The Two Channel Advice Thread

Discussion in 'Advice Threads' started by purr1n, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. Bitter

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  2. JayC

    JayC Resident Crash Test Dummy

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    I had a creek evolution before my vidar, it was pretty decent (can't remember if it was the evolution 1 or 2). It did well with the harbeth p3esr I had, but I felt like the vidar drove it better. I found the vidar was able to really bring out a better level of bass performance, which was a good thing because of the relatively weak bass of the harbeth. I had a set of dynaudio x12 before that which did quite well with the creek too. Good but not something special. No experience with the 50a but it should be fairly similar.

    Coming to think of it, for 600$ you could easily get a vidar..
     
  3. Bitter

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    Well comparing a Poweramp and an integrated amp isn’t really fair, I would need a preamp with volume control of some sort...

    In Europe there are few used Vidar and price is almost 1000$ If I add a saga I reach 1500$.

    Then maybe that’s a better option to wait and find those used in the long run..
     
  4. JayC

    JayC Resident Crash Test Dummy

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    Yeah you're right, I forgot about the preamp. But it's surprising that a used vidar is $1000 considering that a new one is 770€ or so. I've seen them for much cheaper, also sagas.. Probably need to search for a while?
     
  5. Bitter

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    That's the price for a new one, sorry for lack of clarity. European price is higher mostly because of VAT.
     
  6. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    Not surprising about the Tangent amp since What hifi kinda bagged the bigger model for not enough power and rough sounding treble. Tangent link on the whf site indicates medical monitors and computers.

    Where are you located?

    And you may have to bump your budget if you like LOUD and want a decent amp that will work for you for years. Used may be the way to go.
     
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  7. Bitter

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    I’m in France, and indeed I’m looking primarily for used gear. It’s not that I like LOUD, but You know having a little head room to mess around is nice. Ican live with a bit of distortion up there that’s going to be like 1% of my use but clipping c’mon I haven’t heard clipping in Years...
     
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  8. bixby

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    Yea headroom is mandatory and clipping sucks. I would call some shops and try to get an overnight loan on some pieces. My short list would include the Rega Elix-R, Cyrus, maybe an older Electrocompaniet integrated or Atoll, Naim, and on the more mainstream side perhaps Marantz, Arcam, and Creek.

    You should be able to find something that would work. How are you liking the EVO 4.2??
     
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  9. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    I suspect the Creek would do a decent job and it’s supposed to be a very good amp (should be much better than the other one). Will it get “loud enough”, that depends on you. However definitely buy used or with good return policy to minimize risk in case it doesn’t measure up.
     
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  10. Bitter

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    I really like my speakers, the sound even convinced my wife who was rather unenthusiastic about the project to begin with.

    There's also decent deals on Atoll, (being a French brand that's expected..) on the used market however reviews seems to indicate smooth top end, that's already the case with my Loudspeaker so that might be too much of a good thing ? :
    Atoll IN80 for 280$ --> this one seems cheap !
    Atoll IN100 for 635$

    I'll wait a bit to have a more precise view of the market, but I keep the option open.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 10, 2021
  11. EmDub

    EmDub Rando

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    Has anyone spent time listening to the Odyssey Cyclops integrated amp? I'm wondering how it compares to the Vidar/Saga and Ragnarok 2. I'm currently using an old Pioneer VSX 1021K with a Modius and KEF Q150 speakers in a "new" home pandemic office (10x10 with cathedral ceilings), and I want to upgrade to a new two channel amp in this price range to start building out a reasonably priced system. Thanks in advance for your input.
     
  12. nishan99

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    Is there a trick to get bigger scale of music when listening late at night in the 55-65 dB?.

    The ones I know of 1) getting closer to the speakers but I hate nearfield listening. 2) getting a bigger speakers but that not feasible unfortunately :(.

    I suspect a tube preamp or amp will give bigger scale but those are known to suck at lower late night volumes.
     
  13. Metro

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  14. haywood

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  16. bixby

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    @nishan99

    no, unfortunately, I do not feel this can be solved by equipment or eq.
     
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  17. fraggler

    fraggler A Happy & Busy Life

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    So maybe better off in a different thread or one that I missed, but I need more sound education. What about a speaker/speaker system can make music thwack? I can't really think of a better word for it. Not so much the rumble or thump of bass (I get plenty of that from my subwoofer), nor something related to just loud music. More the percussive strike of live instruments. Also the grunt of the strings on an upright bass.

    If I pursue 2 channel beyond my consumer grade home theater setup, I want thwack and percussiveness, but not be tied to high volumes if possible. My gut tells me from skimming around here that maybe BWC stuff with high efficiency is probably the way to go, but my space could only accommodate 8" or maybe 10" woofers if in a narrow package. My GF has softened her stance on how the speakers could look as long as they take up no more floor space than my current bookshelves on stands. Could a tower based around 6-7" woofers thwack? I will always be budget constrained, so looking at solutions sub $1000. Sorry for the 2nd grade questions.
     
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  18. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    I think is more do to with sound energy and also our ears working to perceive dynamics. The only way to fix this is more volume or reducing the overall noise in the room. Just grabbing the bass knob will give you more dymaic feel and trick you to overcome this because it is kind of doing the same thing as the fletcher-munson curve, but also pushing the bass over the ambient noise.
     
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  19. AdvanTech

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    Could you just sacrifice space between the speakers to allow for larger woofers and cabinets? That’s kind of what I did, and for some of the same reasons. I’m sure my rig would enjoy more breathing room but I don’t have it where I currently live.
     
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  20. bixby

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    I understand what you mean by thwack. I believe it is a combination of dynamic range and frequency response. I do not believe you can boil it down to driver size as the answer. My 12 inch full rangers have a good amount of thwack and they are high efficiency. My older 7 inch monitors which were way less efficient had less of this.

    I believe the thwackiness is related to the frequency response of the speakers in room as well. A lift in the response in the range where stick or hand strike on a percussive device like a drum creates a more audible thwackiness in my experience. A decrease in the response in the 300-400 range also may also contribute to the more pronounced transient strike sound. But you have to be careful as this may mess up other things like vocals.

    But by and large I believe a high dynamic range and high efficiency speaker may be the starting point. eg. some of the Klipsch stuff does this well, but they fall apart in other areas IMHO.

    If you wish to experiment, load an EQ program and play some drum solo tracks while moving a notch filter with about 10 db of boost around to hear how the impact can be affected.
     
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