Focal Elear and Utopia

So I have been able to spend several hours listening to a pair of Utopias and comparing them to my HD650 (-spider, +dynamat, stock front foam) and am left pretty confused about amps. I've read various impressions that say, over-simplifying, that when driven from top tube amps, these two headphones can trade punches, so to speak. But from what I heard, there is really a big gap between them, can top tube amps really make that much difference?

I heard the Utopias from a Sennheiser HDVD 800 which as far as I can glean from comments here is not overly offensive or particularly lame in any way, just not much of a recommendation as a value proposition. I had my laptop and music and started by listening to my HD650s to try to get a rough feeling for the difference between the HDVD 800 and the Gungnir Multibit / Mjolnir 1 stack I use at home. It's hard for me to compare based on memory, but the HDVD 800 seemed to not hit as hard, seemed not as dynamic, and the treble was a bit harsher, but it didn't immediately strike me as completely broken or anything.

From the perspective of the HD650's ability to resolve musical details, I can hear that they are really up there (I'm thinking things like string decay and timbre of toms, etc.) Likewise, tonally they rule. But the Utopias, wow, just wow, that speed and clarity, and that dynamism. There were lots of bass guitar lines that were very clear and precise on the Utopias that were almost impossible to pick out on the HD650s. This was particularly true in cases where the bass guitar is playing in time with the bass drum; the HD650s often blur the two together where they are clearly distinct with the Utopias. Likewise for very fast kick drum parts: the Utopias were much more capable of presenting the distinct hits. (Well, up to some speed, at which point even live kick drum hits bleed into each other.)

The difference in clarity of cymbals and snares between the headphones was really remarkable. The "tone", "texture", and the sense of "bite" of guitars was also several steps closer to the live sound, but there is more going on with the guitars and they are less isolated than cymbals and snares so the effect is less immediately dramatic. Still, to me this aspect is probably the most valuable.

I don't understand it, but the Utopias also somehow made each guitar sound more like it is in one place, which is something that I had never thought of as an issue with the HD650s. I have heard LCD-3s do funky things to guitars where the distortion can somehow sound like it is coming from a few steps in front or behind the main tone, depending on the frequency. I haven't noticed something similar with the HD650s, but the Utopias seem slightly more "focused" in one place. Instrument separation in general is also improved.

Also, the sense of impact that a cymbal crash can have in real life is immense, and while I didn't hear the Utopias do that, they were much closer than the HD650s. I'm not used to such a sense of impact, especially not in the high frequencies.

So far I have not managed to hear a top tube amp at shows, dealers, etc. (London is far far away from CA). (Well, there was a prototype Cavalli but driving some Ethers that really weren't my thing, and a BHSE driving Stax 009s, but that's a different story, and also not my thing.) I'm thinking that perhaps the aspects that I personally notice most are different from those of people who consider the HD650s and the Utopias to be close? It's hard for me to comprehend how top tube amps could really make that big of a difference.

Perhaps useful context is that I listen mostly to pretty aggressive metal, think Gojira, Emperor, Carcass, Slayer, Vallenfyre, Opeth, and also tested with some really well-recorded stuff like Witherscape, and also had the same impressions with more atmospheric music like Wilderun.

 

Thoughts so far. I've had the utopias for a couple days now, and i'm still getting used to them. like @k1arg , I also listen to a lot of metal and hard rock, (Metallica, Slayer Opeth, Megadeth, Rush, Van Halen, Periphery) mixed in with some classical and jazz. ie Miles Davis and Carlos Kleiber. Coming from LCD-3's it's a bit of a change. I'm currently breaking in the Utopias along with the Mjolnir 2 I'm driving it with (balanced). The Utopias are definitely a bit on the dryer side compared to the Audezes. Shitty mixes and mastering work show through on the Utopias. I'm running the stock 6BZ7 tubes currently ( I plan on replacing them with some decent 6922s. I concur with @Tyll Hertsens, in that the Utopias could definitely use another 2-3 db of bass from about 100 hz downward. It's too early to tell If I love 'em or not. I love the resolution, and the tuning is pretty spot on, with great resolution, seperation and control across the spectrum. So far, I'm happiest with the 2015 Rush remasters, Volto!, Miles D Kind of Blue, and anything that doesn't have crispy leading edges in the lower treble region.

 

And, I might add, the construction is a thing of beauty. Terrific design.

 

Thanks to being at the very end of the Elear loaner train, I got to listen to them for a LOOOONG time, like close to a month it seems.

I’m not sure I can add much to what’s already been said about them, but I’ll offer some quick personal observations that might be useful to others.

They’re worth the asking price, and they sound great, but over the course of my time with them I went from figuring out how to scrape together enough funds to buy a pair ASAP to not wanting to buy them at all.

I love how the Elears portray dynamics. Others have mentioned that they do percussion really well, and I agree. They’re also great for listening at low volume because they don’t become boring at low volumes. They remain engaging.

But for me, my lightly modded TH-X00 purplehearts do that too, and with less weight and greater comfort. If I want great tone, detail, and decent dynamics (perhaps for a long listening session) I have modded HD-650s that get the job done with greater comfort and a better value proposition. If I want good tone, good detail, and great dynamics, I have the purplehearts which I also find more comfortable and a better value than the Elears.

The hole in my headphone lineup would be better filled by something like the Utopias. The Utopias do something to portray detail and space that I’ve never heard from any other headphones. Maaaaybe it has something to do with the midrange to high-mids? Or maybe it’s the driver speed or something else? Of course the Utopia retail price is completely bonkers, but they do offer something uniquely desirable that I’ve never heard in another headphone, and to me the Elear is not at all a “baby Utopia” (unfortunately).

Incidentally, who the f**k thought the Elear cable was a good idea?

 

@philipmorgan did you hear the Elear with the pads @brencho is using ? They're cheap and they just happen to work well on that headphone. I suspect you might really like the Elear with that simple $20 upgrade a lot more.

 

I did. I (carefully) removed the Elear pads and used the natural clamp of the headphone to hold some HM5 angled pleather pads in place. They do make the Elear somewhat more of a "Super HD-650", which is awesome. But for me they didn't bring out the "baby Utopia" characteristics I was hoping to find in the Elear. I don't dislike the Elear, in fact I think it's great and a not-bad value, they're just not what I'm looking for to round out my stable of 'phones.

 

I had the Utopia loaner a few weeks ago.

I really enjoyed my time with it! It's a good bit brighter than what I normally listen to (LCD-3, HD600, Noble K10), but it was manageable to me, which I was surprised by. While it occasionally got fatiguing, and could never be my only headphone, I found myself reaching for it most of the time, not only for evaluating a loaner, but for listening for enjoyment.

I was pretty captivated by its presentation of detail, instrument separation, and portrayal of textures that seemed to be really on-point. I feel that the Utopia handily beats any of my existing 'phones in raw resolution and accuracy.

I agree with those at the last NY meet who felt there was more subbass than mid-bass. I don't mind this, and I'm more sensitive to too much mid-bass than too little. Basically, while I wouldn't complain if they had more mid-bass, I wasn't upset about the bass balance, and I was able to enjoy how deep the Utopia extended on a number of bassier tracks.

From rock to electronic, most things sounded great on the Utopia. The only exception was really poorly recorded music, which sometimes got overly fatiguing. That's sometimes the price of clarity, though.

Comfort-wise, there could be some improvements. I feel like the headband could really use more padding, and could distribute weight more evenly; I would get a "hot spot" on the top of my head a lot of the time. Due to the weight, if I placed them a little too far forward or a little too far back, they would wind up tilting and digging into my head and become very uncomfortable very quickly. When perfectly centered on my head, they fared better. I actually really like how big and deep the ear cups are, too. My entire ears fit into the cups without touching anything inside, which was really nice and not something I experience a lot with over-ear headphones.

I'd definitely look into getting a pair of these if the price was lower. Right now, Focal has out-priced me, sadly.

 

Driving the Utopias with a Mjolnir 2 w/ stock tubes, I was initially unimpressed. They had a slightly dry, edgy sound in the treble which was killing it for me.: i was seriously considering selling them off. I swapped out the stock GEs and put in some Siemens/RCA tubes and the tonal difference was not subtle. The treble sounded proper and refined, and there was an overal better balance between the bass/mids/treble. The Utopias were really taking on the character of what was being fed to them. Very revealing and now, very enjoyable.

 

I'm astonished by the "attack" that can be physically felt by each piano key that is pressed, on a crappy youtube song from Yiruma. Tried to compare it to my modded hd800 (SD mod, etc.) and there is this realistism with the Elear that is stricking. I love it.

And the dip so far isn't bothersome to me. But I'm still in the discovery phase, impressions might evolve!

tried the following chains:
Gungnir Multibit => Mjolnir 2 (SE) => Elear
Gungnir Multibit => AMB M3 => Elear

The M3 makes the elear even more bassy and warmer compared the mjolnir 2 with stock tubes. Need to spend more time though to fully understand and apprehend this beast from focal.

 

If you end up getting a balanced cable for the elear/M2 you'll be able to reveal even more detail. Congrats, and enjoy!

 

Utopias are definitely special and strong performers *but* not without drawbacks and not universally superior to say HD 800. I did a fairly basic comparison the other day, in store and using fairly limited chain (HA430 with inbuilt DAC) but a few minutes was enough to get the basic idea of the key strengths and "weaknesses". The HD 800s are imprinted into my brain very strongly after many years of use.

For listening, I used Miles Davis Kind of Blue - mostly track Blue in Green. I find Jazz useful for sussing out what I value in music: tone, timbre, timing, resolution, speed. Utopia nails timing, and for the most part has convincing timbre and realism/presence. Tone is very dry, and the bass is not to my taste - I think this headphone would match better with tube gear to soften the bass and sweeten the tone. Tonally, these are quite dry, and I find HD 800 more convincing. The overall balance is less bright and treble tilted than the HD 800, moreso than I was expecting. HD 800 sound much more treble forward.

The Utopia is able to separate individual notes from a chord - HD 800 not so much. I recall MuppetFace used term years ago micro transactions with regards to musical expression - this too is better resolved by the Utopia. Small differences in intonation and timing are rendered more clearly. PRAT is a strong suite of both Utopia and Elear, and in this the two headphones show their familial connection.

On HD 800 notes decay with precision - I can tell exactly when they finish, or for vocals: the closing of the mouth or tail end of words. Utopia decay is softer and less precise, but still very good overall. Utopia seemed faster and more precise in the midrange transients than the HD 800.

RE bass - I don't like bass on a lot of headphones and earphones. I prefer shy or soft bass to anything even slightly boomy or forced. In my mind, the bass should be in the background to the music - not the foreground and definitely not obscuring or distracting. Utopia bass reminds me of HD 800 with the SD mod - it sort of doesn't know where to go. When I look at the CSD's performed by Marvey I can rationalise my experience: indeed the bass doesn't appear to decay as quickly as the HD 800.

More observant readers may have noticed I don't talk about soundstage. Most of the time I will trade resolution, realism and presence for soundstage, and find that these qualities often in tension. I just on't prioritise delineating the concept in my evaluations. I seem to have neglected to discuss imaging also - oh well. Only so much can be discerned in 5 minutes. I guess I don't really put that much importance on imaging (by itself) either.

Utopia seemed strong performer. They seem even more fussy over components than HD 800. If you were down for finding synergistic components (read: throw money at it), I would say that overall it is very impressive.

*I just wonder if a well designed planar might be able to capture the transient speed of the Utopia, the micro transactions, but have less dry tone, and a more pleasing bass presentation. Maybe an unicorn HE1000 with coherent presentation, or something?

 

I wonder how much of the Utopia's resolution is due to the lack of reflections in the sound? I mean it's basically designed like a speaker, with the driver flush mounted to the baffle. Whereas the HD800 and many other large TOTL open headphones will often have a recessed driver inside a earcup chamber. I've heard a lot of people describe the Elear/Utopia sound like either a close headphone or listening in an treated room due.

 

Anyone tried Audeze pads on the Elear? What about an upgrade cable? I'm curius what improvements are possible with this phone.

 

Check this thread:
http://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/focal-elear-measurements.2585/

I don't think anyone has tried Audeze pads, but @Hands has been experimenting with other pad options and some additional damping with nice results.

 

Mini review. (Scotch fueled)
I had a chance to hear Utopia for the first time at a mates place. Chain was Aria 2/Aurender w20>boulder 2120 DAC>boulder 1010 pre>wa5 with some crap sophia electric tubes (I know). I was comparing them against my modded Abyss (mainly), he1k, Elear, kenneron vali, lcd-3

Summary: utopia - good
Build quality is excellent, really looks the part.
Sound quality can be summarized simply by saying it is unoffensive. Most cans are about the compromises you can live with. The utopia really didn't do anything wrong. However, it also didn't feel like it excelled anywhere.

I was probably more wowed by the guys he1k V1 which he had paired with a goldmund amp which was just an awesome pairing, it had me checking that he hadn't popped the speakers on when I wasn't looking. I have never heard any other amp have such a good grip on the he1k as this combo. I swear only a handful of people have actually heard the he1k at it's best, it is scary good with the right rig. I agree it sounds laid back and limp dick from 95% of amps I've tried.

Back on the utopia, sub bass is not as accentuated as the abyss, mid bass was really nice on the utopia. upper mids were less glarey and harsh than the Abyss which was a nice change, lower mids were more present than abyss (Abyss has a bit of suck out here IMO).

Really clean and fast. With this amp choice, detecting microdetail was not really udner ideal conditions, but they were easily as resolving as my Abyss. Abyss is still way more fun and slams harder and faster with a wider stage but the utopia is a much better reference headphone.
I look forward to having one in house to have a more extended listen.

Wishing all you SBAFiers a very Merry Xmas and safe travels.
Xec

 

Alright, so I've scrounged this thread for impressions for/against using the Elears with the Jotun. Seems there's a clear divide to people either liking it or not, so I guess I'd need to try it for myself at some point.

As far as general 'sound' goes, are they closer to being a 'super 650'? Or are there other end-game solutions that I should look at? I'm not opposed to the 'just get the 650 and throw gear at it until you give up' route, but I value the opinions and experience here highly.

edit: If it helps any, I seem to like the HD700 sound signature (With treble EQ'd down and mids EQ'd up), and the Monk+ (no EQ necessary). In a blind comparison that I tried, I tended to opt towards the HD650 over the HD600 across all genres. The description of the Elears having 'good attack', with being able to essentially 'feel' piano keys being pressed or the biting of the bow across cello strings especially appealing to me.

 

^^^ Trust @Hands, I heard them separate, not together...

 

So maybe one of the more laid back sounding tube amps? I wonder if anybody has tried the Elears with a bottlehead. Gonna see if I can find any impressions on that combination, but there was mention that it seemed to do better with low Z amps.. hmm


Edit: After doing more research, it seems like one of the Elear's better selling points is that it pretty much sounds decent on everything, but doesn't scale as hard as the 6xx/800's do. So I think they should run fine out of either my GOV2, or my Vali 2. However, if anybody has any experience to the contrary, such as finding a combination like the 650/crack where the Elear seems to really take off, I'd appreciate hearing it

 

We briefly played with the utopia off the vali2 at a meet a while back and it was ridiculously good. Seems doable to splurge on one of these phones and have it sound good from a vali. Didn't experiment with the elear at the time, because it hadn't arrived in time, so I can't promise the exact same will be true with the elear. But the modded 650 sounded relatively flat and boring out of the vali2 when directly compared to the utopia and vali2.

 

@brencho Have you tried any upgrade cables with your Elear or Utopia? The guy I sold my Utopia to swears his balanced Moon Audio Black Dragon cable improved them in every way. Wish I had played around with them more before dumping them. Man... I miss the mids on that hp.