Life after Yggdrasil: Watering the Ash

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by Torq, Mar 1, 2017.

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  1. Zurvv

    Zurvv Acquaintance

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    RE: warm-up
    What do we think the science is behind needing a warm up of a month (from a power up)?
    I can't get my head around what would require that every time. A break in period, yes, i get. Hitting an temp of all components makes sense too - but that wouldn't take a month (let alone days.)
    I don't doubt that something is happening. It is pretty universal that people say the yggd sounds much better after it has been on (post a power up) after a very long re-warm up.

    Also, is this effect reset on a power loss or is a cool down? ie, well a fast power loss reset the timer?

    But i'm already really enjoying it. It was a big jump up from my old dacs (crappy? Oppo HA-1 / Audiolab M-DAC/ Fostex HP-A8 / Dragonfly Red)
    also my desktop speakers are much better too. From PSB Imagine mini to Elac BS403.
     
  2. gefski

    gefski Facebook Friend

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    For me, a brief power down for both YggyB and previous YggyA doesn’t require any burn in. In fact, Moffat has commented that Yggdrasil, like most digital, likes to be “burped” occasionally. So other than a minute shutdown weekly or so, Yggdrasil, uDO (Dante interface), and Mac Mini server are on or asleep 24/7.
     
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  3. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    This has been covered multiple times. The answer from Mike (@baldr ) is that the INL spec needs time to normalize, and the more bits the DAC has, the longer it takes.
     
  4. Zurvv

    Zurvv Acquaintance

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    hrmm.. sorry. That said, the isn't much explaining why that would be the case and why it would need a month. Also, the "bits" part of it shouldn't matter (unless it is used as a short hand for "more hardware was added".) I was expecting something along the lines of electric parts of it or how materials change due to heat or current. I'll search again, hopefully it is more detailed.
    Of course, it is was it is. :D
     
  5. Buff Hamster

    Buff Hamster Rando

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    I have an offer on a 2nd hand Gungnir multibit but i'm concerned it might be a SD version. How do I tell the difference between multibit and SD?
     
  6. Metro

    Metro Friend

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    There should be a Multibit sticker in back.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  7. chesebert

    chesebert Rando

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    Thank you for all your impressions. I find them to be a valuable data point and quiet entertaining to read.

    In your above impression you rated Katalyst DAC higher than Yggdrasil A2. I don’t doubt that as I also have the Katalyst DAC and am blown away by the quality. However you noted that Klimax DSM/1 is not as good as Yggdrasil A2. Although I don’t have a DSM/1 I have the DS/1, and I feel the difference between DS/1 and DS Katalyst is like how you have explained - LCD vs OLED. So naturally I am a bit puzzled at your impression of DSM/1. Could you give some more color to your analysis? What version of Davaar did you use as different versions sound different. I also assumed digital volume control and SO were disabled as well?

    I don’t have and have never heard Yggdrasil A2, so this is pure audiophile curiosity.

    Non related note: I believe the reason you liked Katalyst is partly due to the DAC architecture. Katalyst DAC has a clock frequency of 6.144 megahertz, which is higher than the frequency for DSD128. In addition, Katalyst works with 6-bit in its upsampling, which corresponds to 64 instead of 2 quantization levels.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 6, 2020
  8. mrflibble

    mrflibble Friend

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    I don't think Torq visits here anymore. He has his own website and forums over at www.headphones.com, you could try there.
     
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  9. allegro

    allegro Friend

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    @Torq has not posted here in almost two years. His favorite DACs list:

    1. Chord DAVE (via Blu Mk2 or Hugo M-Scaler)
    2. MSB Select DAC (with Femto 33 clock and 2x Mono Powerbases)
    3. dCS Vivaldi (w/ Upsampler and Master Clock)
    4. Linn Klimax DSM/3 (Katalyst)
    5. Hugo TT 2 (via Hugo M-Scaler)
    6. dCS Bartok
    7. Schiit Yggdrasil A2 (w/ Unison USB)
    8. Mola Mola Tambaqui
    9. Matrix X-Sabre Pro MQA
    10. Schiit Bifrost 2
     
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  10. chesebert

    chesebert Rando

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    Wow. I am late to the party as always. Did Torq buy out Tyll and his investors?
     
  11. murphythecat

    murphythecat Self Imposed Exile

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    ok, so thats recent. the bitfrost 2 is a giant kiler.
     
  12. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

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    He's on his way out of there too, he said that he is about to leave on a multiyear trip round the world.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 7, 2020
  13. gaspasser

    gaspasser Flatulence Maestro

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    This was already discussed back on 4/20 (yeah, man!).

     
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  14. chesebert

    chesebert Rando

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    COVID has entered the forum.
     
  15. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    I’d like to hear more about this. I don’t recall a loss of resolution after upgrading to Analog 2, but the process did take a few weeks so I guess it’s theoretically possible.
     
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  16. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

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    I don't recall a loss of resolution either, in fact after it was properly rewarmed up after the upgrade, I felt that percussive transients, double bass, and kick drum had more fine detail. But yes, there was a long gap while it was being upgraded and I was using other DACs in its place, which might have confused me. Although if I recall those DACs were either a Soekris dac1541 or a Holo Spring KTE 3 (maybe both at different times, it's been a while) and neither is a resolution slouch, so a clear loss of resolution might have bothered me when the A2 got back, and I don't recall anything like that.
     
  17. Xecuter

    Xecuter Brush and floss your amp twice a day

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    @earnmyturns, @zonto
    I heard the two side by side for an AB comparison. I never bothered to own yggy1 personally because there was a known mismatch between the Yggdrasil 1 output and my EC studio input.
    Anyway, I'm not saying Yggdrasil A2 was a slouch with resolution, but I just felt yggy1 was slightly more forward and incisive. yggy2 is definitely warmer and better rounded product particularly with the bass but for me I felt the yggy1 in my demo edged out yggy2 in detail and engagement hence I placed it where I did. Chalk it up to synergy or personal preference but that's just how i felt.
     
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  18. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

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    It's also quite possible that my favorite musical genre, modern jazz, benefits especially from the A2 bass improvement, which make double bass more present and material. I keep struggling between that bass solidity on my headphone system(s), at the expense of some mid-muddle, and the somewhat more distant but superbly detailed and totally not muddled Linn speaker system in my living room.
     
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  19. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    Same here. Think my Maggies also benefit from the Analog 2 bass.

    Looking at the rest of @Xecuter's list, nothing else below the top 3 really appeals to me compared to the Yggdrasil. Drilling down into the top 3:
    • the MSB Select with upgrades retails for approximately $120,000. Automatically out on principle.
    • the Rockna I know is received favorably around here, but still costs as much as a used sedan. Don't see myself going this route.
    • the Bricasti units are certainly not cheap, but the M1 has been out for a while and resale value (and used prices) appears to have dropped somewhat with the release of the M12, M21, and M3 units.
    Yggdrasil still seems like the clear bang-for-the-buck play here. I mentioned earlier in the thread that my dealer recommended Bricasti to me and I might take him up on his offer to demo at some point. Just realized Bricasti is based in MA, which is cool. Wonder if they do tours? ;)
     
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    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
  20. Regular Petey

    Regular Petey Facebook Friend

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    The dCS Vivaldi with the master clock appears to be $95,000 list. I would assume that would it in the same category as the MSB Select, no?

    In some ways, I can't believe I spent $2099 on a Yggdrasil B-stock several years ago, although I have no regrets. My Unison card showed up today, so I'll basically have a Yggdrasil GS with the Unison upgrade. Anyone who can afford a DAC that costs nearly as much as my Honda Fit, if not considerably more, I'm happy for them, but I just shake my head.
     
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