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Schiit (MultiBit) Bifrost

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by FlySweep, Oct 2, 2015.

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  1. TMRaven

    TMRaven Friend

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    Even while focusing on the music. I enjoy the HD800 for its clarity, huge soundstage, and specific colorations. Changing the upstream gear hardly has any effect on that.
     
    TMRaven, Jan 20, 2016
    #681
  2. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    Your wallet must love you!
     
    Skyline, Jan 20, 2016
    #682
  3. SSL

    SSL Friend

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    Not possible. You can't "tap your toe" to a mac head out, el oh el.
     
    SSL, Jan 20, 2016
    #683
  4. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    I say just spend what you can afford till you can't hear or justify any differences. It takes a special breed of crazy to enjoy "training" yourself to hear differences in DACs. Or, you know, working night shifts and having nothing better to do while you're alone all night on your weekends. ;) Some people don't care and only want to listen. Some people enjoy both.

    It reminds me of guys that like to overclock and tweak their PCs and perform benchmarks more than they play games. Spoiler alert... That used to be me.
     
    Hands, Jan 20, 2016
    #684
  5. JewBear

    JewBear Almost "Made"

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    What job do you have where you can literally do nothing but listen to music?
     
    JewBear, Jan 20, 2016
    #685
  6. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    I'm of the "buy what you can afford" school, even if I can hear a difference beyond that. I've set my limit at ~$1,000 per item in my gear chain, and well, if there are DAC's that sound better than a Gungnir Multibit to me, but are also significantly more expensive, I just won't be able to get them. If there are amps that sound better to me than a BW but are also more expensive, same deal.
     
    Merrick, Jan 20, 2016
    #686
  7. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    I worked 3rd shift for about a year, IT job, and kept the same sleep schedule on my weekends. Sleep all day, up all night. So I'd be alone all night on my weekends. Wasn't clear earlier, sorry. I did a lot of gear testing then, haha.
     
    Hands, Jan 20, 2016
    #687
  8. lm4der

    lm4der A very good sport - Friend

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    Jebus, sounds brutal. I mean the schedule. Dang.
     
    lm4der, Jan 20, 2016
    #688
  9. cocolinho

    cocolinho Acquaintance

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    Hi SBAF
    Just want to share with little experience with both Bifrost uber vs. Bifrost Multibit. I own both for the moment and I finally decided to return Bifrost Multibit
    Using Spotify (HQ) with Lyr 2 / HD800 , I feel the difference is too small to justify paying 350€ on top.
    Yes there is a small difference (a bit more natural, a bit more resolution, a bit more stage) , I can hear it but I have to close my eyes and really focus on music I'm listening to to make the difference. Obv, it also depends on the quality of the record.
    I'm just listening music while working , honnestly I believe performing "french mod" on my HD800 or rolling tubes on my Lyr 2 will make a bigger difference for much less money.
    Last point, Uber is working great with my 13' notebook while Bifrost Multibit doesn't. It requires more power than USB port can deliver. Both work fine on my bigger laptop (Samsung 17') though.
    Ciao Bifrost Multibit silver, I keep my black Uber!
    my2cents
     
    cocolinho, Jan 21, 2016
    #689
  10. Ash1412

    Ash1412 Friend

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    Did you try running the Bifrost Multibit using WASAPI instead of Spotify alone? Using Spotify alone may mess up the signal because of Windows Directsound
     
    Ash1412, Jan 21, 2016
    #690
  11. cocolinho

    cocolinho Acquaintance

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    no I didn't. Will try
     
    cocolinho, Jan 21, 2016
    #691
  12. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    I don't know why anyone would spend much money at all on DACs if most of their listening isn't going to be done over something like ASIO, WASAPI, or kernel streaming. Otherwise, you're piping everything through the Windows upsampler (i.e. not bit-perfect, and the Windows upsample has questionable sound quality). You can find ways to pipe stuff like internet audio and all other programs through bit-perfect/direct methods, with one example being a solution that JRiver Media Center offers.

    FWIW, I'll have more thoughts up soon, but I think the Gungnir Multibit is the real deal vs. Bifrost Multibit, now that I've had a chance to listen to both back-to-back. I can see why some wouldn't see huge differences with the Bifrost Multibit.
     
    Hands, Jan 21, 2016
    #692
  13. Gravity

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    Do you know if it's possible to use ASIO for MPC-HC to get bit-perfect when watching movies? I use foobar2000 for music.
     
    Gravity, Jan 21, 2016
    #693
  14. Ash1412

    Ash1412 Friend

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    99% of the "the ODAC is just as good as the Yggdrasil" argument stems from this single mistake :mad:

    EDIT: And the "320 kbps MP3 files are just as good as FLAC" argument as well.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2016
    Ash1412, Jan 21, 2016
    #694
  15. Ash1412

    Ash1412 Friend

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    Yes, it is entirely possible. I use WASAPI exclusive in Reclock (a external audio renderer ) without any issues whatsoever. The MPC-HC's default audio renderer will probably support WASAPI or ASIO output as well. I personally prefer WASAPI as it doesn't make weird noises whenever I load a webpage or do anything mildly CPU-intensive unlike ASIO.
     
    Ash1412, Jan 21, 2016
    #695
  16. SoupRKnowva

    SoupRKnowva Official SBAF South Korean Ambassador

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    I'm pretty sure it does, you just have to change the audio renderer options. I know you can in MPC-BE, I haven't used HC in quite a while now
     
    SoupRKnowva, Jan 21, 2016
    #696
  17. lm4der

    lm4der A very good sport - Friend

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    I just want to point out a technicality here - the Windows Mixer doesn't upsample if the output settings are the same as your source. ie configure the system audio setting for 24/44.1 or 32/44.1 for a redbook source, and there is no upsampling.

    The Windows mixer does, however, _always_ increase bit depth. It always upconverts the samples to 32 bit floats, and I know of no source material stored in 32 bit float. That part is ok, but this means that if the output bitdepth is lower than 32 bit float, it will have to downcovert the bit depth on output, which means applying dither. And so you are correct, the output is no longer bit perfect. However, downconverting bitdepth is much less disruptive than upsampling.

    Finally, I'm not disputing that WASAPI/ASIO is the pure way to go. I'm just not so sure that the Windows mixer is so evil if one sets the output settings correctly and you play only one audio stream - your music.

    This is good info, thanks for the comaprison!

    Does this change any of your thinking from a previous post of yours about Bifrost Multibit (before you compared it directly to Gungnir Multibit):

    "For those that have yet to go entirely batshit crazy and into the deep end with this hobby, buy the Bifrost multibit and stop there! Just stop!"

    Link: http://www.superbestaudiofriends.or...chiit-multibit-bifrost.105/page-25#post-17317

    Thanks, and cheers,
    lm4der
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2016
    lm4der, Jan 21, 2016
    #697
  18. Gravity

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    I just started using MPC-HC for watching videos. Is BE better? I don't know much about this stuff. Also, I've tried to go into settings under audio renderer but I can't see ASIO anywhere. I'm using DAC-19 that uses amenaro, that I can see in there though.
     
    Gravity, Jan 21, 2016
    #698
  19. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Thanks for the clarification and additional info, @lm4der. And, no, my thoughts on the Bifrost Multibit haven't necessarily changed. I still think it's great for the price, enjoyable regardless of price, and a good place to stop before you go totally crazy with the hobby and start blowing all your savings and annual bonuses. :) But the Gungnir Multibit did slightly change my perspective of the Bifrost Multibit. I'll try to explain more later when I write up full comparisons.

    I guess I could say for those that really want to go down the rabbit hole, the Gungnir Multibit is the next stop after Bifrost Multibit. It's just, you know...double the price and physically much larger. For the vast majority of those willing to spend money on an external DAC in the first place, Bifrost Multibit is still a better value proposition. But for the subset of people that are more likely to visit, say, SBAF, they tend to reach a bit further and would be better served by the Gungnir Multibit. Of course, folks on this site are likely already deeper in the rabbit hole to begin with.
     
    Hands, Jan 21, 2016
    #699
  20. lm4der

    lm4der A very good sport - Friend

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    Very interesting. Now I must reconsider throwing money at a Gungnir Multibit.
     
    lm4der, Jan 21, 2016
    #700
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