Audiophile objectivists vs. subjectivists

Probably many of you have seen currawong'v recent video:


Being new to the forum community, I guess I'm not sure which specific objectivist curra is specifically referring to.
Is it Amir, webmaster of the Audio Science Review?

https://www.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/8r77lb/hifi_some_schiit_going_down_in_the_world_of/

 

One of the links to which he refers may be found here:
https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...lies-and-usb-dac-technical-measurements.5770/

Another useful one is found here:
https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...-of-6-amps-thd-n-and-thd-specifications.6194/

Several more here:
https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...thd-and-thd-n-specifications-and-graphs.5074/
https://www.superbestaudiofriends.o...hd-n-or-why-both-tell-us-almost-nothing.9544/

 

In the reddit post, I was amused to read that Jude accused Amir (ASF) of being NWAVGuy.

 

Actually, probably many of us haven't, as many of us here have moved on from Headfi, and have moved on from knocking our hears against the subjectivist/objectivist controversy, in which most of the most enthusiastic participants are straw men attacking straw men: how they love to mis-define each other, and then attack their imagined foe.

Don't want to watch currawong. I'm sure he'd understand even if he doesn't agree.

 

Really, you guys don't have anything more useful to discuss than this...?!

 

#1 pet peeve about audiophile culture: having stupid conversations like this over and over again.

Who cares? Find what makes you happy and enjoy some tunes.

 

My own experiences resonate the most with this article - https://www.soundstagesolo.com/index.php/features/246-the-biggest-lie-in-audio

 

Who cares. I like my gear. It sounds good. Yay.
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If we want to argue though - I've always found Amir's reviews roughly akin to saying my car is better only b/c it has more HP and Torque... never mind that the power/torque curve may not actually be what I like/want/need per application, it may handle poorly, has 200k+ miles on it and will die soon, leak oil, get 6mpg, doesn't run reliably, is unsafe, a door is missing, etc.

Just like a car interacting with a ton of things at once, you can't distill human hearing via any piece of audio gear (analog) down to 2 numbers / graphs (very low resolution/incomplete picture of analog) when so many things interact at once, including likely 2, 3, and maybe 4 factor interactions, we have different preferences and biology between listeners, on and on.

Amir's only valid point IMO is not all expensive gear is good... I know I've heard enough mediocre and occasional crappy single pieces of equipment that costs more than all my audio equipment and accessories combined.

 

At the end of that article he relates to how the HP community in contrast to the more "traditional" ORFAS publications, are not allergic to measurements or "anti-science", and that is my experience as well. The ORFAS publications have a real competency problem, so they simply don't have the tools/training to know when and how they are being bamboozled.

@currawong (funny, I though he had an account here) list is related to, but not a simplistic "objectivists vs subjectivists" reduction/argument, and is a reasonable enough "things to think about" list I suppose. The title of this thead probably needs to be changed to "Currawong's list" or something...

 

Usually curra, in his videos, is pretty clam an cool. But video in the TS stands out. He's genuinely upset.
Anyway...
I have tube and SS, oversampling and NOS, diy and exotic brand names ... all in my collection... a bit blase been-there-done-thats ... ... the drama and "conspiracy" is what interests me about this hobby nowadays.
That reddit post is two years old. Still fresh poetry

 

I think it is worth point out that people and culture is different here

Damn, I used to be so much into it... and somewhat on the objective side too. But largely doing my bit of shrieking about arguments that just didn't add up. So what's the point of shrieking? Did it ever convert anybody either way? The people who argue the most about listening are worst at... listening. Not worth getting a sore throat. But listening as in just listening, yep...

Absolutely.

I don't mind a bit of human drama once in a while. I do mind the audiopsychobabble drama.