Jupiter Audio Research HD650 Impressions/Measurements (Finalized Mod)

Discussion in 'Headphone Measurements' started by Hands, Oct 19, 2018.

  1. tommytakis

    tommytakis MOT: E.T.A Headphones

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    Bifrost 2 + SW51+ > JAR650 = killer synergy
     
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  2. Phantaminum

    Phantaminum Friend

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    Been working crazy amounts of hours so, again, this will be a much shorter and condensed review of the JAR HD650. I tried the JAR HD600 for a few hours but ultimately I went back to the JAR HD650.

    System: PC --> BF2 --> SW51+ | Oblivion Amplifier

    Headphones:
    Sennheiser HD650
    ZMF Auteur
    Focal Elex


    Sound: I really enjoyed the JAR HD650. Truly, I was skeptical of this mod, but found it tamed the mid bass bloom wub wub and made it even more articulate. The mod kept most of what's great of the HD650 and dampens/tightens up everything else. It veers just a few short ticks to the neutral side compared to the HD650, with the mids just slightly being dialed back, and with a much clear/cleaner sound.

    HD 650 vs JAR HD650:
    • The JAR HD650 is just faster and much tighter overall headphone.
    • Bass is more tactile compared to the bass on the OG HD650.
    • Mids are slightly dialed back.
    • It definitely sounds clearer, cleaner, and slightly wins out in resolve.
    • The HD650 has an open sound while the JAR HD650 feels slightly constraint.
    • The JAR 650 still retains that smooth mid to upper mids/lower treble transition.
    • Transients just feel more satisfying on the JAR 650. Snares and cymbals have more thwack and shimmer to them.
    • The JAR 650 demands more energy for the same volume as the HD650. This shouldn't be an issue but on the SW51+ I had the HD650 at about 10 while the JAR 650 was around 11 - 11:30.
    ZMF Auteur vs JAR 650
    • Surprisingly the JAR 650s reminded me of the Auteur. Eerily close to each other.
    • The Auteur has better transients but the JAR 650 has a smoother mids and up transition.
    • They both resolved instruments about equally while I give the nod to the JAR 650 in microdynamics, the Auteur was technically better at everything else.
    • Speed was similar on the SW51+ but on the Oblivion the Auteur pulled away.
    • On very busy tracks, they both exhibit that wall of sound but with the slight nod to the Auteur in keeping it together.
    • The Auteur sounds great out of both amp but the JAR 650 just paired beautifully with the SW51+.
    • The Auteur's bass reaches low. Almost planar low. While the JAR 650 looks at its bigger brother and dreams that it can say, "The water was deep and a cold" standing next to him in a urinal.
    Focal Elex vs JAR HD650
    • The JAR HD650 wins out in timbre and tonal balance. Instruments and vocals sound natural.
    • The JAR HD650 takes the L in speed.
    • The JAR HD650 takes the L in transients.
    • They both equally have the same great microdynamics, while the Elex wins out in macrodynamics.
    • Bass slam and extension easily goes to the Elex.
    • Elex has more air and is stronger at instrument separation on very busy tracks.
    • The Elex is better at imaging and portraying a 3D sound effect compared to the JAR 650.
    • Resolve was a little harder to gauge but I'm giving the nod to the Elex.

    Few Nitpicks: One thing that I found is that images seemed smaller on the JAR 650 compared to the HD650. Also, the stage itself didn't feel as tall and the stage felt more constricted.

    Conclusion: Really, this is a great sounding headphone for the price. The Elex is being sold now for $600 and, to me, has great synergy with the SW51+ but so does the JAR HD650 which is half the price? You get a headphone that sounds clearer and cleaner than the HD650 while still retaining most, if not all, of it's characteristics. It has a more natural sound than the Elex but you're sacrificing stronger imaging, speed, slam, and macrodynamics. For Jazz, Bossanova, Blues, and some Rock, I'd take the Elex over the JAR HD650 but for everything else I'd be happy with the JAR HD650, especially in Acoustics and Vocals. If my budget fell around the JAR HD650 price range, I'd purchase the SW51+ and call it a day. If I wanted to step up to the next tier, I'd save up and purchase the Aeolus or Auteur and skip the Elex altogether.
     
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  3. Pharmaboy

    Pharmaboy Friend

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    I haven't heard the Elex at all, and spent relatively little time with the Auteur--just a short spell IMS & the rest mostly listening in show conditions. So I'm not up on those comparisons.

    Still, I agree with most of your comments about the sound of the JAR650 vs the stock HD650. The latter is a headphone I enjoyed & liked right away. It's easy to see why it has been a big success for probably longer than any other--it has a very well chosen, balanced sound. The JAR650 just takes whatever is good in the stock headphone & makes it somewhat better, all in the direction of resolution, focus/clarity, control, and better bass.

    I didn't notice any real differences in soundstage in the stock HP vs JAR650. Perhaps the somewhat less diffuse sound of the JAR650 makes even more obvious the "intimate" soundstage both headphones share? I was OK with that soundstaging; to me it makes the JAR650 sound like a music monitoring headphone, the type that gives a realistic picture of the recorded music w/no added flash & sizzle.
     
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  4. loadexfa

    loadexfa Friend

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    JAR 650 and 580 Loaner Impressions

    Chains
    iPhone -> iFi iDSD BL
    Pi2AES -> Pavane -> Freya S -> Stratus

    I focused my comparison time with my HD 6XX. Are these a big improvement? Yes. Could they replace my Autuer, Atticus, Clear, or HD 800? No. Considering the price point that isn't a surprise and they are still quite good.

    Fatigue came up a lot, this was a period of rather poor sleep.

    iFi Chain

    JAR 650 vs 6xx
    • 650 clearer, revealed 6xx mud (which I didn't notice initially)
    • 650 Less bass
    • 650 quieter
    • 650 heavier in hand, noticed no difference in on-head comfort
    • Perhaps 650 a little livelier
    • 650 less fatiguing when I listened to Garbage (normally don't find the 6XX fatiguing at all)
    • Various classical: Sometimes close but always preferred JAR. Fuller tone and revealed more detail
    • Jazz: Tie. Sometimes preferred the 6XX tonal balance and percussion hits felt more sharp, liked clarity better with JAR.
    JAR 650 vs JAR 580
    This was my first time hearing a 580, I've never heard the 600 either.
    • 650 a bit muddy / 580 clearer
    • Vocals were a toss up, sometimes I felt the 650 brought them more forward, other times the 580 clarity made them more enjoyable. 650 bass sometimes overshadowed vocals
    • The 580 has more treble emphasis, 650 more bass. Both of them are smooth and I didn't find either fatiguing
    • Sometimes found the 650 sharper despite 580 having more elevated treble
    • Most of the time I preferred the 580 for acoustic, definitely better for classical.
    • Overall liked the 580 better but each one was better for different music, there wasn't a definitive winner, my preference was music dependent

    Stratus Chain

    JAR 580 vs HD 800
    I wanted to know how well the 580 holds up against my favorite classical headphones. The 800 wins no doubt, specifically tone, balance, stage, and presence. There was a lot more emotional engagement with the 800 and I noticed a little fatigue with the 580 (weird). Could 580 be a solid holdover to save money? Yes, probably gets you 50% of the way there.

    650 vs 6XX
    Mostly the same results as the iFi chain with some minor differences. I found the 650 a little more fatiguing and heard more bass than the 6XX. The bass specifically seemed like it could be an issue of clarity. Either way, most of my previous impressions were the same with the Pavane/Stratus.

    Ranking for an all-rounder: 580 > 650 > 6XX > 800
    Ranking for classical music: 800 > 580 > 650 > 6XX
     
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  5. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    Thanks to the loaner tour, I got to check out the JAR 650 and 580. For context, I haven't owned a 650 in years, the last time I did it was a KISS modded one, I had a completely different chain back then and even at that point I still preferred the 600 unmodded. I later acquired an ever so slightly modded HD580 that was my daily driver for years.

    The chain for this was JRiver->UPnP->Moode Audio on a Pi 4 (Sox resampled to 24/88 for all files)->Pi2AES->Gungnir MB A1 via BNC->SW51+ with Telefunken EF805S tubes on the high impedance output (and briefly a Mjolnir 1 but I don't think the Mjo1 has the best synergy with the 580/600/650 in any configuration).

    Aesthetically, the mods look nice, feel solid, and make the headphones feel more substantial. It's not adding so much weight that they felt overly heavy on my head, but those who love the lightweight nature of the Senns should take note that these mods add noticeable heft.

    First up was the 650. And frankly, I was surprised. The mids were very forward and compelling, as was always the strong suit of the 650s, the darker tint of the 650 was still there, but the bass was, to be totally honest, bad. The low end sounded like one note blub blub blub with every track I tried. No texture, no slam, no refinement in any way. I don't think this is the result of the JAR mods. I think the 650 just has absolute shite bass and I didn't notice it back when I had them, both because my chain was not as refined as it is now, and also because I hadn't heard enough excellent bass reproduction from headphones to have reasonable points of comparison. This honestly shocked me because while the 600 and the 580 don't have the best bass reproduction in the entire audio world, there is at least some slam and texture, but with the 650 it was like Sennheiser just went for the seductive mids and everything else was out the window. Put the absolute final nail in the coffin for me ever wanting to own a 650 again. Since it's been so long since I've heard a stock 650 or even a KISS modded 650, I really can't reasonably compare this to a stock unit to say whether or not it's worth getting the mods. I trust the voices of others here who do feel it is an upgrade over stock or over other methods of modding.

    The meat of this loaner for me was the 580. I've long been a 580 fanboy, ever since I heard a pair Bill brought to one of the SoCal meets, and I've been vocal here about my preference for it above the 600 and 650. I think it's the most balanced of the three out of the box, and the most versatile and responsive to modding. Until recently the 580 was my daily driver and had been for many years, so I am extremely familiar with its sound. And the first thought I had when I switched from the 650 to the 580 was "Ah, there's the bass!" and also "Oh yeah and here's the treble that should be here too." The low end on the JAR 580 is a big step up from the 650, with discernible texture and resolution and a varied sound that wasn't one note, with some slam to boot. The mids were not as upfront, and the high end more clear and extended, and overall this is just the sound I prefer, even for rock music where I know a lot of people choose the 650. But it wasn't just the FR where I noted a difference. One of my main test tracks was "Close to the Edge" by Yes. I find this track so useful because it contains sections with different sounds and approaches and types of attack. The opening is sheer cacophony as the entire band plays furiously before settling into a groove, and going back and forth I noticed I was able to make out the individual instruments and what they were playing more easily with the 580 than with the 650. I think this speaks both to the clarity of the 580 as well as the greater treble emphasis, as this allowed me to hear some of the detail more easily. Also I could hear the individual notes Chris Squire was playing on the bass on the 580.

    The biggest question for me was is the JAR 580 a noticeable improvement over my 580, itself lightly modded but much closer to stock than the JAR mods. And the answer for me was, yes, I was able to notice that the JAR 580 did seem more controlled, a little more resolving and clear, and generally sounded like an upgrade over my 580. However, while this was noticeable to me, it wasn't smacking me over the head like going from the 650 to the 580. The differences were subtle, and going back and forth between the two pairs of 580s, they did sound very close. You're not going to mistake the Jar 580 for a different headphone. And given that the 580 is no longer my daily driver, I ultimately felt mine were close enough without being compelled to splurge on further upgrades. If the 580 is your daily driver though, and you've built your system around it as your main headphone, then I absolutely think the JAR mods are worth it over stock.

    I do appreciate being able to hear these and want to stress again that I think the JAR mods are likely getting the most out of the 650 that can be gotten, I just feel that the 650 isn't what I want in a headphone regardless of the mods applied to it.
     
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  6. Noodlz

    Noodlz Almost "Made"

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    Realize I never pasted in my impressions for these beauties from the loaner. Life has been busy and all. These were in my notes so i’ll be copying and pasting with minimum revisions due to lack of time, so please excuse these ramblings / Stream of conscious notes, but hopefully this at least provides some use for someone looking to get these (TLDR; get these. I plan to lol.)



    ///// INITIAL SESSION - Day 1 ////

    === Unboxing ==
    wow the matte material is very very nice

    === Setup ===
    Source - Schiit Modius/ Sonic Frontiers sfd-1
    Amped by the wa6se (sylvania and russian tubes).
    15 min warm up. stock cables

    === Headphones being compared** ===
    • JAR580 [Loaner]
    • JAR650 [Loaner]
    • 580 OG. stock old black mesh. only change in grilll and Shure pads + Shure Pad Filter
    • 580 new stock. newish pads
    • 580 romance - sleeper lotsa mods (did the full copper tape mods recommended by Bill-P
    • 6xx kiss mod plus slight grill tweak (some copper tape + absorber materials)
    ** Excuse the crazy names. I nicknamed my 580s since i have so many lol

    [​IMG]


    == first impressions ==

    JAR650 - oh woooow. chiiiiiils omg. Incredible “real” and organic sounding. so much emotion. ok gotta stop otherwise i can’t get work done.


    JAR580. technically very capable. clear and crisp. also seems to depend on source material. some of them sound incredible (drake -views is great. still not as soulful tho). Transparent, accurate? but maybe a bit too clean and not much”soul”/



    == After about an hour or two ==

    Edit: JAR HOLY GOD this is incredible. this is end game and everything i’ve ever wanted.

    JAR580 needs juice to shine. high z on the wa6se and balanced high gain on the jot2 opens it up quite a bit more and the realism/soul seems to be coming back a bit more from its clinical nature.






    ======== ////// Proper Listening Sessions /////// ========

    Setup Details
    • roon downsample to 44khz 16bit from 24 bit.
    • roon on mac streamed to pi2aes (pi4) on moode,
    • WA6SE:
      • SPDIF (better cables) to WA6SE.
      • Stock 650 cables for WA6SE.
    • Jot2:
      • pi2AES > Mogami Gold AES cable to Schiit Modius
      • Mogami Gold XLR cable pair to Jot2
      • Audiophile Ninja cables for XLR to Jot2 balanced.


    In-depth Listen:


    Fresh 580

    • Overall Sound:
      • Serves as the baseline. all will be compared to this.
    • Mod Setup: Nearly stock
      • (new pads + new baffle + new grills (slighty mod copper tape)
    • More bite when highZ wa6se. might be too much depending on the song tho

    “Romance” 580

    • Sound
      • This pair / driver has more organic feel, slightly more intimate soundstage. JAR650 and OG580 takes the cake on the lifelike feel though.
      • Very Organic tone, and clean, crisp delivery. Emotionally engaging
      • But it feels like its very intimate soundstage. as if the singer is singing next your ears
      • FANTASTIC with something like billie Eilish, with her whisper-tones
      • bass is nice and textured, sorta spread across the floor
    • Mod Setup:
      • Heavily modified, “sleeper” unit
      • Spider cage removed and application over magnet
      • inner tape
      • outer tape
      • 6xx grill with front and back tape (no top tape)
    • Summary
      • Beautifully intimate mids, textured bass that doesn’t slam but rumbles beneath you / behind you.
      • songs feel like sweet whispers next to you. hence “romance”


    “OG 580”

    • Sound:
      • This pair has fantastic mids, very organic and lifelike. a medium sized soundstage (bigger especially horizontally compared to all the other 580/650s)
      • One way to express is that its… Tasty.
      • Vocals and instruments are lightly sweet and glistening, but never overly sugary.
      • Also Very smoooth sounding without losing details.
      • bass is textured and present. More so than all the other 580s, but has less mass and more recessed compared to the 650/6xx.
        • it actually has a balanced sound across the board. less “oomph” but still there to be felt emotionally.
        • It’s quite amazing for anything with mid/vocal emphasis
    • Mod Setup
      • Shure 1540 Pads, 650 Grills, everything else stock


    6XX KISS mod+

    • Mod Setup
    • Sound
      • Just right across the board
      • Pretty good organic, lifelike sounds. not quite the same level of the OG & JAR650, but quite nice
      • Basslines are nice and textured, punchy enough to be felt
      • Plenty of energy and emotional engagement (makes you bob your head / groove when it calls for it)
      • Soundstage is on the intimate side, maybe a bit more intimate than the Fresh580
      • Sounds don’t quite appear out of the void like the OG580 & JAR650, but placements are still very nice
    • Summary
      • Overall a fantastic listen. not quite OMG, but “mmm. very very nice”



    JAR580

    • Note:
      • Right tape falling off but pressed in place for all listening tests
      • Tested across high z, low z on WA6SE, and Jot 2 Balanced low gain & high Gain.
    • Impressions:
      • Slightly more detail / clarity when compared the fresh580
      • A tad more energy, a bit sharper, but not necessarily a cleaner sound. more like a saw-tooth, revealing the digital details of a song. (not a more organic sound)
      • soundstage is about the same as fresh580.
        • Similarly, they gain more organic qualities & bigger soundstage when on the Jot2 low gain setting
    • Summary
      • Nice, but…
        • it feels a bit “synthetic” and the feelings/tones of the music don’t quite come through compared to the other pairs (especially compared to the JAR650)
        • Just not emotionally engaging. even though it is technically very sound.
        • (Not sure if this is any better than a good stock pair of 580s with fresh parts in my opinion)


    JAR650

    • Sound:
      • WOW. clear. organic.
      • spacious sound stage
        • way better than the 580 fresh / JAR580 / Romance580.
        • Slightly more intimate than the OG580, but there’s no “border” in the soundstage, it feels like it actually spans out & fades out on the outer edges without being bounded in.
      • Organic sound
        • I get chills listening with this pair. feels like the voices are right in front of me.
        • Very very life like
      • Emotionally Gripping (makes you want to stop doing anything else and just be enveloped in the music)
      • Sounds just clearly appear in their respective spaces
      • The lower registers & baselines are nice and textured with mass, without being bloated or muddy.
    • Summary
      • This is the end game. i NEED one. and i think I’m done with headphones for a long while for my musical tastes.
    • Note:
      • This sounded Fantastic on the WA6SE. The Jot2 was still fantastic but not quite as emotionally gripping



    === Rankings ===


    Overall

    1. JAR650
    2. “OG”580
    3. Romance 580 / 6XX (Tie)
    4. 580 Stock
    5. JAR580

    Basically - I REALLY want the JAR650.
     
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  7. Ksorota

    Ksorota Friend

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    JAR 650: A brief Review

    I recently got a hold of a JAR650 (Thanks @Jinxy245) and spent a few days comparing it to Genesis G and a modded oppo PM-1 and have come away from it impressed. I fell hard for the JAR600 a few years ago and used it exclusively with a Monoprice LP, but ended up selling it to fund some other purchases and after finding a HE6 4 screw that I was focused on – should have kept them!

    The JAR650 was never something I could get my hands on, and even though I began in the hobby with a HD650 (which I had for 3+ years of daily use) I was not missing HD650 and not overly upset.

    My current daily headphone is the ETA Genesis G, which I have had since rev. 1 and I know very well. Through all the tuning revisions and pad swaps I have maintained smitten, and enjoy them very much. The JAR650, while would not supplant the Genesis G, is almost like a more intimate, unplugged version of it. The soundstage is smaller but more personal, and doesn’t produce the same multilayered satisfying bass, but it is smooth and tight at the same time.

    Questionable analogy time:
    Genesis G is a 2000 person concert venue (Think House of Blues, Boston) while the JAR650 is more of a private event (MTV uplugged if you are old enough to remember).

    The JAR650 is such a good, easy (enchanting at times) listen that I didn’t want to swap it out. The stand out is its vocal presence on acoustic and singer/songwriter tracks. The sense of vocal realism is engaging and deeply satisfying. The music around the singer is effortlessly supporting the vocals with a cohesiveness that is relaxing and non-fatiguing. I found myself drifting off into the music with these on.

    Counterpoint is the Genesis G which produces more of everything the JAR650 does but pushes the vocal focus a bit back and ups the musicality and engagement. The Genesis has more powerful bass, is generally more dynamic and has better instrument separation. The JAR650’s bass can come off as strained or too anemic when strong bass lines are called for. Its interesting how the JAR can come off as smooth on extended listening, but still maintains high levels of detail and clarity.

    Ultimately the JAR650 is a great headphone and my favorite HD650 mod of all that I have heard. It takes the somewhat sleepy (personal opinion) and cleans it up, brings it more towards my preference (HD600 over HJD650).
    Really sad to see this go.
     
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  8. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    Yes, I have both of these side by side along with HD600 and HD650 (both black screen) to put them through the paces. Thanks to @Jinxy245 for the JAR650 personal loaner for a few days for this review.

    Source:

    Theta DS Pro basic II fed via Metrum Ambre (Pi streamer via moOde) via SPDIF coax

    Amps:
    • Schiit Mjolnir 1 (aka MJ1)
    • Eddie Current Black Widow 1 (thanks to @CEE TEE and @Iodexfa for the loaner) (aka BW1)
    • ECP Torpedo 1 (aka T1)

    First off, let me just say that both the JAR’s sound a lot like their parent HD parents. Just a more refined version with more bottom end weight. There is also extra actual weight to the headphones themselves. Not quite Audeze LCD levels, but they are not quite as nimble as the HD counterparts.

    Two quick notes: the JAR650 had a bit of clamp because I believe this is a new headband. I can tell that they are not as wide between the cups at the bottom spread less wide.

    Next, they are heavier than the HD counterparts. Here are the weights as follows:
    • HD600 - 292g (these have a bit of Dynamat)
    • JAR600 - 321g
    • HD650 - 256g
    • JAR650 - 315g

    So take that into consideration.

    JAR600

    When I first received this after purchasing, I was in disbelief. I was discovering details and plankton I did not know was even there. It was almost too much. However, after a few days, I began to really evaluate them as they are super super refined. They are actually probably too good for my music collection to be honest and if you are stuck between Grado and HD600’s, this should be on your short list.

    Let me first say that these are not for me. I have tried to really get into them, but I listen to too much classic rock, alternative, math rock, and can’t justify having these for the 3 or 4 % of my collection that is jazz, classical, and other worthy recordings. These are super revealing headphones and will make Led Zeppelin and Metallica sound shrill.

    Even Though these have some bass lift in the low bass from the stock HD, it seems to me it almost moved the mid-bass down some and left kind of a hole in the mid-bass. The top end is cleaner, clearer, and those who did not like the silver screen 600’s, will probably not like. Now the ones I have are silver screen JAR600’s, so there is part of that as well. However the top end has top end air, I just think it is missing some body to it and can make it sound more clinical.

    For example of this sterile quality...some albums just sounded amazing, some just sounded more clinical than I wanted and still represented everything very tremendously clear, it just did not get my toe taping. For example, I have the MFSL of Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers Damn the Torpedos. This album sounded better on normal HD600’s. However, Tori Amos’ Under the Pink just sounds incredible with JAR600, as some of those tracks can sound stupidly thick and the nuance of George Port Jr’s bass guitar and of course the piano and chamber orchestra stuff sounds like you are in the room. It makes me reach for the T1 volume knob

    This headphone reminds me of Sonus Faber speakers where the good recordings will reveal how bad they really are. All the flaws are tremendously exposed and I still don’t know why refined speakers or headphones are particularly mean to electric distorted guitars. They just come off as buzzsaws.

    This headphone definitely lends itself to tube amps that are also refined. The T1 is really really great and clean and the tubes soften the peakyness some while stil allowing clarity and depth to really shine. The BW1 did also well and likely the best since it added some body and has that smooth signature.

    So I just wanted to be clear that this may not be for everyone or a headphone you you might want to wear all day. It is however for that time when you pull out your 18-year old scotch and enjoy the warm glow of tubes, because it really will reward you with your excellent recordings. This is not an everyday headphone and one that I love and also have issues with in my collection.

    I cannot tell you why they sound different. Measurements look almost identical except for a few db here and there. I know Marv has better measurements with waterfall and distortion plots, which likely has more explanation of the sound differences.

    HD600 vs JAR600.png


    JAR650

    To prepare for this one, I already was listening to HD650 for a couple of days. When the JAR650 arrived, I was not prepared for such a dark tilt. However, they still seem they are not quite as “cloudy” as HD, at least from 1K on up. There is less congestion overall and maybe some more details come through. I attribute this to the control on the baffle housing reducing overall distortion.

    Normal HD650’s are warm, but their bass is light and detailed, something I have always loved about HD650’s as the bass is there and detailed, just not overbearing. It makes for better selection and separation of instruments. The bleed over from the lows to the mid-bass is very apparent and for this was very distracting. Also, it also means do not turn it up too loud. You lose almost all the low end definition, just adds more more mid-bass that makes it more murky in the low end.

    The high end did not feel reduced from HD, more or less the same, just with the bass boost, might take away some air in the mids as there is certainly more bleed over to the low mids from the bass. If you look at the FR, the high end is mostly the same...so HD650 with more bass and mid-bass.

    It is certainly more forgiving of bad recordings and almost in the opposite direction of JAR600 in this regard, however, good recordings will still shine through. They make HD650 sound a bit harsh and smeary in the highs, so it is refined, just in a different way.

    The staging and width does seem wider and deeper, just like with JAR vs HD. It is still a more refined version that has more punchy bass. The laid back attitude with JAR650 is just an extension of the relaxed sound out of HD version.

    I will also say I never put full front foam on the front of JAR650. There is a half-dollar sized hole cut out of the original foam. I remember the quarter mod adds a tiny bit of extra bass, I just wonder if full front foam would make the driver more controlled.

    BW1 was just too much lows for the JAR650 for certain songs and could make it too bloomy and colored. T1 was more controlled, yet still has a tiny bit bass bloom and still super pleasant and smooth. MJ1 was alright, but still almost too slammy for the laid back 650s. It is like they lost all that smooth vibe and I still preferred the T1 here.

    The JAR650 is really worthy of that super old scotch with how laid back it is.

    HD650 vs JAR650.png

    A note on amplification:

    Now I know the T1 is not the end all be all tube amp and more top tier options like DNA or EC would be WAY more suited to JAR. However, the T1 is the most capable best sounding tube amp I have heard from Bachelor, Darkvoice, Crack, and even ZDT Jr. SW51 might bring too much harshness to JAR600, but might be super well suited for JAR650 depending on your taste and preferences. So basically, if the T1 is any indication on the performance of these, they are only going to scale even better with a super top tier amp. (and yes, I am counting Starlett as a top tier tube amp, because, let’s face it, it is). Basically Senns don’t need as much power as you think, just something clean and tubes will always win - and synergy is going to be even more important with JAR over HD, and JAR will likely outscale the HD versions.

    Conclusion:

    Personally, I am sticking with the HD versions. Although I will say that JAR outscales the HD versions. I did not get along with the dryness of the JAR600 and then then the very dark JAR650. I feel like am better served in the middle because a) I don’t listen to high end stuff all the time (yes, I too have Nirvana albums), b) not sure I have the amps to get the most of these, and I am not sure I want to go in that direction.

    PS- both JAR600 and JAR650 are now already sold to another owner.
    PSS - measuring done with flat plane coupler with downward compensation on Dayton EMM-6 at 95db
     
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  9. Jinxy245

    Jinxy245 Vegan Puss

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    Excellent write up IMO. Keep in mind my pair isn't the last iteration of the JAR mod...I believe there's one more piece of circular foam that goes in the hole on the back of the 3d printed piece. This does scale the bass back a bit more from what I've been told. I thought I was clear about that when I lent it out...sorry if I miscommunicated.
     
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  10. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    The one thing I forgot to mention is that the JAR mod is not just that cut out block glued to the back. It is screwed in from the back. If you remove the earpads you will clearly see the screws holding it in place. Then there of course there is the rear foam in back, which varies slightly from the stock foam as with this design there is less of a chance that the leakage from the center will come back through to the front since the exit is so much further from the driver. I do know the thickness of the foam was chosen very carefully while the block provides damping and mass to the frame of the driver, and actually holding and pushing the driver in place, kind of like rear bracing posts in speakers providing back pressure.

    I think all the innovations are great and likely maxed out what you can do with this driver in this frame. However, the tuning and how it varies from stock is up to taste, because to get that lower distortion, the sound signature certainly is affected.

    Ev from ETA also confirmed that the 650 graphs look similar to removing the rear foam. You cannot tell by visual inspection as it looks the same as JAR600.

    I would not know how to get another foam disc in there unless just pushing it in with tweezers or something. I suppose this would help with keeping the driver more in control and provide better driver damping.
     
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  11. Jinxy245

    Jinxy245 Vegan Puss

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    I know @Hands had worked with Jupiter around the final tuning, he'd be able to shed some more light if @ext1 isn't around (I believe he's still in the military ATM).

    Jupiter had talked me through the process of the final mod once, but I was uninspired to try it (or maybe a bit lazy). He made it sound as if it's an easy install, so maybe I have the placement wrong or something.
     
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  12. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    The rear foam disc can be removed or swapped out for your material of choice if desired.

    The plastic piece that holds the foam disc in place is simply held on by some "thick" double-sided adhesive (think 3M VHB). If ever the adhesive gets weak, whether from repeat removal and application of the piece or age, just cut some new strips. Doesn't have to be a perfect fit or anything. It's really just a way to hold the foam in place while fitting the aesthetic.

    So, no reason why you couldn't add additional foam layers or go for a thicker material, so long as you find a way for it to stay in place behind the driver. Really nothing more to it. You could probably even put some adhesive velcro on the rear damping part and stick foam to that, if you wanted.

    Similarly, the front foam is a good way to tune the sound. Run with whatever material you want, with or without holes. What we settled on for the final tuning is meant to be a fairly balanced approach that will work well for most.

    The damping piece is indeed bolted on to the enclosure. If I remember correctly, @ext1 will install the damping piece, let it set for some time, tighten it some more, let it set...and repeats this a few times until everything is secure as can be.

    I haven't yet had reason to do this myself, but it could be possible that the user might need to carefully tighten this on a periodic basis. I'd have to defer to @ext1 on this, so I don't currently recommend any users take such actions. Don't want to risk damaging anything.

    There is also some damping material on the front side of the baffle, under the ear pads. Fills in some specific areas on the baffle. While not a huge add to the sound, it does make a bit of a tangible difference.
     
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  13. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    You can see what @Hands is talking about here, so thanks for that information. You see the line there as that is a separate piece held on by adhesive.

    20211004_140140.jpg
     
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