well Hands, you know with you and the rest of the CO pyrate crew nearby, the minute a new pair of 650s hits Amazon at $299 you know what I am programmed to do. And then you all will say, hey try it with this amp, and if you like that, try it with that amp and so forth. Then the same with dacs and before you know it I am agreeing, oh yes, that is much better, how much is that?

And before you know it there is a big hole in my wallet and my dreams of a satisfying Dac/ Amp/ Can combo for $700 is a past tense short stopping point.

Evil! I say

 

Okay I see your point and appreciate the remark, because so far it was all a discussion of "getting something more valuable for the price" but if there is a real difference in hearing those, then it makes sense to consider them.

By the way, just a little question, where did you ordered those different pads (focus and others) ? Did they came inside the package ? I think not because Tyll mentionned it was a very light packaging for these headphones. Can you let me know ?

 

Okay thank you, I consider getting some cause the improvement looks impressive. Althgouh I should get headphones first .

 

I must be in the minority finding a few other headphones around this price to perform better. I would take a pair of Mad dog pros to start and they don't sound that open imo with a small Soundstage. Def would take an hd650 over these and can't comprehend its WOF status but hey its all good. Its got a very easy to listen to signature I should've tried other pads.

 

With the focus pads does the increase at 1000 Hz bother anyone else? It makes my ears ring.

 

@tomset Having a look at the peak at 1kHz, it does not seem very big and so I somehow doubt it can cause what you described. I'll also add that I am not really familiar with purrin's measurement system, but I trust very well what he does because he usually have a very good opinion on a topic. However, it is possible that you have a specific sensitivity to that area in the spectrum. Have you already experience such thing with other headphones ?

 

The 1kHz peak seems subtle, but I'm sure it could be bothersome to some. I know I'm sensitive to 2kHz (AKG engineers aren't), but the 400S doesn't bother me with any of the pads.

 

Your graphs are quite the opposite of Inner Fidelity's. Theirs shows the HIFIMAN HE400S as ruler flat below 1,000 Hz when compared against the Sennheiser HD-600 and HD-650. In fact I upgraded from the 600 to the 650 simply because the 650 had a flatter bass end, and the listening proved that right. I was thinking of getting the HE400S because that also appeared to be the case, a truer bass end (not to say better bass transients, being planar).

But now I'm confused.

:-(

 

These "little" bass humps actually make a lot of difference, subjectively at least.

The HD-600s and the HD-650s are an interesting comparison. Perhaps my hearing is "special" but the differences above 1kHz are marginal. Sort of like before or after you sneezed. However below 1,000 Hz I 'saw'. a bump and faster rolloff in the 600s graphs. And I was not surprised when I compared the 2 Senniheisers. I find the 650s more extended and more accurate. I am seeing that the HE400S will (at this price point) further extend the bass as it has a flatter bass response.

I suspect this "more" bass is subjective than measurable. When there is a bump, however slight, the subjective effect is a quicker rolloff.

I'm not in a major city so I'm not going to be able to compare the HE400S against my HD650 in a store before buying. Which is why these graphs are all I can go with, at this stage.

I'll probably bite the bullet and buy the HE400S, if it really is less musical (to my ears) than my HD650s, you'll see it up for sale on eBay very shortly! Hopefully not, and it'll be my 650s going to a Good Home instead.

Thanks. And stay tuned!

 

If you are putting a lot of weight on bass presence and bass extension, the HE-400S will end up on eBay.

 

Again, it's all very subjective. I find the 650s bass just a little imperfect. And I'm not in the $1,000 price range. Which is why I'm considering the HE400S.

I heard the 400i just before the 400S announcement. The 400i bass was, to me, an improvement on the 650s. Tighter, more controlled, more extended. Perhaps a touch too dry. I'm hoping the 400S are a more natural, again to my personal subjective taste, fit.

Fingers crossed!

(It's only - a little - money.... And HiFi is fun!)

;-)

Oh, I forgot to add, it depends a lot on the recording, and the genre. Pop, classical, medieval, jazz, rock. Motown has a very different "feel" to other even similar genre of the 80s. The HD650s allow all of them to blossom. On SOME recordings, however, there is just a little too much bloom. That minuscule rise in that bass hump is, undoubtedly the cause.

All things considered, HiFi is a relatively cheap hobby with great pleasure outcomes. I've taken some risks, and sometimes failed. But my reading of these test graphs have mostly served me well.

Here's to objective science and subjective art coming together!

Cheers,

 

Any update on the story, @skris88 ? What did you decide ?

 

With the AUD failing like a rock against the USD I've put it on hold for now. I get a money back guarantee if I return it, but being in regional Australia I'm looking at 10% hit on the return postage.

It's still on my Wish List though!

It's interesting some think the Sennheiser HD-600 and the HD-650 are similar, but I hear a (subtle but noticeable) improvement in the 650s - less mid bass peak and deeper bass. I must end up with more of the same sort of improvement with the HE400S or it'll be a fail.

 

I totally understand, currency/import issues can get quite harsh in EU as well. Nonetheless, I look forward to reading your impressions !

 

I just got them to test and holy f**k, what's wrong with those mids. The timbre is WAY off on those. It's a weird-ass cupped-hands coloration. Still using stock pads, HiFiMan pleathers are on the way, but I don't hold my breath anymore.

Seriously, I wanted a HD600/650 without shitty open-back dynamic can bass, but the HE-400S sound weird as hell.

 

I finally found a store with HE400Ss in stock and had a sit down listen. The source was not ideal, but well known - my iPhone 5. First impression was that the stated increased efficiency did not equate to enough of a change. Both phones just slightly tickled my ear bones equally at full volume on my test track calibrated to 80dB RMS (some 15dB below peak).

Bass on the HE400Ss seemed slightly more 1-note, although it had greater extension - a strange sensation. Perhaps I'm already too biased with the HD650 signature sound.

Then the clincher - the upper treble. The 'sheen' of cymbals and strings were cut off just a little bit too early on the HE400Ss.

I hour of my life wasted? Not so, I had a great time.

All in? If I had spare cash or if this was gifted to me, I'll grab it in a jiffy. But as I would need to sell my HD650s to partly fund these HE400Ss? Hmmmmm.... no.

Sorry HiFiMAN. I can find fault with the Sennheiser HD650s, but they are still more musical.

And THAT is the bottom line. Especially for those of us without a bottomless bank balance!

Hope this helps those looking to get the HE400Ss. These are GOOD headphones. Many pay twice the money for crap Beats headphones (okay, that's my personal opinion - but I'm entitled to have them). These are excellent value for money. It might be my hearing, not the HE400Ss.

On a side note and hearing differences, I have a "tin ear" un-audiophile friend who could not understand the money I "waste" on Hi Fi. In a noisy department store, I powered up a pair of Bose NC headphones and placed it (without music) on his head expecting a Wow response. Him? Nothing. Nothing!! He could not hear the difference of the noise cancelling system in operation! The Wow was mine, not his.

Enjoy....

 

Back when I got these stock, I wasn't impressed. The sound grew on me, but... it had to grow on me. Not at all a super appealing sound to begin with.

Gave them away, bought them again, this time grill modded and with a few different pads. I'm frustrated the HM5 pads don't sound amazing with the grill mod (not even sure if the mod is reversible), but the focus pads do sound a lot better to my ear than stock. That with the mod make it sound very clean - not wonky, not "give this some time", just really, really good, amped or not. Still haven't given these a shot with a good tube amp.

If only the Focus Pads were as comfortable as the HM5...