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Topping D30 DAC Measurements (and subjective impressions)

Discussion in 'Source Measurements' started by purr1n, May 7, 2018.

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  1. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Posting these earlier than I would like due to popular demand from my profile post here: http://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?members/purr1n.3/#profile-post-11929

    Impressions are initial. Subjectively does the Topping D30 sound like ass; and how does it compare to the S19? The S19 is a poser, a wannabe. The student artist who does have great ideas, but cannot draw, cannot execute. The S19 is an embarrassment. In contrast, the D30 does not aspire to anything, nor does it execute anything well. It is plain and it sucks. The stage flat, closed in, and everything sounds like it is rendered at the same volume. The only good thing is that it doesn't have that nasty timbre and artificial detail from the Sabre implementations of the past. It does measure pretty good though like any other decent DAC. I've provided Schiit Modi 2U (older version) for comparison. And no, the Schiit DACs do not measure like shit, at least in competent hands they do not.

    1kHz 0dbFS Topping D30
    Topping D30 1kHz.png

    1kHz 0dbFS Modi 2U
    Modi 2U 1kHz.png
     
    purr1n, May 7, 2018
    #1
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    -30dbFS 1kHz

    Topping D30
    Topping D30 1kHz -30db.png

    Modi 2U
    Modi 2U 1kHz -30db.png

    Modi 2U ias a tiny bump at 60Hz. Topping D30 has small bumps at 120, 240, 360, 480Hz. All are too small to make a difference.
     
    purr1n, May 7, 2018
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  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    -90dbFS 1kHz

    Topping D30
    Topping D30 1kHz -90db.png

    Modi 2U
    Modi 2U 1kHz -90db.png
     
    purr1n, May 7, 2018
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  4. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    1kHz THD+N measured in db from levels from -150dbFS to 0dbFS. This is kind of a nifty measurement that makes some thought, but not too much, to digest.

    Topping D30
    Topping D30 1kHz THDNdb.png


    Modi 2U
    Modi 2U 1kHz THDNdb.png
     
    purr1n, May 7, 2018
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  5. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    P.S. I just realized not Sabre but CS4398 chip for the Topping D30. Makes total sense - didn't sound like Sabre to me. Cirrus chips sound boring. You guys can go back years and find a post on HF or CS where I listed a bunch of chips and described their sound. Yes, a big part of how DACs sound is actually based on the chips. There is a line of thought from some people who believe it's the implementation that matters most. This is only true to an extent. All the other parts (power supply, receiver, clock, etc.) matter, but they simply only help realize the sound of the digital to analog chip (or discrete ladder). A Jeep is still going to feel like a Jeep, whether you throw on it a Hemi engine, knobby tires, raised suspension, heavier duty suspension, etc.
     
    purr1n, May 7, 2018
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  6. lm4der

    lm4der A very good sport - Friend

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    lm4der, May 14, 2018
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  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    And no one cares.
     
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    FWIW, I did the same 12kHz signal. Results are through coax.

    Topping D30
    Topping D30 12kHz.png

    Modi 2U
    Modi 2U 12kHz.png
     
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  9. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Linearity results here, or "Amir bits". Pretty much the same. D30 has slightly hotter output.

    Modi 2U linearity
    Modi 2U Linearity.png

    D30
    D30 Linearity.png
     
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    And now allow me to pull off an Amir:

    OMG! OMG! The Topping D30 has a defective SPDIF implementation!

    It's fine. We are not going to hear anything quieter than a mouse fart. And if FFTs told the whole story, the far higher noise floor and distortion from amps, headphones, and the environment are going to mask it.

    The dude is incompetent and rushes to conclusions too quickly. If he were a true scientist, he would solicit others and have them try to replicate his results. He's basically a commie scientist. As a disclaimer, I make no claims to science, nor did I ever say anything about the Modi 2U's subjective sound quality in this or related posts.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2018
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  11. Elnrik

    Elnrik Super Friendly

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    That's a blatant insult to commie scientists everywhere.
     
    Elnrik, May 14, 2018
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  12. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    True. Commie scientists did put people in orbit. Perhaps Czarist scientist is more appropriate.
     
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  13. HotRatSalad

    HotRatSalad Friend

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    Lots of smack being talked over there. Schiit has no customer support they are saying? That's hilarious, they've been awesome with me, they flat out answer any emails QUICK and late on weekends too.
     
    HotRatSalad, May 14, 2018
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  14. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Did he test Topping's customer support?
     
    purr1n, May 14, 2018
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  15. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    Nobody answered the phone, but he measured the ringing tones coming through the telephone and they tested very well.
     
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    Skyline, May 14, 2018
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  16. neogeosnk

    neogeosnk Friend

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    Just got a phishing call from topping customer support! Schiit customer support has always been top notch. I deal with a lot of vendors and 1/3 are just terrible but schiit always does the right thing and quickly rectifies the issue. Reading over a few posts on the Topping sponsored website, just looks like negative schiit bandwagoning going on over there. Am curious about the Topping 50 though and bought it to see what all the hype is about. I can send it over to the senior staff for a measuring showdown when it arrives.
     
    neogeosnk, May 14, 2018
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  17. Shazb0t

    Shazb0t New

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    Out of curiosity, I am a layman when it comes to these measurements, how come the tones around 12k are ramped up on the Modi versus the spike on the D30?
     
    Shazb0t, May 14, 2018
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  18. Elnrik

    Elnrik Super Friendly

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    @Shazb0t - Perhaps a more important question: why haven't you introduced yourself here? Please do.

    If you wanted to discern meaning from the measurements without appearing to be an Amirite, perhaps you should also ask: Why are there two anomalous humps in the the Topping measurements, and why is the Topping noise floor 25 to 50dBc higher?
     
    Elnrik, May 14, 2018
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  19. raif

    raif Man made lobster/plankton

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    As I have admitted elsewhere on the site, I am bit of a closet objectivist. I spent some time over on the asr site trying to get a feel for the "other" side of the argument and was also highly considering picking up a T50.

    However, in the middle of all of the circlejerking(which we are also guilty of, so no judgement) it comes out that the usb input wasn't isolated. I assumed that based on the way that site skewers Schiit products, typically for "issues" that are at or below the human threshold of hearing, there would have been an outcry when their messiah dac had an obvious engineering flaw. I don't know if anyone has dealt with a ground loop before, but it isn't something can argue subjectively about. It objectively ruins the sound.

    Anyways, all this to say, tribalism and whatnot.
     
    raif, May 14, 2018
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  20. Shazb0t

    Shazb0t New

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    Lol Amirites? Didn't know that was a thing. My main system DAC right now is a Modi Multibit if that tells you anything. From reading both posts that was the innocent question that I came up with, based on my layman interpretation of what I read. It seemed to me to be a feature of both sets of measurements. The noise floor measurements appear to not be in agreement. It's most likely the wrong question, but I am still curious. No harm intended.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2018
    Shazb0t, May 14, 2018
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