Marvey's DAC Chart of Awesomeness

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by The Alchemist, Sep 28, 2015.

  1. Original Ken

    Original Ken Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Central California
    Home Page:
    BTW, I find the "Bifrost Multibit" to be less warm, less laid-back, more glarey, and brighter than the Uberfrost. It is smoother, less coarse and less grainy than the Ubefrost. That doesn't fit the left-right spectrum of the chart. The up-down spectrum seems quite accurate. (I do realize that it is not intended to be a perfect representation.)
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    89,984
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Are you running Gen 2 USB on the Bifrost Uber and how long have you warmed up the Bifrost Multibit?
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    89,984
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Practically all of my records are craptastic random pressings bought from Tower Records, Rainbow Records, Rasputins, Streetlight Records, and some record store which I forgot the name of in Ann Arbor decades ago. The sound quality difference (outside of crackles and pops) between my TT and Yggdrasil is larger than the difference between Gungnir DS and Yggdrasil. Vinyl not a little bit better than digital. Vinyl is significantly better, to the extent that I rarely want to listen to my Yggdrasil or Gungnir Multibit when I go to my temple of sound. I have a pre-existing record collection though, so that makes things much easier. (I actually do not advocate that people go back to records. It takes a significant expenditure to get a good vinyl rig; and having no content to start with sucks.)

    You can make the argument that the sound engineers of days past knew what they were doing better than the one's of today. However, it does seem that records which never touched a digital process, sound better than the ones that did. Classical was an early adopter of digital for obvious reasons. The early 80s classical records I have, which were already digitally recorded by that time, do not sound as good as the all-analog chain records (popular, rock, etc.) from that time. You can actually hear the difference on the vinyl format. Same thing for more recent stuff on even audiophile pressings which may have been digitally recorded, mixed, or mastered. The magic isn't quite there compared to recordings which went through all analog processes.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
  4. drfindley

    drfindley Secretly lives in the Analog Room - Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,533
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Austin
    I have a stupid amount of modern vinyl (Modest Mouse, Radiohead, Decembrists, Jeff Buckley, Aphex Twin, etc.) and not all great pressings, but the difference like Marv said is not small. I'd say the difference between the two is from listening to music and to feeling the music (sorry for the touchy-feely words). Like, I can't get any work done because I'm completely moved by an album I've heard a hundred times but all the sudden I've caught feelings.

    The Yggdrasil is great, but it has yet to arrest me like vinyl has, despite it's annoying quirks and Japanese tea ceremony traditions.
     
  5. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,273
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Did you - or anyone with a good TT with a solid base - try to put the DAC on the base of your TT, for vibration isolation? Just to see how vibration affect the sound quality of digital reproduction.
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    89,984
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    My old Rega Planet CDP greatly benefited from bricks and cinder blocks placed on top and below it. The differences were so obvious that even my wife instantly noticed. A tighter more precise and focused sound. Yggdrasil / Data III already weigh close to 80 lbs., so I don't think it will matter for those two components.

    I know you are already use to the crackles and pops by now. Your brain does adjust.
     
  7. drfindley

    drfindley Secretly lives in the Analog Room - Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,533
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Austin
    Yeah, you notice it for about the first 10 seconds of the first track and then you get caught up in the music and you don't notice it.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    89,984
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    heeheeheeheeheeheeheehee
     
  9. Original Ken

    Original Ken Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Central California
    Home Page:
    Yeah but I said the same thing listening to great music on a $39 cassette player, or listening to great music played by an FM radio station in my car (said station using CD players far below the Teac 501 in quality).
     
  10. Original Ken

    Original Ken Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Central California
    Home Page:
    The other aspect of vinyl is that even though I did have a entire wall of LPs, none of it included most of what I am listening to over the past few years, which is all the things that I never paid attention to before. Mozart, Wayne Shorter, Art Blakey, Hank Mobley, Jimmy Smith, James Brown, George Clinton (as well as things that did not even exist back then like Vieux Farka Toure, Bassnectar and Skrillex).

    But I certainly heartily support any music reproduction device that gives anyone a pleasurable musical experience.
     
  11. Original Ken

    Original Ken Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Central California
    Home Page:
    Yes and 72 hours (I leave DACs on 24 hours a day). I am using Wyrd.

    Did the "redacted^2" use the AD8512 in the output, or was that a late change ?
     
  12. velvetx

    velvetx Gear Master West/Vendor Spotlight Moderator

    Staff Member Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,067
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Bay Area, CA
    I agree with you. I find listening to Miles Davis, Ella Fitzgerald, or basically any Jazz or Classical music track on vinyl versus via electronically. It just has that dynamic sound that allows the music to flourish.
     
  13. zeissiez

    zeissiez Turn that Schiit down - acquaintance

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Likes Received:
    136
    Trophy Points:
    33
    Is the Gungnir Multibit good enough for EC BA + KR PX-4 ? or is the Yggdrasil a better match? I use HD800+HE1000.
     
  14. shaizada

    shaizada Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,796
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I really wish people can spend time to listen to a really good vinyl rig and see the major grand canyon void between the best digital and even mediocre vinyl pressings. One is life itself and the other is an approximation of it.

    This does not mean a superb digital remastering is not better than a crappy vinyl mastering...however, when done right, vinyl transcends the digital listening experience.
    The day a DAC surpasses the deep connection to the music that vinyl provides for me, I will dump my whole record collection and all the vinyl playback hardware. Good riddance at that point!

    Till then, a DAC is just a way to listen to music that is unavailable on vinyl for whatever reason. Also, sometimes, you just want to sit back and let the music play on without getting up. However, with the short amount of time I get to sit in front of my system nowadays, I'd rather listen to fewer but fuller experiences of the music even if I have to get up to flip the side!
     
  15. sashafuckinggrey

    sashafuckinggrey Acquaintance

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2015
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    And what about new vinyl releases that are digitally mastered? Is there enough difference compared to digital/cd to get decent vinyl rig?
     
  16. MrTie

    MrTie Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2015
    Likes Received:
    815
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    A.B.E. - PA
    I've never owned a really highend end modern turntable set up, I've had a host of good to great vintage turntables(Duel,Thorens, JVC) and carts(Shure, Ortofon,SAE,Denon) in the past, and I've always enjoyed vinyl more for it's tinkering and crafting of a sound than I do for it's outright superiority(to me) over digital. I would like to have a really nice table someday(Avid,VPI,SOTA), but I'm just remiss to spend the money when my listening habits are about 80/20 in the digital realm. I agree with many posters in the fact that clean pre-digital mastering vinyl are my best sounding by far.
     
  17. The Alchemist

    The Alchemist MOT: Schiit - Here to help!

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,189
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The SchiitR
    Home Page:
    Just out of curiosity, and not meaning to be stupid (sorry if I am), but why are we calling the Gungnir Multi-bit and Bifrost Multi-bit Gungnir Multibit and Bifrost Multibit? I mean I can only guess it means Gu=Gungnir / mby = multi-bit and Bi=Bifrost / mby = Multi-bit.

    I like Gunbit or Frostbit myself :p
     
  18. shaizada

    shaizada Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    1,796
    Trophy Points:
    93
    If the vinyl is actually mastered from a high res digital version (many times this is the case), there is a possibility for it to sound better than the CD mastering of the source.
    I tend to avoid digitally remastered vinyl unless it is really well done.

    200g Jazz albums on the Venus label from japan are all digitally done vinyl. The vinyl sounds superior to the CD's by a long shot.
    http://www.venusrecord.com/v2/index.html
     
  19. cooperpwc

    cooperpwc Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    62
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    China
    Yes, I am wrestling with this. I have a Gungnir MB on the way. Or is it a Gungnir Multibit? Or a Gumb (rhymes with dumb)? Generally we Canadians shy away from anything involving Guns... :)
     
  20. Original Ken

    Original Ken Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Central California
    Home Page:
    Those nicknames are the ones used by the guy who designed the DACs.
     

Share This Page