Verum Audio - Exciting high performance DIY planar

Discussion in 'Headphone Measurements' started by cskippy, May 24, 2018.

  1. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    That zig-zag stuff is ~ 1db in amplitude. I don't know what's it exactly but I think it's a reflections between magnets.
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Passing resemblance to Abyss. These are big headphones, but they are not heavy. The metal is thin, but not cheap thin like HFM Sundara, or worse like Monoprice. The edges of the metal are rounded, so they don't feel rough or sharp like you might get a cut. Nice attention to the little details. The headphones are beautiful. Like something out of that movie Dune.

    Fuck you! And I mean this is a good way. :D Don't ever underestimate yourself again. I don't know how the others feel, but the Verum is very strong here in microdetail. Better than LCD2C by a significant margin. I'm hearing the ambient cues, the trailing decays, the little string attacks. Unlike many other orthos that bury the small signals, the Verum does not. The Verum carries them through, and not just that, it carries with a liveliness similar to that of traditional dynamics. Microdynamics are excellent. The Verum sings, sucks you in, elicits that human emotion response to music. Oh oh, these are sooo good.

    The timbre is so nice. Unlike many of the newer orthos that sound steely, plasticky, or weird. This like the second coming of the old-school NAD RP18 / Fostex T50: http://www.changstar.com/www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,866.0.html

    If I had anything to nitpick, I'd say that they are sometimes sibilant. Recordings like Alanis Unplugged which has sibilance will have it brought out more. It's not off the charts and is quite liveable. These are so extended in the treble that I bet a little tissue in from of the drivers will tame it without serious drawbacks.

    Couple of comments:
    1. The thread title "DIY budget planar with potential" needs to be changed. Budget implies cost cutting that results in reduced performance. There is nothing reduced performance here. As "with potential" - serious WTF? Potential means it could be good. These are already fucking great. The thread title should include" Holy shit, these are fucking good."
    2. I love you SBAF guys, but some of you have become jaded weenies. There's no need for pad rolling, tweaking, or whatever. Out of the box, these are fantastic. Stop tweaking with shit buttheads. Nothing is perfect, and really, at some point, just enjoy the fucking music.
    3. How the fuck are you guys not jumping up and down about this? I haven't heard anything that has made me so excited in quite a while. This is 2018 SBAF Golden Schlong Award here.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
  3. MF_Kitten

    MF_Kitten Almost "Made"

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    Interesting! I hadn't thought of that! As I said, when I added foam and cotton damping on planars before, that fixed the bumpyness of the frequency response completely. I am buying these at your kickstarter, so when I get them I can try it out and see what happens :p
     
  4. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    I don't think it's about being jaded, just that my tolerance for brightness (or, heck, just what I hear as bright vs. not-bright) is known to be almost non-existent. And these sound bright to me out of the box, BUT they don't sound rough like, say, the Clear or Utopia. In hindsight, it's not entirely too unlike the HE-560, where it's as if my hearing can't get around brightness whatsoever. Immediately makes things sound lean, covers up detail, fatigues me, etc. (Thankfully, the Verum actually sounded good to me, unlike the HE560.)

    And that's all fine, because people here know how to work around my tastes and findings these days. Maybe.

    Fact is, no headphone will be perfect for everyone. What excites me about the Verum is that it's super easy to pad swap with the magnetic system. Very easy to take them from, "Good, but I wish X, Y, or Z were different," to, "Oh damn, these sound really nice!" I personally tend not to do well with tall, stiff pads in most cases, this being no exception. So, this sort of flexibility is becoming more and more interesting to me over time when I think of catering to a wider audience.

    I was reserving some level of excitement given these aren't 100% finalized. I could have elaborated more on how much I liked them with the Ether C pads. I mean, all I said was:

    These (Ether C pads) alone were about all I needed to dial in the tone to about where I like it.

    I think sometimes I am too brief when something sounds good and with little to nitpick, which can give the wrong impression.
     
  5. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    First of all thanks but I'm embarrassed by such review. Really glad that sonic signature of Verum is exactly what you want from headphones.
    I don't underestimate myself and I know what I've created. My main goal was was exactly to make headphones that "Better than LCD2C by a significant margin" and I know that I'm succeeded.

    Also I've heard several hi-end models that are better then Verum 1. Yep, they cost 10 times more, but they are better.

    Heh, world is gone crazy with prices on audio gear. 300$ for headphones is budget? It's expensive! In fact it's very expensive and i'm almost not limited in quality of materials that I use with such price. And yes, I'm from Ukraine. A country where average salary is 300$ :D
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    The HE560 has some unevenness at several points throughout the the upper mids. Also the timbre is just a tiny bit plasticky. And not nearly as lively and exciting.

    @Garuspik: Some of us here call Hands Mr. Warmpoo because of his intolerance for brightness and preference for warm sound.
     
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  7. cskippy

    cskippy Creamy warmpoo

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    @purr1n I'm not sure what version of the headphone you have or what pads are on there but I do agree with what you said. I was being cautious with my words as I know it wasn't the final product and things can change, sometimes for worse (not saying they will here).

    Also, feel free to change the thread title, I don't have the option to do so.

    I honestly can't wait for the new version to arrive at my doorstep.
     
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  8. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    You can't even imagine how I'm impatient!
     
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  9. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Do you think it's more Harkonnen or Atreides equipment?
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    You are supposed to PM me and say "Dude, you need to hear these."

    It's more Corrino / Emperor Shaddam IV.

    $20 paypal to the first SBAF member that does a good photochop of a Shaddam IV wearing one of these.
     
  11. cskippy

    cskippy Creamy warmpoo

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    More Photochop than shop but hey...
     

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  12. Soups

    Soups Sadomasochistic cat

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    Glad you mentioned that, because we in the US need to be slapped out this Jedi Pricing Mind Trick that the headphone industry has played on us.

    When I first got into headphones two or so years ago, I was stunned by the pricing of even 'mid-fi' headphones - wayyyy far beyond the price of other mainstream consumer electronics - e.g. TV's, speakers, game consoles, etc.

    But sadly, it only took me a few months to become mostly desensitized to the egregious pricing. I'm still very mid-fi cheap, but I've noticed that I don't much blink until something crosses the $500 line. I imagine that line goes much higher for a lot of folks here. And that to me is proof that there isn't enough innovation or competition in this industry, and there's still room for disruption.

    But every once in awhile, something like the HD 58X comes along and corrects your perception of what a certain amount of dollars should be getting you. Hoping your planars will follow suit, and that your pricing stays relatively sane. Because I also don't begrudge you some financial reward for a quality product, and expect if this is a success, you'll have some higher-tier, higher-price gear coming.
     
  13. E_Schaaf

    E_Schaaf MOT: Upscale Audio (Thread Judge Code-6 District)

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    Damn. Three positive reviews from some of SBAF's greatest ears. Cannot wait to hear these too.

    Any chance these might go on a loaner tour? How many will be produced?

    Do they scale if one uses a speaker amp - or on the flip side, with tubes?
     
  14. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    They don't need a speaker amp. The driver is lively, responds to small inputs, and therefore also responds to large inputs. In other words, it slams. Many other orthos sound constipated in comparison unless a power amp is used.

    One last note: the voicing isn't dark or laid back like the Audezes. Think of it more along the lines of the HD600. Not saying the voicing is like the HD600, but don't expect thick warm laid back or dark. They can actually be slightly bright at times like Elex. The bass isn't overemphasized like the thunderous Abyss, however the low notes are hit and sustains well maintained.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
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  15. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    One last thing. Years ago, I discovered that adding a damping later on the back of the LCD3 would bring up the lower and mid treble without affecting the last octave. So it seems that perhaps removing a layer of damping would decrease the highs. It does seems counterintuitive because usually when we think of more damping, we think of less peaks. With orthos, this, or at least the back damping, as the opposite affect. Less back damping means less treble in a target area. This is very much a targeted approach when compared to pad rolling where the effect on the FR can vary wildly.

    Verum headphone damping scheme.jpg

    I thought I would open the back to see what I would remove. The Verum has actually has two foam pieces. One fits over the driver cutout, and the other over the grill. I removed the piece of foam over the driver cutout. Voila! Now I don't mean to second guess @Garuspik's tuning, but the sound perfect, or as close to perfect for me.
     
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  16. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Here is the difference plot between with the small piece of foam removed.
    • A little bit more between 1 to 2kHz (which IMO is desirable)
    • Lower / mid treble is shoved down without too much negative effect on top octave (I probably can't that well past 16kHz anyway.)
    • Two small high Q peaks at 300Hz and 500Hz (unlikely to be noticed given small amplitude, high Q, and location in lower mids)
    Verum damping difference plot.png
     
  17. Biodegraded

    Biodegraded Friend

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    Forgive me, somewhat off topic, but: how'd you do the colour fills? Is that automated, or manual with a graphics prog?
     
  18. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    I'd be curious to see if it's possible to measure whether that damping material reflects the treble or if it affects the response of the driver itself (maybe a little of both depending).
     
  19. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Removing one of the two damping pieces in the rear seems sensible to me.
     
  20. MF_Kitten

    MF_Kitten Almost "Made"

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    Can we see overlaid graphs before and after foam removal?

    It seems like the opposite of my taste, but it's a cool effect still.

    Also, I need to see the Dekoni Elite Velours on these. What they did to the LCD2 was amazing to behold.
     

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