Denafrips R2R DAC

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by GanGreinke, Feb 1, 2017.

  1. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    You could rip half of the caps out and wouldn't get any change in PSU ripple. If you want instantaneous current capacity you need caps right next to destination pins.

    With that said many smaller caps is a viable option to get a lot of capacitance in a slim case. I just would opt for larger stubbies.
     
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  2. Priidik

    Priidik Friend

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    My thoughts exactly. Low impedance decoupling? It looks like silly visual performance by someone with fixation for repetitive patterns.
    I would probably have used 1/3 of these lytes and a few mkp-s next to IC-s for better results and less bloated/smaller pcb. But then it's at least not snake oil.
     
  3. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    That was my thinking too. I wonder if someone simply said we need "X" capacitance in a "Y" volume and the guy designing it simply picked the the highest "density" cap he could get for cheap and went to town.
     
  4. bazelio

    bazelio Friend

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    Ah it's the ole double hecto spread spectrum CLCLCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC Pi filter. You guys aren't familiar?
     
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  5. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    At the same time it's the Asian school of hi-fi construction. It think it was Marv who said that these guys need to see that they're paying for many parts. If it's actually easier to sell a boxful of parts rather than know-how, then it's a reasonable marketing decision.

    I just hope they left only one row connected to circuit, so you don't get the reliability trade-off. Heck, you could use the rest for repairs if the connected ones croak.
     
  6. bazelio

    bazelio Friend

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    MTBF concerns fo shiz. I like @Dino 's old school string of christmas tree lights problem too. Heh. Though it ought not work that way. Bah, if a few go out, who gives a shit... That might depend on failure mode. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2017
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  7. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    Since we're talking about power supplies, is there any advantage/disadvantage to having different sized caps lined up across the power supply?

    The bigger caps obviously have the bigger reservoir, but someone mentioned earlier that smaller ones have faster discharge?
    Arbitrarily picking some numbers, what would be the differences (if any) of a 4x1000uF vs 40x100uF or (2x1000 + 20x100) ?
     
  8. Thenewerguy009

    Thenewerguy009 Friend

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    Well the guy who owns the unit on head-fi posted this, which I assume is a response from the manufacturer
    [​IMG]

    The manufacturer is Taiwanese & the buyer is Russian, so there might be something lost in translation.
     
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  9. Grahad2

    Grahad2 Red eyes from too much anime

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    Because you're parallel-ing it, you get much lower ESR than one big cap (possible that the big cap has lower ESR, but very rare, and probably a lot more expensive). Layout is also easier with smaller caps (maybe not in Denafrips case). And you get to bulk quantities much quicker.
     
  10. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    Bigger caps will have lower ESR and you might end up having less pins to pull that current. Most of the time tho you'll be limited by PCB trace real estate. IIRC in the case of Denafrips they have regs after the cap bank thus negating any of that instant current draw benefit.
     
  11. m.i.c.k.e.y

    m.i.c.k.e.y Facebook Friend

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    More or less same principles as Gryphon's Kalliope DAC

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Priidik

    Priidik Friend

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    Current demands of electronics often have transient nature, thus parasitic inductance of big e-lytes will limit their effectiveness as sole option.
    Thumb rule is to mix cap types and sizes. Small value ceramics or better yet foil caps are often used as source of extra kick close to IC.
    The use of linear regs negates most of it (edit: but not all, I ran some spice sim to confirm), though as @Hrodulf said. They could have still added small value foil caps after regs.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2017
  13. alvin1118

    alvin1118 MOT - VINSHINE AUDIO

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    Hi guys, any chance you guys like to have a demo tour of the Denafrips ARES ?

    \/
     
  14. thyname

    thyname Rando

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    I do. PM me
     
  15. lukeap69

    lukeap69 Pinoy Panther

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    Might be a good idea for a shooutout with AGD-19 which @Hands will be reviewing soon?
     
  16. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

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    If it's a more timely thing than the Vinshine DAC was going to be, then I can include it in an on-going "big DAC comparison" if you want. The DAC-86 and Terminator are already on that list, provisionally (as I've not looked into what it'll take to get audition/demo units) - though it looks like you may be the point of contact for those as well.

    If you want them included, we can probably figure something out, although I'm really not personally inclined to deal with things like international shipping for heavy-metal boxes. And if you do want them included, you can put the Vinshine DAC back in the list if you wish.
     
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  17. alvin1118

    alvin1118 MOT - VINSHINE AUDIO

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    Hi Torq, sure we'd like to participate. Will PM you for the details.
     
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  18. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    What's the status on this? We might not pull any punches if it sucks though. Well, maybe a little bit because you participate here.
     
  19. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

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    I'll let @alvin1118 provide a current update, but the last time we talked about it he was waiting on their Tomahawk & Venus DACs to be ready. That was originally estimated to be the end of March, so I'm guessing that's running behind a bit.
     
  20. bazelio

    bazelio Friend

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    Status: It's still called Denafrips. As in:

    "I can't decide. Should I go with a Gungnir Multibit or a Denafrips?"

    "Is that a Denafrips in front of your EC Aficionado? You lucky bastard!"

    " @brencho just got another Denafrips."
     
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