Audez'e LCD-4 -- again -- anyone...?

Can you clarify what you mean by felt/rubber spacers? Are you talking about the gap between the pads and the baffle?

 

I believe the very first LCD-4 units had the pads glued directly to the wooden cups. Then there were some driver ruptures from pressure changes, and they added felt (and then rubber) spacers as venting, which apparently solved the issue.

I'm getting this from the Head-Fi thread, mind, but it seems like solid info.

I've got the pair with the blue cable in on audition currently. It sounds good so far (especially with the Reveal EQ profile on in Roon), and it's more comfortable than I recall. But it's also not quite the bass monster I remember hearing last year.

But I'll try it with the balanced cable and maybe swap in the R26 in the DAC spot.

 

Ah, I'm on board now. That is a bunch of felt that is glued to the metal baffle (fuzzy on the top photo and clean metal on the bottom).

I don't know the exact time they introduced that felt, but when Audeze did I believe it was for all headphones. I've seen it on the LCD-4, LCD-R, LCD-GX, LCD-2. Having the pads directly glued to the baffle didn't leave any space for air to escape which means any pressure changes (i.e. putting the cup on your ear) exerts strain on the driver (as you mention).

I prefer the sound effect of having this felt. It creates a bit of damping which allows for a bit more detail in the decay of sounds.

The LCD-4 had an early on revision. The original drivers were 100ohms. Due to reliability issues Audeze swapped to 200ohm drivers about 12 months after the original LCD-4 release. I believe the 100ohm drivers only came with the Blue Smurf cable and the 200ohm drivers only came with the current white and black cable.

The 200ohm revision was pretty much universally hailed on Head-fi as an improvement over the 100ohm original.

I've had 4 pairs. Two were 100ohm and two were 200ohm. Audeze variability etc, etc, etc. I preferred the 100ohm drivers. Small differences, but they were more detailed, sounded cleaner in distortion, and had tighter, deeper, and cleaner bass. The 200ohm were a bit hazier and fuzzier overall. The details weren't as deep and the bass doesn't have the same clarity.

 

Thanks for this. Yeah, could be down to Audeze variability. The blue cable suggests I have an early model here, but the felt spacers do not. Maybe added later?

I really liked the bass on the pair I heard at a local dealer. But they want almost full retail for a beat-up demo pair, and I couldn't quite bring myself to do it. Maybe I'll go back and hear them. Or maybe they're identical to the pair I have here. Or maybe the McIntosh MHA150 is the magic ingredient.

Hmm.

Well, you can go crazy pursuing these things.

What does surprise me is the comfort--I remember them being pretty unbearable--and the clarity and overall frequency profile. They're not far off the Susvara in many ways, with more heft down low, but the bass not being overwhelming. They're not dissimilar in overall response to the VC but clearer. (Unsurprisingly, given they're open-backed.)

This is with the Reveal EQ applied, which I think an improvement all around.

Soundstage is pretty intimate, but this is familiar for me with Audeze. I find them to be more exciting overall than the Sus but maybe a bit edgy at times.

Not sure if I'll keep them or not, but I think these must be the best HP Audeze has made. Better than the LCD-5 or Carbon.

@elwappo99 you must like them? Given you've had four pairs!

 

Just some semi-stream-of-conscious thoughts on these blue-cable LCD-4:

--I swapped in my R26 for the internal DAC in the iFi Neo Stream. I find the latter pretty thin and un-involving. R26 much better all around, and gives a bit of a lift to bass.
--This pair of LCD-4 still not a bass monster. The bass is there, yes, but it's somewhere between "big" and "tasteful."
--I'm not sure it's bringing the sub-bass quite as much as I remembered.

--The clarity is excellent, and it seems to dig out different details than the Sus or VC.
--Something I've seen a few other folks note: LCD-4 unusually good at layering. Really nice with more complex tracks. A lot of nuance comes out.

--Intimate stage as before, but will throw hard-panned details quite far out.
--With Reveal EQ all the way up, I find them neutral to warm.
--Some have noted a "tube-y" kind of response. I might concur with that.

--There's something I really enjoy about Audeze generally with electronic music. They seem to portray the texture and growl of synth lines and synth bass in a palpable way nothing else manages. My LCD-2F especially good at this.
--Comfort continues to be fine. They're heavy, but it's well distributed with this pair.


Looking back at the thread, these are much maligned, with some folks maybe rediscovering them back in 2021 or so. Anyway, just some running thoughts.

I'm sort of after a real basshead TOTL. I might have to hear the Abyss 1266 variants, too.

 

I picked up a pair of LCD-4, the 200 ohm version, some 18 months ago and like them quite a bit. I'd have sold them, though, were it not for the prospect of hearing rhythmdevils' modded versions, and now that I have heard them, I've placed an order for Whitney to mod my pair. I'll post impressions of his RD-4s next week.

I love the stock LCD-4 for its deep, robust, highly textured bass, the dark tuning, the weighty sound, the excellent resolution, and the lovely rich mids. I share, though, Tyll Hertsen’s complaint about the odd, uneven treble presentation, with its upper-treble emphasis, which makes the LCD-4 come across as a bit tizzy as well as incoherent and imbalanced through its transition from the upper mids through treble. I also dislike the narrow, somewhat claustrophobic staging.

The bass doesn't get down as far into the sub-bass region as the Abyss 1266 Phi with CC pads but the LCD-4 has more warmth and tonal richness and bloom in the bass, and more mid-bass punch, than the Abyss. They're really quite different, but both excellent, ways of presenting bass: the Abyss being fast, snappy, clean, clear, detailed, impactful and deep, but not the most rich and thick; the LCD-4 being warm, syrupy, robust, textured, and deeply satisfying.

Layering is very good, as you note @wbass, and I've wondered if the staging, with its good depth and excellent height (which are better than its width), helps with this. The LCD-4 is also highly resolving, but in a more subtle way than brighter headphones. And I'm also right there with you about the old Audezes presenting textures so very well: I love the LCD-2 Classic and the 4 for gritty, dirty, growling, crunchy electric guitars in alternative rock. They're the best headphones I've heard for bands like Sonic Youth, PJ Harvey's To Bring You My Love, and the Devonshire mixes of Nirvana's Nevermind (the rougher Butch Vig version):

https://songwhip.com/pj-harvey/meetzemonsta
https://songwhip.com/nirvana/in-bloom-devonshire-mix

I prefer the sound with the Reveal plugin. I've just ordered the filterset for the LCD-4 from Accurate Sound (https://accuratesound.ca/product/audeze-lcd-4-filterset/) and will report back about how it sounds.

The great thing about Whitney's modified version is that it fixes the things I dislike about the LCD-4 while keeping (and improving) the things I love about it. I'm long overdue in posting my impressions of his RD-4s and will get to it this week.

 

I'm digging these comprehensive reply posts

I think the 4's are a bit peaky and shouty without the Reveal EQ, which transforms them to my ears.

I do find (I think) that EQ adds a very slight sense of digititis--somewhat hard to put a finger on it, it's subtle--but it doesn't bother me unless a long session.

I suppose the inevitable question is... What amp? I know folks here rep the LGX, but I auditioned it with my LCD-2F and didn't care for it much. I preferred my BHA-1, which adds to the Audeze slam quite nicely. The Bryston will probably be my first amp to experiment with when it comes out of storage in Oct.

I also wonder what a powerful tube amp--Feliks Envy, etc.--might add to the 4's.

Finally, that 200 ohm impedance... They're almost classic Sennheiser-like in that regard, and I wonder what this means for amp interactions.

 

The LCD-4 scales well with better amplification and I very much like it with my Stratus. I could see a tube pre + high-quality solid state amp (inc. speaker amps) being a better combination. The Stratus has lovely tone and excellent staging, and the typical joys of a SET amp, but the LCD-4 would benefit from a better grip on its drivers, more speed, and greater macrodynamic contrast and punch. The drivers need a bit of waking up; the LCD-4 isn't the most slammin' headphone out there.

I've liked the LCD-4 well enough from a Mjolnir 1, Mjolnir 2, LAuX, and Phonitor X, although I wouldn't say that any of them do it justice. The really good amp pairings I've heard are the Holo Bliss KTE and the HSA 1b (the Raal Requisite amp for its ribbon headphones that also drives convention headphones).

 

Running the LCD-4 from the Ferrum Orr / Hypsos currently. High gain. Seems solid. It seems like a great amp, with a touch of warmth up top, but plays it pretty straight, and I'm not sure brings any magic of its own. Typical solid-state.

I was meant to audition the Enleum Amp-23R this week, but it didn't work out. Think it could be strong with both the LCD-4 and Sus.

I'm not sure I understand the electrical subtleties of the matter, but supposedly current drive works well with planars?

And, yeah, would be nice to hear both the Audeze and Sus on something like the Benchmark AHB2, particularly with a tube pre.

 

I heard a stock LCD-4 with the Ragnarock 2 recently at a meet and was pleasantly surprised with the synergy. The Rag wakes it up without adding glare or harshness.

 

That makes sense to me. Powerful solid-state seems right. I've been quite enjoying them through the Ferrum stack.

I'm planning to eventually try the BHA-1, then the Enleum, possibly a couple speaker amps.

While not the absolute last word in resolution and despite somewhat narrow soundstage width, the LCD-4 have a certain something--layering and bass heft and texture particularly--that is really working for me right now.

 

Yeah, powerful solid state amps work well with the LCD-4. I wasn't a fan of the pairing with the Rag v 1.5; the LAuX had a more synergistic sound signature, although the Rag, on high gain, did help wake up the LCD-4, giving them a bit more slam and making them more percussive.

I had better luck with the Holo Audio Bliss, which was excellent with the LCD-4, although its slightly warm sound, coupled with the LCD-4's darkness and my Yggdrasil A2's warmth, was probably too much of a good thing. At the moment, I'm getting a satisfying sound from the more powerful ribbon output of the Raal Requisite HSA 1b amp (this same output is designed to power difficult to drive planars as well as Raal's ribbon headphones).

Best of all is my Stratus, although this is somewhat tube dependent: the brighter-sounding LinLai E-2A3s work really well, as does the Emission Labs 5U4G rectifier. This setup improves the stage width of the LCD-4 and opens up the sound nicely, making it a good deal more open and expansive, although the LCD-4 is still a bit congested (or intimate, to put it more politely).

I don't want to speak for @rhythmdevils but he told me a while ago that he likes a solid-state speaker amp with a tube pre-amp with his modded LCD-4s, and I could see that making for an excellent setup.

 

FWIW @weicheheck 's Kenzie Encore as preamp into his First Watt was the best I've heard the HE-6 sound.

 

Well the four total is a long story. To keep it short, Audeze's "B-stock" headphones are very different than Schiit's B-stock. I ended sending back two pairs which had wood peeling off, or the connector looking like this.




I've got two pairs currently. I had a friend selling a pair of 200ohm and I was curious to try one on a long term basis compared to my 100ohm pair. At some point I need to sell one that pair.

I think the LCD-4 is one of the best planars made, and that's coming from a die hard HE-6 fan. It was the first planar I heard that I thought could really keep up with the HE-6. On technicalities I think it exceeds most "flagships" around and starts to approach Estat levels of detail when driven properly.

Amping wise I agree this one is a beast. Not only does it like a lot of power, the 100/200 ohms puts it in a really odd spot on most amp's power curves. Solid State tends to pull a bit more detail out of these in my experience.

 

Been doing some very unscientific swapping back and forth between the Enleum Amp 23-R and Ferrum Orr/Hypsos (balanced in and out) with the LCD-4.

No hard and fast conclusions yet, but a little surprised to find I seem to prefer the LCD-4 out of the less expensive Ferrum stack. The Ferrum seems to play it a little straighter with the Audeze. The Enleum seems a touch bigger and less resolving down low (though is amazingly clear with Susvara and HD58X). The Ferrum seems, overall, a slightly more orderly listen with the LCD-4.

The Enleum generally has a more engaging character and maybe a slight mid-bass hump, which possibly helps the Susvara. The Ferrum is a toucher flatter/less vibrant. But with the fairly wet LCD-4 that might actually be a good thing.

But, again, no real conclusions yet. Forgive the stream of consciousness.

 

Hi.
Just received used lcd-4.Bought from audio store.No sound at all.Even no amp sound.
But when I pluged via xlr on Ragnarok 2 on high gain.When volume on 3 o clock I hear very weak signal of music on left channel.Right channel also have weak sound,but weakest than left.And sound like turntable without phono.
Issue with drivers!?

 

I would say yes. If you plugged into a couple sources that you know work properly, the headphones are probably broken

 

Do you have the ability to measure the resistance and continuity? I'd measure the cable on it's own, and when connected to the drivers, just to rule that out.

 

I tried 3 different cable.Same result