RMAF 2017 Impressions

Discussion in 'The Meeting Place' started by Scott Kramer, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Looks like a different damping scheme. A lighter touch than the three pieces of foam squished together on HD650. Likely a stronger magnet.

    Very much looking forward to this. The fact that there is no Sennheiser sales rep on HF soliciting Jude and unwitting preview users for glorious quotes of awesomeness tells me that Sennheiser knows they have something awesome on their hands. The HD700 was such an abomination. No idea how the creators of the HD580/600/650 made that one.
     
  2. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    If there are Sennheiser HD660s, I know exactly what my next headphones will be. There looks to be less damping above and below the rear of the driver with some porous material instead of the foam in the middle. Whatever's under that big logo could also impact bass.

    Very interested in these if they're real.
     
  3. Ringingears

    Ringingears Honorary BFF

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    Also interesting how they quietly slipped the first production run model into a Rotterdam headphone show. No upfront publicity at all. And nothing at RMAF apparently. And just in time for the holiday buying season. I know nothing about marketing, but this does seem like one way to create a buzz, as it seems to be working already.

    Edit: According to Frans the HD660S uses the same housing as the Massdrop HD6XX except a better paint job.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017
  4. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    Nice sounds at Voxative: Should be for about $46k speakers

    20171008_143632.jpg

    Most interesting product. Turn your water bottle into a humidifier at the SOTM room

    20171008_141345.jpg
     
  5. nithhoggr

    nithhoggr Author of the best selling novel Digital Jesus

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    IIRC, the "S" in HD800S was for the first letter of the German word for balanced audio (i.e., that they came with a balanced cable whereas the HD800 didn't)...I wonder if that means HD660S are planned to include a balanced cable, or if Senn has just decided to stick "S" on the end of things to make them more impressive.
     
  6. 9suns

    9suns [insert unearned title here]

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    Yes, the S in HD800S means "Symmetrisch" (symmetrical or balanced), because of the included 4 pin XLR cable.
     
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    [​IMG]

    Looks like they are back to using TotalDAC again, after all that DAVE vs. Total DAC drama that spilled over to HF.

    No, I am the best. No, I am! No, you cheated and cut a special deal. No, your DAC sucked with Voxactiv. Blah blah blah.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I thought it meant (S)ibilant and (S)low, at least compared to regular HD800.
     
  9. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    ^^ S=sucks compared to original. Or S for sucker.

    You do get a nice paint job and two shitty cables though. 800 classic FTW!!
     
  10. Ringingears

    Ringingears Honorary BFF

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    Hopefully history doesn't repeated itself. All we know is Frans heard it. Thought it sounded like an HD650 with more sub-bass. It has different pads. Is tight or at least as tight as a new HD650. Has a different driver. Is black. And it costs more. More ears are needed. So far we have a sample of one.

    Edit: But I am excited at the possibilities.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017
  11. Cspirou

    Cspirou They call me Sparky

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    Excited about the HD 660 and can’t wait to see measurements. I love my HD 600s but I would prefer a bit more sub-bass

    I think the S8 has an output impedance of ~5ohms, which would certainly have issues with the Massdrop Plus.
     
  12. captkirk

    captkirk Khan's BFF

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    So, was Cavalli in attendance?
     
  13. jexby

    jexby Posole Prince

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    Dr absent. no idea why, other than massdrop has taken over his production?
     
  14. Galm

    Galm Still looking for Little Red Riding Hood

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    This was the first show I've ever been to, and therefore the first time I'd tried almost everything but a handful of headphones and man, I could not agree with this enough. I was really excited to try the Zeus XR Adel, Tia Fourte, and Andromeda and was very disappointed. They sounded almost distant or something compared to my Dita Dreams. Of those three the Andromeda were probably my favorites. I also like the Tia only slightly more than the A18. Though the Tia was still probably my second favorite (there are many iems I'm not mentioning).

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Ton of photos (also sorry I was f'ing around with portrait mode a lot):
    https://imgur.com/a/NJWbZ
    https://imgur.com/a/aTX2w

    So for my own impressions I guess I'll give a little context. I use Utopia with Yggdrasil/Raggy at the moment and am a sucker for the detail this combo offers, so a lot of headphones that had great sound signatures didn't do it for me when the detail wasn't there... Anyway getting into it, stuff I liked I'll bold the names of.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Focal Elear - meh... Didn't like the mid dip and the detail was no where near what I was expecting compared to Utopia.

    Focal Clear - Sounded to me like Elear with the dip fixed. So it did sound much more like Utopia, but it didn't do it for me. The difference in detail between the two while obviously expected was noticeable to me. And for the money, I'm not sure how compelling these are vs an Elear with EQ or like a ZMF headphone or HD800 or something if that's your taste. They definitely weren't bad... I was just having trouble dealing with the price.

    Focal Utopia - My current and still probably favorite headphone.

    ZMF Auteur - This was a good headphone, don't get me wrong. I owned an Atticus and have heard Eikon so I'm familiar with their sound. It's definitely my new favorite ZMF. But again the detail lover in me didn't feel it for me personally. It was more open and a little brighter. I'd take HD800SDR instead. But I definitely see the hype, and it was awesome to meet Zach and his wife (both were awesome). OH, also does anyone know what the limited finish was on the Eikon at the ZMF booth? That thing was sexy as hell. It was like matte finished kind of instead of glossy and like greyish I think.

    Fostex TH900 - Had never heard it, and though I wouldn't like them at all... They sounded more natural and smooth then I expected them to. I was really pleased with the sound. I tend to find closed backs bloated sounding and even though these were bassy I didn't feel that way... I dunno, I know people tend to love or hate these things, but I was a big fan and the green finished ones looked freakin awesome.

    Tia X/Y - I liked Tia X a lot more... Almost defintely the one with more BA's in them while the Y was more Tia based. It sounded more upfront and clear to me.

    Schiit The Gadget - I thought this thing was fun as hell. I saw @Hands comments on it which was my impression on Saturday for the most part. On Sunday I found a quiet point with some LCD-XCs (I think? idk wasn't paying much attention to the headphone lol). It worked well with certain genres to me. Anything more acoustical/classical sounded really cool to me. Anything more poppy or rocky sounded super super weird. Though I do have a good sense of pitch, so songs I know how the singing should sound just felt off the whole time. I want one. Also talked with Mike for a while, he was also awesome.

    Abyss Phi - I was hoping I'd like these a little more considering the price. And I got to try them with the WA33 Elite Edition. But the detail wasn't enough for me. The soundstage was amazingly precise to me (I like to test the 2:00 mark on Inharmonic Symphonic by Argaman) and that was the best I've ever heard it.

    Abyss Diana - I tried the Phi first and thought I wasn't going to like these... But the smaller soundstage sounded better to me? Idk my impression was that it was more detailed even though Mr. Skubinski was saying the Phi had better detail retrieval. I was using a SS amp with Diana though. But man did I enjoy it.

    120,000 dollar Gold Focal Utopia - The Diamonds really made it sound better 10/10 I bought 7 for each day of the week.

    Mr. Speakers Electrostat - It sounded bassier to me than the Stax SR-009 and I think I liked it? But the area was too loud so I don't really know. Definitely still interested in it. I enjoyed the Ether Flows a ton and the Aeons were one of the other closed backs I like besides the Fostex.

    Hifiman Shangri-la - Lol I thought this thing sounded terrible... The price is so completely absurd and myself and the couple people I was with both preferred like.... most other headphones over it.

    Hifiman Susvara - 6k and didn't bring much to the table for me, the detail didn't seem above Utopia. It wasn't bad, but like I'd have liked it at 1k.

    Hifiman HE1000V2 - The soundstage on this thing gave me chills. Literally thought something outside was playing. Reallly enjoyed these ones overall. Bass was kinda airy but it was fun to listen to. Listened to it at the Dana Cables booth and was pretty sure I could here a difference as well... But I'm not going down that rabbit hole today.

    Sennheiser HD700 - awful. I see why friends don't let friends buy one.

    Sennheiser HD800 - Owned it, treble is a bit much but with mods I would bold it.

    Sennheiser HD800s - Too much money and the bass distortion make me prefer HD800 with modding.

    Enigma Dharma D1000 - What the f**k is this? And why do I like it? It's an electrostatic dynamic hybrid? For 1200 dollars I thought this thing sounded really open. The sound stage was great and the detail was good. Not great but I liked them for the price.

    Chord Hugo 2 - damnit I like it... Sounded great with my iems. Better to my ears than the WM1Z and the plethora of other lesser players I tried. It really sounded like Mojo with out the treble issue and had quite a bump in detail retrieval.

    Chord Dave/Blu combo - I tried this with LCD-4s as well as my Dita Dreams (because I'm more familiar with them) and yeah it kicked ass... I'm bolding it because it's in dreaming land. Price is a joke but damn if it didn't sound good. I also got to talk with Rob Watts for quite a while and it was a really awesome discussion. Also if anyone knows what the far left amp was at the Audeze table (Magra?) That thing was good too... 28k or something though.

    Mysphere 31 - Weirdest looking headphone I've ever tried. It actually sounded pretty good. But I believe the maker of it said it was like 5,000 dollars? Way too much. If you told me it was like 500-1000 I'd think it was a pretty neat option. The sound signature changed quite a lot depending on how I wore it. But I could get a surprising amount of detail out of what felt like an on ear.

    Stax SR-009 - Really good. but I'm not sure I preferred them over Utopia. The bass was a little light for my tastes, and my expectations were probably too high for the detail I could expect.

    Stax SR-007 - After acknowledging the loss in detail I thought the increased bass in these sounded a lot more fun. Still had a very unique presentation typical of electrostats and I'd take this over a shangri-la any day.

    Woo Audio WA8 - Just thought I'd mention I like the sound this little guy could put out. I had WA7s (yeah I know) and I thought this thing was better and far smaller. It had more detail than my WA7s with Utopia.

    Woo Audio WA33 Elite - Very good, but not as unbelievable as I hoped for like 17k - 18k (with their tubes).

    Shure KSE-1500 - Eh, honestly I liked these a lot more than most iems. But there wasn't enough detail for the price. The bass was kinda wonky as well. Treble felt kinda harsh.

    Periodic Audio stuff - Not a fan. Detail wasn't very good. I thought the Berylliums were like 50 bucks and they were like 300... So that wasn't good.

    Final Audio flagship iem - this thing. The soundstage was huge, but ringy. Comfort was horrific and generally I thought it was ridiculous to charge so much for it. The concept was novel, but I really didn't like it.

    Final Audio D8000 - I thought this was terrible. It was the first planar I tried at the show and made me have dirt for expectations. The detail was not there (out of a Dave) and it really did nothing anywhere near well enough for the price. I think it was fairly neutral? I didn't spend long with it...

    Audeze LCD-4 - Actually these were good. But I slightly preferred Utopia still and the price tag is higher.

    Audeze LCD-i4 - The only iem I was tempted to want to buy or at least borrow. Really really unique sounding for an iem. The bass slam was crazy for an iem and it was really open. Definitely not neutral but a whole lot of fun to listen to to me. Justice's Groove by Stanley Clarke was amazing on these.

    Audeze LCD-MX4 - very uninteresting. I guess that's the point. Neutral but boring.

    Audeze everything else LCD - They were all pretty good. Expensive for the money but I at least liked them somewhat.

    Audio Technica X5000 - Cut the price in half... HD800 had more detail to me and they did nothing really special. The bass was much more present than the HD800 though. Not my thing.

    Crosszone cz-1 - Very huge soundstage for a closed back. Reminded me of using a surround sound software kind of in a bad way. Very strange sounding, music sounded alien compared to what I'm used ot.

    Questyle Gold Stack - I actually thought Utopia sounded great out of this thing. Really expensive, but it was really detailed and the imaging felt really tight. Felt like a better version of my set up currently.

    Speakers - not impressed by anything (considering prices) except the new Focal speakers that were like 10k. Not sure if it was the set ups or what (also you people listen too damn loud all the time at these demos rip my ears) but I didn't get blown away by anything else.

    Food Trucks - They were gud.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Overall it was an awesome show. I got to talk with a lot of other people that were a whole lot of fun, and ran into a couple SBAFers here and there. Unfortunately I couldn't make the meeting so I never bothered posting in that thread.

    Also I tried a ton of other stuff. Most of it I didn't like or think was interesting enough to mention, but if you wanted to get my amateur impressions of something (and it was expensive heehee) I probably went around and tried itl

    My only wish was that Orpheus was there. Otherwise it itched all the right places :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017
  15. TheIceman93

    TheIceman93 El pato-zorro

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    I heard he is retiring, closing Cavalli Audio for good and that he sold his designs to Massdrop. I think they refunded a bunch of people for amp pre-orders as well for products that will never see the light of day. Warren is now working at Headfi full time and no longer associated with Cavalli so I think the company is as good as dead. Too bad but I think Alex got bogged down with the difficulties of mass production and lost interest in building amps.
     
  16. DrForBin

    DrForBin Friend

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    hello,

    @TheIceman93, if this is the case...it really sux. the thing i found admirable about Cavalli Audio is that they seemed unafraid. if you want the ultimate tube roller amp, we have it. if you have those strange Stax things, we have a pair of amps to drive them with different flavours and topographies. if you want an end game amp with a tube inside, we have it. and only one tube, so it is very easy to live with.

    and, i'm afraid, the products were absolutely stunning! the logical extension/upgrade from Schitt. Valencia for the DACs, Austin for the amps (sorry Jason.) however a logical stepping stone. the best affordable amps and dacs, to be upgraded with the best USA made amps (when you can afford the upgrade.)

    then again, i could never afford any of these.:(
     
  17. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    On the one hand, that is disappointing because Cavalli made good products. On the other hand, if MD really owns all the designs now, then I wonder exactly what we might see from them in the future.
     
  18. jowls

    jowls Never shitposts (please) - Friend

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    Yeah, a cheaper Crimson in a less fancy MD chassis would be an instabuy for me...
     
  19. damaged-goods

    damaged-goods Acquaintance

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    IIRC "s" in HD800s is for "schwarz" which is the german word for black. :)
     
  20. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    S7 OI was 5 Ohms or so, but S8 is definitely lower. I know it's hard to see, but compare the bass-bump in the loaded GSMArena measurements:

    S7:https://cdn.gsmarena.com/imgroot/reviews/16/samsung-galaxy-s7/aq/gsmarena_a001.png
    S8:https://cdn.gsmarena.com/imgroot/reviews/17/samsung-galaxy-s8/aq/gsmarena_a001.png

    Also subjectively there doesn't seem to be much impedance interaction with my UERMs.

    (The measurements are for the Exynos version IIRC, I have the Snapdragon one as I assume @Hands does.)


    Aside from the new Focal speakers, did anyone see any interesting speakers?
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2017

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